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> "there are some of them ... that puts them off or they have doubts." On the other hand, Ziring says, the Snowden leaks have sparked other students' interest.

by bhauer 12y ago

> "there are some of them ... that puts them off or they have doubts." On the other hand, Ziring says, the Snowden leaks have sparked other students' interest. "[They say], 'I actually know some of what you do now, and that's really cool and I want to come do that." I don't buy this. I find it just short of impossible that anyone is looking at the leaks and saying, "Yes, I want to be part of your wholesale abrogation of the Fourth Amendment. I used to think you were just a spy agency, but now I know you're the Information Nomenklatura and I want in!"

rdtsc 12y ago
This is not to be underestimated. Obviously patriotism devotion to country and Constitution was very much desirable for recruits. The problem is a few of those patriots actually believe in the Constitution which at this point would make them quite dangerous. They would need to be filtered out and/or continuously brainwashed and monitored. "We want you to be patriotic, but not too much, just enough to swallow our brainwashing". The problem is it attracts undesirable people. They already have tons of polygraphs which accept either extremely honest people, or psychopaths. This will attract people who would have been happy working for the Stasi, SS or KGB -- particularly vile authoritarian types. Remember that even during the unpopular wars the military attracted people who just wanted to play with guns and kill other people. Same with police force. Bullies from high-school grow up want to keep bullying but they can do it within the law.
- pluma 12y ago
  So they want redneck patriotism, basically?
  - shitlord 12y ago
    Yeah, pretty much. The two guys I know who worked at the NSA were both rednecks.
- jacquesm 12y ago
  > The problem is a few of those patriots actually believe in the Constitution which at this point would make them quite dangerous. That's exactly the bracket I fit Snowden into.
vonmoltke 12y ago
Why? I can believe that there are a significant minority of people who genuinely believe they have nothing to hide and that the Fourth Amendment protections go too far. I find it very disturbing, but they do exist in sufficient numbers to support the machinery that executes these things. I used to work with some of them.

by bhauer 12y ago

rdtsc 12y ago

This is not to be underestimated. Obviously patriotism devotion to country and Constitution was very much desirable for recruits. The problem is a few of those patriots actually believe in the Constitution which at this point would make them quite dangerous. They would need to be filtered out and/or continuously brainwashed and monitored. "We want you to be patriotic, but not too much, just enough to swallow our brainwashing". The problem is it attracts undesirable people. They already have tons of polygraphs which accept either extremely honest people, or psychopaths. This will attract people who would have been happy working for the Stasi, SS or KGB -- particularly vile authoritarian types. Remember that even during the unpopular wars the military attracted people who just wanted to play with guns and kill other people. Same with police force. Bullies from high-school grow up want to keep bullying but they can do it within the law.

pluma 12y ago
So they want redneck patriotism, basically?
- shitlord 12y ago
  Yeah, pretty much. The two guys I know who worked at the NSA were both rednecks.
jacquesm 12y ago
> The problem is a few of those patriots actually believe in the Constitution which at this point would make them quite dangerous. That's exactly the bracket I fit Snowden into.

vonmoltke 12y ago

Why? I can believe that there are a significant minority of people who genuinely believe they have nothing to hide and that the Fourth Amendment protections go too far. I find it very disturbing, but they do exist in sufficient numbers to support the machinery that executes these things. I used to work with some of them.