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> Bitpesa exist undercutting remittance Bitpesa takes 3%, significantly more than a credit card transaction, and much more than many established low-risk remit

> Bitpesa exist undercutting remittance Bitpesa takes 3%, significantly more than a credit card transaction, and much more than many established low-risk remittance corridors (e.g. Arabian Peninsula -> India/Pakistan, Europe -> Central America, are all under 1%). True, many remittance flows can be 9% or more, but that's because they have significant levels of fraud, and the overhead of KYC regulation. Ignoring fraud and regulations means you can reduce fees, obviously. > merchant processors like Coinbase all undercut any creditcard Coinbase charges 1% to buy, and another 1% to sell, and users are responsible for all bitcoin transaction fees. This revenue means that it can charge nothing for coinbase -> coinbase transfers; however nearly all financial institutions charge nothing for intra-bank transfers. > companies like Microsoft accept bitcoin and keep more profits About 0% of Microsoft's revenues are in Bitcoin, this increases Microsoft profits by about 0%. Accepting Bitcoin is a marketing expense, not about increasing profits.

IkmoIkmo 12y ago
> Bitpesa takes 3% Here's an example of remitting money to Kenya between various services: http://remittanceprices.worldbank.org/en/corridor/Canada/Kenya http://remittanceprices.worldbank.org/en/corridor/Canada/Ken... Bitpesa is a Kenyan remittance company after all. > Coinbase charges 1% to buy, and another 1% to sell Coinbase costs 1% to process, period. It's cheaper for a merchant than the 3% of a CC, Stripe, Paypal, Square etc. If you want to look at the consumer side, that's a different story. You tend to conflate things in your arguments. It's not required to buy from Coinbase to spend at a Coinbase merchant. I've been paid in bitcoin at 0% fees, and I've bought bitcoin at Circle at 0% fees. > About 0% of Microsoft's revenues are in Bitcoin, this increases Microsoft profits by about 0%. Accepting Bitcoin is a marketing expense, not about increasing profits. Stupid. First of all, quote my entire sentence. Secondly, it's easy to show you a ton of examples that were once small, but became significant. The internet was 0% of revenue for many companies once, where it's now extremely significant. It's not an argument to say something is small, therefore lacking any potential to be or become meaningful. One of its core characteristics is that it's cheaper. If you can cut costs as a merchant by 3% by using Bitpay (0% Saas) versus say Stripe (3% ish), that's massive when you have 3% profit margins like most supermarkets, airlines, a lot of retail etc. You can double profits on any sale. Does that mean bitcoin is a massive game changer today? Of course not, but again to ridicule it is as silly as to say the Internet is shit in 1995 because barely any calls, mail, ecommerce, education etc ran on it. Fact is, any sale Microsoft makes with Bitcoin is more profitable than otherwise, and that's not an insignificant fact despite the small scale of bitcoin sales.
- Locke1689 12y ago
  Microsoft does not accept Bitcoin -- BitPay accepts bitcoin and Microsoft accepts dollars.
  - IkmoIkmo 12y ago
    Irrelevant for the point that was made on cheaper transactions. If Microsoft had accepted the payment in any other way it'd have left them with less profits on that particular transaction. It's relevant when talking about e.g. bitcoin as a store of value, but that topic wasn't raised. On that topic you could say that accepting bitcoin and buying a derivative to hedge, a bit like Bitreserve or Coinapult locks, would allow you to transact and store bitcoin, immune to bitcoin's volatility, yet cheaper than your average 3% Paypal, Stripe, Square or Creditcard transaction. Beyond that, it's merely semantics.

IkmoIkmo 12y ago

> Bitpesa takes 3% Here's an example of remitting money to Kenya between various services: http://remittanceprices.worldbank.org/en/corridor/Canada/Kenya http://remittanceprices.worldbank.org/en/corridor/Canada/Ken... Bitpesa is a Kenyan remittance company after all. > Coinbase charges 1% to buy, and another 1% to sell Coinbase costs 1% to process, period. It's cheaper for a merchant than the 3% of a CC, Stripe, Paypal, Square etc. If you want to look at the consumer side, that's a different story. You tend to conflate things in your arguments. It's not required to buy from Coinbase to spend at a Coinbase merchant. I've been paid in bitcoin at 0% fees, and I've bought bitcoin at Circle at 0% fees. > About 0% of Microsoft's revenues are in Bitcoin, this increases Microsoft profits by about 0%. Accepting Bitcoin is a marketing expense, not about increasing profits. Stupid. First of all, quote my entire sentence. Secondly, it's easy to show you a ton of examples that were once small, but became significant. The internet was 0% of revenue for many companies once, where it's now extremely significant. It's not an argument to say something is small, therefore lacking any potential to be or become meaningful. One of its core characteristics is that it's cheaper. If you can cut costs as a merchant by 3% by using Bitpay (0% Saas) versus say Stripe (3% ish), that's massive when you have 3% profit margins like most supermarkets, airlines, a lot of retail etc. You can double profits on any sale. Does that mean bitcoin is a massive game changer today? Of course not, but again to ridicule it is as silly as to say the Internet is shit in 1995 because barely any calls, mail, ecommerce, education etc ran on it. Fact is, any sale Microsoft makes with Bitcoin is more profitable than otherwise, and that's not an insignificant fact despite the small scale of bitcoin sales.

Locke1689 12y ago
Microsoft does not accept Bitcoin -- BitPay accepts bitcoin and Microsoft accepts dollars.
- IkmoIkmo 12y ago
  Irrelevant for the point that was made on cheaper transactions. If Microsoft had accepted the payment in any other way it'd have left them with less profits on that particular transaction. It's relevant when talking about e.g. bitcoin as a store of value, but that topic wasn't raised. On that topic you could say that accepting bitcoin and buying a derivative to hedge, a bit like Bitreserve or Coinapult locks, would allow you to transact and store bitcoin, immune to bitcoin's volatility, yet cheaper than your average 3% Paypal, Stripe, Square or Creditcard transaction. Beyond that, it's merely semantics.