5 ms·

Of course I would, since they already do. Whatever I submit is checked by them anyway, and it's generally too expensive and painful to challenge them. So…why d

by wtbob 12y ago

Of course I would, since they already do. Whatever I submit is checked by them anyway, and it's generally too expensive and painful to challenge them. So…why do I have to pay the Intuit tax every year?

fnordfnordfnord 12y ago
>So…why do I have to pay the Intuit tax every year? Because you choose to?
- a3n 12y ago
  Because Intuit bribes, er contributes to, Congress.
  - exhilaration 12y ago
    How the Maker of TurboTax Fought Free, Simple Tax Filing http://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-maker-of-turbotax-fought-free-simple-tax-filing http://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-maker-of-turbotax-...
  - fnordfnordfnord 12y ago
    Intuit is obviously a parasite, but do you have to use their products?
    - a3n 12y ago
      I don't use their products, but gosh darnit they still keep bribing Congress.
guan 12y ago
In my country (Denmark) it has now become much easier to file taxes, and most taxpayers don’t need to do anything at all if the government prepared return does not need changes. Even before it became that easy, it was always possible to get a so-called “R75” statement before filing. R75 contains all the information that the tax authority has on you for a given tax year, including all filings from employers, banks, stock brokers, lenders, etc. That way it was easy to see if you missed anything and to double check the return. (Today R75 is easily available online.) IRS has a lot of information from W-2 and 1099 filings, but it’s not possible to quickly and easily get that. A FOIA or Privacy Act request would probably not be processed in time to be useful for a tax return, and it might raise suspicion. Mailing all the reported information to taxpayers, without pre-filling a tax return, would be a good first step to making tax time easier in the US.
Shivetya 12y ago
Well they don't check them when you submit them as they don't have all the information at the same time you do. Your W2 by law must be sent to you by the end of January I believe, however delivery to the IRS is not required by the same date. As such fraud creeps in. You pay Inuit because there are nearly eighty thousand pages of tax law that even IRS workers cannot properly comprehend all because politicians use the IRS as a political tool to benefit those they like and punish those they don't. Hence why any attempt to overhaul the tax process is quickly denounced by supposed neutral groups; groups at the beck and call of powerful political interest. There is an entire FUD industry built to keep the current system to benefit of the political class and those well off enough to pay them.
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  Intuit doesn't know tax law better than IRS workers, they just spend lots of money lobbying Congress to prevent simplified filing processes. Intuit is one if the powerful political interests you refer to, an integral part of the FUD system you talk about built to keep the current system as-is for their own benefit.
  - Shivetya 12y ago
    Wait till you try to figure taxes on employee stock purchases that you do through payroll deductions. I could not get a straight answer even from the IRS, to the point some told me to track each share back to its original purchase price and fill a form per affected shares. When you call and get a different answer each time it screams that the system is to complex. Intuit is a convenient fall guy and nothing more. The real threat is that if the system were simpler and more open it could not be used to political advantage.
vonmoltke 12y ago
No, they don't. They don't know how much I paid in sales tax, property tax, or mortgage interest. They don't know how much I donated to various charities. They don't know how much I made from cash jobs. They don't know how much my small side business made or lost. There are a whole slew of variables the IRS doesn't know until I tell them, and that they take my word for until and unless I get audited.
- Alphasite_ 12y ago
  And thats why you can do it your self. Forcing everyone to perform a repetitive task which can be easly automated (for 90% of people) is not a sensible default to take.
  - vonmoltke 12y ago
    According to another post by someone who actually worked tax prep[1], it's more like 30%. In light of that and the delay in the IRS receiving the information from other parties, it does seem like a reasonable default. The real problem is that the US tax code is horribly, unnecessarily complicated. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9381067 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9381067
- pktgen 12y ago
  Most taxpayers don't have enough deductions to itemize, cash jobs, or side business income. You'd still have the option to file a return if there's additional income or deductions the IRS doesn't know about. Also, I believe mortgage interest is reported to the IRS.
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  They actually do know many of those things--e.g., mortgage interest you get in a 1098 is also filed with the IRS. There is no reason the IRS couldn't pre-prepare returns based on what is already required to be filled with them and precomputed taxes based on them, and still provide you the option of providing additional data. It would be easier for those work no additional info but also for those who needed to put some additional info, as a lot of the work that needs done now would already be done. Well, there is a reason, and is that tax preparation software and services companies spend lots of money lobbying Congress to keep the existing system since simplified filing would kill much of their business.

