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On page 263 of my large-print edition of the Isaacson biography of Steve Jobs, Jobs is quoted as saying about Bill Gates, "Bill is basically unimaginative and h

by jbapple 12y ago

On page 263 of my large-print edition of the Isaacson biography of Steve Jobs, Jobs is quoted as saying about Bill Gates, "Bill is basically unimaginative and has never invented anything, which is why I think he's more comfortable now in philanthropy than technology". I don't know about you, but I'd rather be unimaginative than fabulously, unimaginably rich but also selfish about it.

briandear 12y ago
Was Jobs selfish? Or did he just not use his charitable giving as a means of self promotion or legacy building? Fair question. We're assuming facts not in evidence.
- adevine 12y ago
  I definitely don't see what Gates and Buffet are doing as "legacy building" - if they wanted to build a "legacy", they would create some self sustaining "family foundation" that acted more like a social club than a charity. Instead, they are explicitly stating they want to give most of their money away while they are alive and all of it shortly thereafter.
- icebraining 12y ago
  http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Handicapped.txt&characters=Steve%20Jobs http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story...
- jbapple 12y ago
  I don't know what Jobs did with his money. I'm criticising his values, as described in this statement that clearly paints philanthropy as beneath him, to those of Cook. Maybe he gave money away even though he thought it was beneath him, but it's still disgraceful and loathsome to paint philanthropy as a pursuit of the small-minded.
  - 7Z7 12y ago
    >..clearly paints philanthropy as beneath him.. Wow, I did not get that from the quote.
    - adevine 12y ago
      "Bill is basically unimaginative and has never invented anything, which is why I think he's more comfortable now in philanthropy than technology" I certainly got from that that Jobs views philanthropy as the land of retirement for the unimaginative.
serve_yay 12y ago
How bizarre. Is there a point to this comment except to show that Steve Jobs was a dick?
- jbapple 12y ago
  Maybe you're right. I wanted to show the contrast in their values and highlight the fact that this is a noble act, and not one which everyone in Cook's shoes would take, but maybe I was just piling on Jobs.
  - serve_yay 12y ago
    I'm well aware that people here don't think much of him, so I'm used to it.
gress 12y ago
This is a false dichotomy. Bill Gates made his fortune and then retired before becoming a philantropist. Steve Jobs was still hard at work on building his company until a few months before he died. Who knows what he would have done if he had been able to live long enough to have a retirement.
- jbapple 12y ago
  In his statement, Jobs indicated that Gates's interest in philanthropy was because he had always been unimaginative. Forget, for a moment, the hypothetical of what Jobs would have done. Maybe he would have grown into someone who gave a single fuck about the poor, but in this statement, he called out that caring as beneath him. That's a value we should condemn, just as we should praise Cook for his stated intentions.
  - gress 12y ago
    > he called out that caring as beneath him. Sorry - you have made this up out of whole cloth. It's not what he said, and not a reasonable inference. By calling Gates unimaginative Jobs was referring to the fact that he didn't have any more ideas about how to advance the computing industry which is why he had left to do philanthropy. He wasn't criticizing Gates for caring, rather he was criticizing him for not having more to contribute to the industry.
    - jbapple 12y ago
      Here's what I think Jobs thought: "I am creative, so I stay in computing." "Gates isn't, so he left." "Leaving computing for philanthropy is for those who aren't as good as I am." Do you really read that statement differently? Do you not see it as honoring creativity over philanthropy?
      - gress 12y ago
        The first two of those statements do seem to be implied by the quote from Jobs, but the third seems like something you made up. What part of the quote justifies it?

by jbapple 12y ago

briandear 12y ago

Was Jobs selfish? Or did he just not use his charitable giving as a means of self promotion or legacy building? Fair question. We're assuming facts not in evidence.

adevine 12y ago
I definitely don't see what Gates and Buffet are doing as "legacy building" - if they wanted to build a "legacy", they would create some self sustaining "family foundation" that acted more like a social club than a charity. Instead, they are explicitly stating they want to give most of their money away while they are alive and all of it shortly thereafter.
icebraining 12y ago
http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Handicapped.txt&characters=Steve%20Jobs http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story...
jbapple 12y ago
I don't know what Jobs did with his money. I'm criticising his values, as described in this statement that clearly paints philanthropy as beneath him, to those of Cook. Maybe he gave money away even though he thought it was beneath him, but it's still disgraceful and loathsome to paint philanthropy as a pursuit of the small-minded.
- 7Z7 12y ago
  >..clearly paints philanthropy as beneath him.. Wow, I did not get that from the quote.
  - adevine 12y ago
    "Bill is basically unimaginative and has never invented anything, which is why I think he's more comfortable now in philanthropy than technology" I certainly got from that that Jobs views philanthropy as the land of retirement for the unimaginative.

serve_yay 12y ago

How bizarre. Is there a point to this comment except to show that Steve Jobs was a dick?

jbapple 12y ago
Maybe you're right. I wanted to show the contrast in their values and highlight the fact that this is a noble act, and not one which everyone in Cook's shoes would take, but maybe I was just piling on Jobs.
- serve_yay 12y ago
  I'm well aware that people here don't think much of him, so I'm used to it.

gress 12y ago

This is a false dichotomy. Bill Gates made his fortune and then retired before becoming a philantropist. Steve Jobs was still hard at work on building his company until a few months before he died. Who knows what he would have done if he had been able to live long enough to have a retirement.

jbapple 12y ago
In his statement, Jobs indicated that Gates's interest in philanthropy was because he had always been unimaginative. Forget, for a moment, the hypothetical of what Jobs would have done. Maybe he would have grown into someone who gave a single fuck about the poor, but in this statement, he called out that caring as beneath him. That's a value we should condemn, just as we should praise Cook for his stated intentions.
- gress 12y ago
  > he called out that caring as beneath him. Sorry - you have made this up out of whole cloth. It's not what he said, and not a reasonable inference. By calling Gates unimaginative Jobs was referring to the fact that he didn't have any more ideas about how to advance the computing industry which is why he had left to do philanthropy. He wasn't criticizing Gates for caring, rather he was criticizing him for not having more to contribute to the industry.
  - jbapple 12y ago
    Here's what I think Jobs thought: "I am creative, so I stay in computing." "Gates isn't, so he left." "Leaving computing for philanthropy is for those who aren't as good as I am." Do you really read that statement differently? Do you not see it as honoring creativity over philanthropy?
    - gress 12y ago
      The first two of those statements do seem to be implied by the quote from Jobs, but the third seems like something you made up. What part of the quote justifies it?