4 ms·

be careful what you wish for -- allowing use of nsa recorded phone conversations for non-terrorist crimes means they set a precedent for using those recordings

be careful what you wish for -- allowing use of nsa recorded phone conversations for non-terrorist crimes means they set a precedent for using those recordings against any citizen for any infraction, no matter how minor. there is a good reason we DON'T accept the use of warrantlessly obtained phone recordings in bulk (at least not yet).

flippant 12y ago
I don't think he's advocating for warrant-less wiretapping.
- fsk 12y ago
  That information can be collected without an illegal search warrant. The phone companies are required to keep call records for at least several years. I tell the IRS investigator that I got such a call, and now they request the records from the phone company.
learnstats2 12y ago
If my personal data must be collected, I should be able to use it for my personal benefit.
saraid216 12y ago
I always appreciate it when you guys are honest about your willingness to let people get hurt for the sake of principle.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- feybay 12y ago
  Yep, I'd rather some people get scammed than my rights be further violated.
- thaumasiotes 12y ago
  Think about the alternative. If you're not willing to let anyone get hurt for the sake of principle, the only principle you can ever hold is "don't ever let anyone get hurt for any reason, no matter what". In the first place, that's impossible. In the second, the more you attempt to force people not to get hurt, the worse off you make everyone's lives. We can't all live shut in padded rooms.
  - saraid216 12y ago
    Indeed. This is an excellent explanation of exactly how fundamentalism works: everything must reduce and cohere down to a particular set of principles, rather than reacting and adapting to reality with an understanding that the present understanding of morality isn't fixed and is subject to change. Once you pick a line in the sand you will not budge over, you have maimed your capacity for reason. So yes, the only principle I could ever hold is an impossible one. Fortunately, I do not hold it.
kevinchen 12y ago
It's pretty easy to reach these guys without wiretapping...just like the Windows virus scammers, you can find a friend who has been called by them, get the number, and pretend to be a victim.

flippant 12y ago

I don't think he's advocating for warrant-less wiretapping.

fsk 12y ago
That information can be collected without an illegal search warrant. The phone companies are required to keep call records for at least several years. I tell the IRS investigator that I got such a call, and now they request the records from the phone company.

learnstats2 12y ago

If my personal data must be collected, I should be able to use it for my personal benefit.

saraid216 12y ago

I always appreciate it when you guys are honest about your willingness to let people get hurt for the sake of principle.

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
feybay 12y ago
Yep, I'd rather some people get scammed than my rights be further violated.
thaumasiotes 12y ago
Think about the alternative. If you're not willing to let anyone get hurt for the sake of principle, the only principle you can ever hold is "don't ever let anyone get hurt for any reason, no matter what". In the first place, that's impossible. In the second, the more you attempt to force people not to get hurt, the worse off you make everyone's lives. We can't all live shut in padded rooms.
- saraid216 12y ago
  Indeed. This is an excellent explanation of exactly how fundamentalism works: everything must reduce and cohere down to a particular set of principles, rather than reacting and adapting to reality with an understanding that the present understanding of morality isn't fixed and is subject to change. Once you pick a line in the sand you will not budge over, you have maimed your capacity for reason. So yes, the only principle I could ever hold is an impossible one. Fortunately, I do not hold it.

kevinchen 12y ago

It's pretty easy to reach these guys without wiretapping...just like the Windows virus scammers, you can find a friend who has been called by them, get the number, and pretend to be a victim.