5 ms·

Tipping can be an excuse to build a really nice win-win relationship. I have a few local restaurants I frequent where I tip the servers well, 20% rounded up to

Tipping can be an excuse to build a really nice win-win relationship. I have a few local restaurants I frequent where I tip the servers well, 20% rounded up to the nearest dollar to start. They know me by name. They know what I like to eat. They'll recommend food and drink and off-menu options based on what they've learned about me. I get free food and samples, conversation, and a general feeling of being a part of the community. With tipping I view my server as my agent. They're their to help me and I'm going to pay them well for that help. Without tips, or in chain restaurants where the staff turns over frequently and that relationship is harder to establish, I miss the partnership and the experience.

inanutshellus 12y ago
That'd happen entirely based on your demeanor and their recognition of you becoming a "regular", even in a world without tips. Also, the problem with your "i'm a good boy because I tip 20%" just got downgraded to "meh". Gone to a Chili's recently? They default you to 20%, and use this clumsy poorly-reactive slider to change it. And you feel like an asshole for doing so anyway. You want to be seen as a good tipper now? Time to cough up another 10%.
- KevinEldon 12y ago
  What I want is to create a mutually beneficial business relationship with someone. Loyalty and my demeanor definitely help, but tips are the proof that I'm providing some value too (as charming as I am, the few extra bucks the server knows they'll get from me does matter). Chili's is a chain restaurant. I've been there, but don't enjoy it enough to want to go regularly and so establishing a relationship there doesn't make a lot of sense for me. Although I do typically tip 20% when I eat there I'd prefer to not tip at all and would rather just order my food from the machine and have someone bring it to me. Chili's knows this and is positioned to cut their wait staff drastically if minimum wage was required for service staff or if they find that people are comfortable working with the machine directly.
treehau5 12y ago
This is really important to understand that people often miss. Tipping to me is way more than just some subjective criteria that I use to judge whether or not a server "deserves" a certain percentage. Maybe your service at that particular night was off. Sorry to hear that. Here is why you should still leave at least a decent tip. 1. Word will spread around the wait staff that you are a good tipper, even if the particular bad server you happened to receive that night didn't spread it -- other servers will take note: "Wow, even Josh got 15% from that guy" 2. Once Word spreads, that's when the preferential treatment starts. Stronger drinks, larger portions on your side items, extra samples. You always want to establish a relationship at your favorite restaurant. Get to know the managers. They love regulars, and then next time, even they will make sure your service is 100%. It really is a win-win.
- usrusr 12y ago
  "Stronger drinks, larger portions on your side items, extra samples." I'd be interested to hear where exactly you'd want to draw the line to bribery. Also, i'm pretty sure that the mechanisms of being a regular are working just as well in countries without a tipping tradition. (I live in a sometimes-tip country and I have experienced the best service in a neighboring no-tip country)
  - treehau5 12y ago
    First of all, to equate what I said to bribery would mean you have to make the assumption that I am tipping higher _in expectation_ of receiving these things. I don't. Tipping higher provides economic incentive to the server to perform at a higher level for me and whatever guests I bring. And actually it is not bribery, restaurants are alloted to give certain guests freebies to either keep them coming back, or to enhance their experience -- whether it be giving you a free dessert, or other low cost/high yield item off the menu such as side items, or offering you a "unreleased" beverage sample or maybe going out of their way to make a particular item they no longer carry. But besides all of that, I tip higher out of my own virtue, because I worked as a server/bartender for 8 years, so I understand what they go through.
  - KevinEldon 12y ago
throwaway7767 12y ago
I have the same kind of relationship you describe with the people working at local businesses, and I live in a country where tipping is very much not the norm. We know each other by name, they know what I want, and back when I went for lunch at the same place every day they would have my burger ready for me when I got there without me ever asking. Humans are social creatures, and they will create social relationships. No money needs to change hands for this to happen.
- narrowrail 12y ago
  While that's great to hear, the culture in the US is just different. And, it is a part of the culture that you can't just stop overnight. I live in a town that lives off of tips (tourist oriented) and the people I know in the service industry make ~half their income from tips.
antr 12y ago
I don't understand how a restaurant employer-employee relationship differs from any other job. From your stand point, what's stopping other industries (for argument sake, airlines telling air hostess) to tell their employees to ask for tips for good service? If restaurants paid a decent salary to their employees, and made them less dependable on tips, employees would feel safer, face less anxiety ("hey, I can make a good living without begging for money to clients!"), and would allow them to focus on their job.
- KevinEldon 12y ago
  Tips are not begging any more then putting a price on a menu is begging; just because a price is not fixed up front doesn't make it begging. I think restaurants are different in that the interaction is more frequent and personal than most other industries. It also seems like a very fluid job market where servers can change employers with minimal cost to themselves.
  - antr 12y ago
    I can list dozens of jobs that are "more frequent and personal" than waiters: cashiers, nurses, bus drivers, cleaners, etc. So again, I don't understand how a restaurant employer-employee relationship differs from any other job. > It also seems like a very fluid job market where servers can change employers with minimal cost to themselves. I've never heard servers talk about the fluidity of the job market, I don't know where this oberservation comes from. I'm trying to be objective here, but I don't understand how the rest of the world (Europe is a great example) can work without a tip system, and in the US this tipping system is indispensable. As a university student I used to work at a pub, I did this for two years. I did it because I wanted to make some extra money. I think I was paid £5.20/hour (this was back in 2003-04). I never got tipped, and never felt I should have. I did the job to the best of my abilities (pouring pints, cleaning tables, and washing dishes) and tried to have fun with everyone. The pub ran like clockwork, half of all customers I would consider regulars, and service was superb (I might be biased). The same as any other regular pub. I couldn't have taken the job if I wasn't sure that I was going to get paid X/hour, I didn't want a "fluid job market", but I wanted a steady regular income for the job they hired me for.

inanutshellus 12y ago

That'd happen entirely based on your demeanor and their recognition of you becoming a "regular", even in a world without tips. Also, the problem with your "i'm a good boy because I tip 20%" just got downgraded to "meh". Gone to a Chili's recently? They default you to 20%, and use this clumsy poorly-reactive slider to change it. And you feel like an asshole for doing so anyway. You want to be seen as a good tipper now? Time to cough up another 10%.