by wtbob 12y ago

fnordfnordfnord 12y ago

>So…why do I have to pay the Intuit tax every year? Because you choose to?

a3n 12y ago
Because Intuit bribes, er contributes to, Congress.
- exhilaration 12y ago
  How the Maker of TurboTax Fought Free, Simple Tax Filing http://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-maker-of-turbotax-fought-free-simple-tax-filing http://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-maker-of-turbotax-...
- fnordfnordfnord 12y ago
  Intuit is obviously a parasite, but do you have to use their products?
  - a3n 12y ago
    I don't use their products, but gosh darnit they still keep bribing Congress.

guan 12y ago

In my country (Denmark) it has now become much easier to file taxes, and most taxpayers don’t need to do anything at all if the government prepared return does not need changes. Even before it became that easy, it was always possible to get a so-called “R75” statement before filing. R75 contains all the information that the tax authority has on you for a given tax year, including all filings from employers, banks, stock brokers, lenders, etc. That way it was easy to see if you missed anything and to double check the return. (Today R75 is easily available online.) IRS has a lot of information from W-2 and 1099 filings, but it’s not possible to quickly and easily get that. A FOIA or Privacy Act request would probably not be processed in time to be useful for a tax return, and it might raise suspicion. Mailing all the reported information to taxpayers, without pre-filling a tax return, would be a good first step to making tax time easier in the US.

Shivetya 12y ago

Well they don't check them when you submit them as they don't have all the information at the same time you do. Your W2 by law must be sent to you by the end of January I believe, however delivery to the IRS is not required by the same date. As such fraud creeps in. You pay Inuit because there are nearly eighty thousand pages of tax law that even IRS workers cannot properly comprehend all because politicians use the IRS as a political tool to benefit those they like and punish those they don't. Hence why any attempt to overhaul the tax process is quickly denounced by supposed neutral groups; groups at the beck and call of powerful political interest. There is an entire FUD industry built to keep the current system to benefit of the political class and those well off enough to pay them.

dragonwriter 12y ago
Intuit doesn't know tax law better than IRS workers, they just spend lots of money lobbying Congress to prevent simplified filing processes. Intuit is one if the powerful political interests you refer to, an integral part of the FUD system you talk about built to keep the current system as-is for their own benefit.
- Shivetya 12y ago
  Wait till you try to figure taxes on employee stock purchases that you do through payroll deductions. I could not get a straight answer even from the IRS, to the point some told me to track each share back to its original purchase price and fill a form per affected shares. When you call and get a different answer each time it screams that the system is to complex. Intuit is a convenient fall guy and nothing more. The real threat is that if the system were simpler and more open it could not be used to political advantage.

vonmoltke 12y ago

No, they don't. They don't know how much I paid in sales tax, property tax, or mortgage interest. They don't know how much I donated to various charities. They don't know how much I made from cash jobs. They don't know how much my small side business made or lost. There are a whole slew of variables the IRS doesn't know until I tell them, and that they take my word for until and unless I get audited.

Alphasite_ 12y ago
And thats why you can do it your self. Forcing everyone to perform a repetitive task which can be easly automated (for 90% of people) is not a sensible default to take.
- vonmoltke 12y ago
  According to another post by someone who actually worked tax prep[1], it's more like 30%. In light of that and the delay in the IRS receiving the information from other parties, it does seem like a reasonable default. The real problem is that the US tax code is horribly, unnecessarily complicated. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9381067 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9381067
pktgen 12y ago
Most taxpayers don't have enough deductions to itemize, cash jobs, or side business income. You'd still have the option to file a return if there's additional income or deductions the IRS doesn't know about. Also, I believe mortgage interest is reported to the IRS.
dragonwriter 12y ago
They actually do know many of those things--e.g., mortgage interest you get in a 1098 is also filed with the IRS. There is no reason the IRS couldn't pre-prepare returns based on what is already required to be filled with them and precomputed taxes based on them, and still provide you the option of providing additional data. It would be easier for those work no additional info but also for those who needed to put some additional info, as a lot of the work that needs done now would already be done. Well, there is a reason, and is that tax preparation software and services companies spend lots of money lobbying Congress to keep the existing system since simplified filing would kill much of their business.