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Sounds like the Administration/ Pentagon wants some sort of "SpaceX is good" certification, which is pretty much counter to everything military procurement is d

by panzagl 12y ago

Sounds like the Administration/ Pentagon wants some sort of "SpaceX is good" certification, which is pretty much counter to everything military procurement is designed to do. The process is designed to be resistant to outside political pressure. In this case it is bad, as SpaceX most likely has the technological ability to compete with incumbents. But I think we could all easily imagine opposite cases where caving to political pressure is bad. Of course the system isn't perfect, and politics still plays a major in role in program funding. But it could be worse.

tankenmate 12y ago
But when you see, for example, huge arguments over the fact that SpaceX doesn't do vertical integration and hence shouldn't be considered for certification, it does make you wonder.
- panzagl 12y ago
  Unfortunately vertical integration makes things hugely easier for the organization doing the certifying, and avoids the issue of two contractors blaming each other (and the gov't) when the integrated solution fails. It's a difficult problem that only gets made more so as visibility and pressure on the project increase.
  - seanflyon 12y ago
    I think that you are using a the more general meaning of vertical integration, but in this context it means putting the payload on the rocket while the rocket is standing upright and not on its side. SpaceX is dramatically more vertically integrated as a company than the ULA (their competitor for government launches).
joshstrange 12y ago
> Of course the system isn't perfect In EVERY instance of a company needing to get some sort of certification from the government for a job I've seen it's been so far from perfect that saying "system isn't perfect" isn't even a funny joke. It's HORRIBLY broken and results in incumbent companies getting contracts that they don't meet deadlines or budgets on yet continue to get new contracts because they are certified. Government procurement is total shit IMHO and needs to change badly. I don't even think "Well it take a long time (procurement processes) but it's safer/needed", from what I've seen it's not. It's a massive waste of time for everyone involved and does nothing to filter out the bad apples. It needs a massive overhaul so that we quit shoveling money into shit companies and start giving it to people who CAN do the job and do it well.

by panzagl 12y ago

tankenmate 12y ago

But when you see, for example, huge arguments over the fact that SpaceX doesn't do vertical integration and hence shouldn't be considered for certification, it does make you wonder.

panzagl 12y ago
Unfortunately vertical integration makes things hugely easier for the organization doing the certifying, and avoids the issue of two contractors blaming each other (and the gov't) when the integrated solution fails. It's a difficult problem that only gets made more so as visibility and pressure on the project increase.
- seanflyon 12y ago
  I think that you are using a the more general meaning of vertical integration, but in this context it means putting the payload on the rocket while the rocket is standing upright and not on its side. SpaceX is dramatically more vertically integrated as a company than the ULA (their competitor for government launches).

joshstrange 12y ago

> Of course the system isn't perfect In EVERY instance of a company needing to get some sort of certification from the government for a job I've seen it's been so far from perfect that saying "system isn't perfect" isn't even a funny joke. It's HORRIBLY broken and results in incumbent companies getting contracts that they don't meet deadlines or budgets on yet continue to get new contracts because they are certified. Government procurement is total shit IMHO and needs to change badly. I don't even think "Well it take a long time (procurement processes) but it's safer/needed", from what I've seen it's not. It's a massive waste of time for everyone involved and does nothing to filter out the bad apples. It needs a massive overhaul so that we quit shoveling money into shit companies and start giving it to people who CAN do the job and do it well.