KevinEldon 12y ago
What I want is to create a mutually beneficial business relationship with someone. Loyalty and my demeanor definitely help, but tips are the proof that I'm providing some value too (as charming as I am, the few extra bucks the server knows they'll get from me does matter). Chili's is a chain restaurant. I've been there, but don't enjoy it enough to want to go regularly and so establishing a relationship there doesn't make a lot of sense for me. Although I do typically tip 20% when I eat there I'd prefer to not tip at all and would rather just order my food from the machine and have someone bring it to me. Chili's knows this and is positioned to cut their wait staff drastically if minimum wage was required for service staff or if they find that people are comfortable working with the machine directly.

treehau5 12y ago

This is really important to understand that people often miss. Tipping to me is way more than just some subjective criteria that I use to judge whether or not a server "deserves" a certain percentage. Maybe your service at that particular night was off. Sorry to hear that. Here is why you should still leave at least a decent tip. 1. Word will spread around the wait staff that you are a good tipper, even if the particular bad server you happened to receive that night didn't spread it -- other servers will take note: "Wow, even Josh got 15% from that guy" 2. Once Word spreads, that's when the preferential treatment starts. Stronger drinks, larger portions on your side items, extra samples. You always want to establish a relationship at your favorite restaurant. Get to know the managers. They love regulars, and then next time, even they will make sure your service is 100%. It really is a win-win.

usrusr 12y ago
"Stronger drinks, larger portions on your side items, extra samples." I'd be interested to hear where exactly you'd want to draw the line to bribery. Also, i'm pretty sure that the mechanisms of being a regular are working just as well in countries without a tipping tradition. (I live in a sometimes-tip country and I have experienced the best service in a neighboring no-tip country)
- treehau5 12y ago
  First of all, to equate what I said to bribery would mean you have to make the assumption that I am tipping higher _in expectation_ of receiving these things. I don't. Tipping higher provides economic incentive to the server to perform at a higher level for me and whatever guests I bring. And actually it is not bribery, restaurants are alloted to give certain guests freebies to either keep them coming back, or to enhance their experience -- whether it be giving you a free dessert, or other low cost/high yield item off the menu such as side items, or offering you a "unreleased" beverage sample or maybe going out of their way to make a particular item they no longer carry. But besides all of that, I tip higher out of my own virtue, because I worked as a server/bartender for 8 years, so I understand what they go through.
- KevinEldon 12y ago

throwaway7767 12y ago

I have the same kind of relationship you describe with the people working at local businesses, and I live in a country where tipping is very much not the norm. We know each other by name, they know what I want, and back when I went for lunch at the same place every day they would have my burger ready for me when I got there without me ever asking. Humans are social creatures, and they will create social relationships. No money needs to change hands for this to happen.

narrowrail 12y ago
While that's great to hear, the culture in the US is just different. And, it is a part of the culture that you can't just stop overnight. I live in a town that lives off of tips (tourist oriented) and the people I know in the service industry make ~half their income from tips.

antr 12y ago

I don't understand how a restaurant employer-employee relationship differs from any other job. From your stand point, what's stopping other industries (for argument sake, airlines telling air hostess) to tell their employees to ask for tips for good service? If restaurants paid a decent salary to their employees, and made them less dependable on tips, employees would feel safer, face less anxiety ("hey, I can make a good living without begging for money to clients!"), and would allow them to focus on their job.

KevinEldon 12y ago
Tips are not begging any more then putting a price on a menu is begging; just because a price is not fixed up front doesn't make it begging. I think restaurants are different in that the interaction is more frequent and personal than most other industries. It also seems like a very fluid job market where servers can change employers with minimal cost to themselves.
- antr 12y ago
  I can list dozens of jobs that are "more frequent and personal" than waiters: cashiers, nurses, bus drivers, cleaners, etc. So again, I don't understand how a restaurant employer-employee relationship differs from any other job. > It also seems like a very fluid job market where servers can change employers with minimal cost to themselves. I've never heard servers talk about the fluidity of the job market, I don't know where this oberservation comes from. I'm trying to be objective here, but I don't understand how the rest of the world (Europe is a great example) can work without a tip system, and in the US this tipping system is indispensable. As a university student I used to work at a pub, I did this for two years. I did it because I wanted to make some extra money. I think I was paid £5.20/hour (this was back in 2003-04). I never got tipped, and never felt I should have. I did the job to the best of my abilities (pouring pints, cleaning tables, and washing dishes) and tried to have fun with everyone. The pub ran like clockwork, half of all customers I would consider regulars, and service was superb (I might be biased). The same as any other regular pub. I couldn't have taken the job if I wasn't sure that I was going to get paid X/hour, I didn't want a "fluid job market", but I wanted a steady regular income for the job they hired me for.