17 ms·

I think you nailed the real problem, which is that people have become so quick to write off anyone who ruffles their feathers at all. Drew Houston describes th

by staunch 12y ago

I think you nailed the real problem, which is that people have become so quick to write off anyone who ruffles their feathers at all. Drew Houston describes the HN feedback he received for Dropbox as all the motivation he needed to keep going. He also explained that he knew it was a hit because of how many people were saying negative things. Today though, any truly critical comment means you're either a hater or a troll. Every person is either a friend or an enemy. Inside the club or outside the club. You can't sincerely like something, and also be very critical about aspects of it, without instantly transforming into a jealous hater. Assuming the worst about other people is probably the most negative thing you can do. Everyone is a mixed bag.

kelukelugames 12y ago
Sometimes I like to ask a lot of critical questions because I care and I really like it. Other times because I'm trying to rip it to shreds. It's probably impossible to tell for someone online which mode I am in.
Udo 12y ago
I would like to say though that as someone who occasionally makes things, I do appreciate proper critique and I do like to hear about different view points. Voicing legitimate and non-pedantic disagreement in a polite manner is to me one of the major features HN offers, simply because it's a collection of interesting people. Myself, I don't always agree with the majority opinion either. For example, I disagree with Sam's opinion about AGI, and even though that particular comment was received quite badly, I never meant it to be anything else but an invitation to see things from another perspective.
mreiland 12y ago
> I think you nailed the real problem, which is that people have become so quick to write off anyone who ruffles their feathers at all. I'm quick to write off people and I won't apologize for it. I have better things to do with my time than to give everyone the same amount of time and respect. If HN has decided to be touchy feely than this most certainly isn't the place for me. I prefer actual discourse where bullshit opinions are called out as such. edit: shit you guys, can't you go with the reading my comment charitably or will you hit that downvote button again, thereby showing your hypocrisy? I love the internet, I really do.
- deleted 12y ago
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- cpayne 12y ago
  (For me) the kicker in your response was: than to give everyone the same amount of time and respect Who then, is worth of your time and/or respect? What is your criteria? Fine by me to have your opinion. But at least be able to back it up with some substance.
  - mreiland 12y ago
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ017D_JOPY&t=3m15s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ017D_JOPY&t=3m15s But I honestly fall into the other camp that believes respect should be given freely. BUT that lasts until you open your mouth and say something stupid. I've had "discussions" with people about whether or not MAtz Ruby had a GIL. You don't get my respect for holding that opinion and I have better things to do with my time than worry about your feelings. There's a clear difference between someone with a differing opinion and someone with a flawed thought process. I'm ok with a person telling me C++ is the most horrible thing since sliced bread despite my love for the language. I'm not ok with someone telling me allocation/deallocation in C++ is slower than C# because some article on the internet talked about allocation without going into the cost of deallocation. One of those is understandable, the other is flat out wrong and if you choose to hold to that opinion then you're going to get dismissed as someone whose thought process is too faulty to trust. And I have better things to do with my time.
    - ZenoArrow 12y ago
      Rather than getting yourself wound up with faulty thinking over something that's clearly wrong, is it not just better to show them the facts? It's quicker than arguing too.
      - mreiland 12y ago
        Do you seriously think someone who dismisses people so quickly gets wound up about it? The entire point of dismissing them is to avoid wasting time on them, what in the world gives you the impression I'm getting emotional about it? To answer your question, I'm 36 years old. I've been online for a quite a while. It took me a lot of years but I did eventually learn the lesson. On the internet people are never wrong and even citing sources gets you drug into yet another stupid conversation you don't want to be involved in. I didn't invent the idea of "don't argue with stupid people, they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience". But I wholeheartedly agree with it.
david927 12y ago
he knew it was a hit because of how many people were saying negative things Most get negative reviews, few are hits. The irony is that I've seen that thread and I thought it was generally well-received.

by staunch 12y ago

kelukelugames 12y ago

Sometimes I like to ask a lot of critical questions because I care and I really like it. Other times because I'm trying to rip it to shreds. It's probably impossible to tell for someone online which mode I am in.

Udo 12y ago

I would like to say though that as someone who occasionally makes things, I do appreciate proper critique and I do like to hear about different view points. Voicing legitimate and non-pedantic disagreement in a polite manner is to me one of the major features HN offers, simply because it's a collection of interesting people. Myself, I don't always agree with the majority opinion either. For example, I disagree with Sam's opinion about AGI, and even though that particular comment was received quite badly, I never meant it to be anything else but an invitation to see things from another perspective.

mreiland 12y ago

> I think you nailed the real problem, which is that people have become so quick to write off anyone who ruffles their feathers at all. I'm quick to write off people and I won't apologize for it. I have better things to do with my time than to give everyone the same amount of time and respect. If HN has decided to be touchy feely than this most certainly isn't the place for me. I prefer actual discourse where bullshit opinions are called out as such. edit: shit you guys, can't you go with the reading my comment charitably or will you hit that downvote button again, thereby showing your hypocrisy? I love the internet, I really do.

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
cpayne 12y ago
(For me) the kicker in your response was: than to give everyone the same amount of time and respect Who then, is worth of your time and/or respect? What is your criteria? Fine by me to have your opinion. But at least be able to back it up with some substance.
- mreiland 12y ago
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ017D_JOPY&t=3m15s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ017D_JOPY&t=3m15s But I honestly fall into the other camp that believes respect should be given freely. BUT that lasts until you open your mouth and say something stupid. I've had "discussions" with people about whether or not MAtz Ruby had a GIL. You don't get my respect for holding that opinion and I have better things to do with my time than worry about your feelings. There's a clear difference between someone with a differing opinion and someone with a flawed thought process. I'm ok with a person telling me C++ is the most horrible thing since sliced bread despite my love for the language. I'm not ok with someone telling me allocation/deallocation in C++ is slower than C# because some article on the internet talked about allocation without going into the cost of deallocation. One of those is understandable, the other is flat out wrong and if you choose to hold to that opinion then you're going to get dismissed as someone whose thought process is too faulty to trust. And I have better things to do with my time.
  - ZenoArrow 12y ago
    Rather than getting yourself wound up with faulty thinking over something that's clearly wrong, is it not just better to show them the facts? It's quicker than arguing too.
    - mreiland 12y ago
      Do you seriously think someone who dismisses people so quickly gets wound up about it? The entire point of dismissing them is to avoid wasting time on them, what in the world gives you the impression I'm getting emotional about it? To answer your question, I'm 36 years old. I've been online for a quite a while. It took me a lot of years but I did eventually learn the lesson. On the internet people are never wrong and even citing sources gets you drug into yet another stupid conversation you don't want to be involved in. I didn't invent the idea of "don't argue with stupid people, they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience". But I wholeheartedly agree with it.

david927 12y ago

he knew it was a hit because of how many people were saying negative things Most get negative reviews, few are hits. The irony is that I've seen that thread and I thought it was generally well-received.