4 ms·

I would love to drive a diesel, but the choice is limited to mostly VW. There are no minivans in US market that run on Diesel and SUVs that run on diesel are ma

by sremani 12y ago

I would love to drive a diesel, but the choice is limited to mostly VW. There are no minivans in US market that run on Diesel and SUVs that run on diesel are marked about 4k+ compared to their gasoline cousins. The other thing is cost, Diesel costs more and if you factor the mileage/cost in most cases gasoline comes ahead. The beauty of Diesel engines is ability to run on Biodiesel, which is better than ethanol/gasoline flex-fuel engines which for whatever reason are popular (in terms of availability). All in all Europeans have tremendous choice with their Diesel vehicles, Americans do not. It is egg and chicken problem. I think on top of it there is some Diesel pollution related regulation, which is stringent in US than in Europe, preventing car manufacturers simply moving around European Diesel models to US. edit: mostly german manufacturers VW, MB are trying to bring diesel, where as Japanese and American manufacturers are barely testing waters, actually FIAT-Chrysler is the one testing waters.

MCRed 12y ago
Car makers like Toyota, Mazda and the like all make diesel versions of the same cars-- they sell them in the UK and Australia. They cannot import them to the USA because of the "anti-smog" rules. IT's not chicken and egg-- the cars are there, and produced for other markets. It's pure regulation.
- quasse 12y ago
  What is it that prevents Toyota and Mazda from selling those diesel cars when most manufacturers are already selling pickups with large diesels?
  - ptaipale 12y ago
    Not sure, but there could be regulatory reasons. In the US there are these funny quotas for having to have so and so many cars below certain fuel consumption levels. And those quotas do not apply to pickup trucks, because they are not cars. This is rather silly, but it's the kind of thing that comes up when environmentalists and industry lobbyists are unleashed among politicians.
    - wolfgke 12y ago
      > This is rather silly, but it's the kind of thing that comes up when environmentalists and industry lobbyists are unleashed among politicians. Industry lobbyists - accepted. But why should environmentalists accept such stupid, environmentally harmful laws?
      - ptaipale 12y ago
        It's not easy to see how the mechanisms actually work, but I suppose it happens because those negotiations are more about power games than actual, rational processes towards specific goals. The relevant emission regulations are described in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Average_Fuel_Economy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Average_Fuel_Economy "CAFE has separate standards for "passenger cars" and "light trucks", despite the majority of "light trucks" actually being used as passenger cars. The market share of "light trucks" grew steadily from 9.7% in 1979 to 47% in 2001 and remained in 50% numbers up to 2011." Thus, the very legislation designed to reduce emissions has resulted in Americans buying bigger and bigger vehicles. From Europe, the rationale for this legislation is hard to understand.
  - bradleyland 12y ago
    The article touches on this a bit. The US has stricter anti-smog restrictions on particulate and NOx emissions. The gap is in regulation is narrowing though, so some time in the near future (next 10-15 years) we should have parity in regulation, which will mean parity in market offerings. Until then, the initial purchase cost of a diesel powered car in the US will run higher than the gasoline powered equivalent. When you do the math, your driving needs and ownership schedule (how long you'll keep the car) must meet a specific set of parameters for the more expensive diesel to catch up on ROI.
jhayward 12y ago
Chrysler is starting to bring in some passenger diesels particularly the Jeep Grand Cherokee and the Dodge Ram 1500 ecodiesel. Diesels are more expensive though, perhaps inherently so. The cost of the high-pressure injector system and turbocharger required raise the engine and maintenance costs considerably. Modern pollution controls (a good thing) have reduced the MPG advantage enough that the fuel cost differential with gasoline is no longer an advantage. It may be that will improve as the industry gains a decade more experience in diesel pollution controls.
bluedino 12y ago
Dodge sells diesel Sprinter vans in the US

by sremani 12y ago

MCRed 12y ago

Car makers like Toyota, Mazda and the like all make diesel versions of the same cars-- they sell them in the UK and Australia. They cannot import them to the USA because of the "anti-smog" rules. IT's not chicken and egg-- the cars are there, and produced for other markets. It's pure regulation.

quasse 12y ago
What is it that prevents Toyota and Mazda from selling those diesel cars when most manufacturers are already selling pickups with large diesels?
- ptaipale 12y ago
  Not sure, but there could be regulatory reasons. In the US there are these funny quotas for having to have so and so many cars below certain fuel consumption levels. And those quotas do not apply to pickup trucks, because they are not cars. This is rather silly, but it's the kind of thing that comes up when environmentalists and industry lobbyists are unleashed among politicians.
  - wolfgke 12y ago
    > This is rather silly, but it's the kind of thing that comes up when environmentalists and industry lobbyists are unleashed among politicians. Industry lobbyists - accepted. But why should environmentalists accept such stupid, environmentally harmful laws?
    - ptaipale 12y ago
      It's not easy to see how the mechanisms actually work, but I suppose it happens because those negotiations are more about power games than actual, rational processes towards specific goals. The relevant emission regulations are described in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Average_Fuel_Economy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_Average_Fuel_Economy "CAFE has separate standards for "passenger cars" and "light trucks", despite the majority of "light trucks" actually being used as passenger cars. The market share of "light trucks" grew steadily from 9.7% in 1979 to 47% in 2001 and remained in 50% numbers up to 2011." Thus, the very legislation designed to reduce emissions has resulted in Americans buying bigger and bigger vehicles. From Europe, the rationale for this legislation is hard to understand.
- bradleyland 12y ago
  The article touches on this a bit. The US has stricter anti-smog restrictions on particulate and NOx emissions. The gap is in regulation is narrowing though, so some time in the near future (next 10-15 years) we should have parity in regulation, which will mean parity in market offerings. Until then, the initial purchase cost of a diesel powered car in the US will run higher than the gasoline powered equivalent. When you do the math, your driving needs and ownership schedule (how long you'll keep the car) must meet a specific set of parameters for the more expensive diesel to catch up on ROI.

jhayward 12y ago

Chrysler is starting to bring in some passenger diesels particularly the Jeep Grand Cherokee and the Dodge Ram 1500 ecodiesel. Diesels are more expensive though, perhaps inherently so. The cost of the high-pressure injector system and turbocharger required raise the engine and maintenance costs considerably. Modern pollution controls (a good thing) have reduced the MPG advantage enough that the fuel cost differential with gasoline is no longer an advantage. It may be that will improve as the industry gains a decade more experience in diesel pollution controls.

bluedino 12y ago

Dodge sells diesel Sprinter vans in the US