6 ms·

Sorry for bring this up , but this is my honest question , why should I use sublime ? what is specific about it ? Let me explain , If I wanna text editor there

by 0xFFC 12y ago

Sorry for bring this up , but this is my honest question , why should I use sublime ? what is specific about it ? Let me explain , If I wanna text editor there is Emacs ( and vim for vim user's ) , and if I want to have specific feature like IDE's have (auto complete , GUI debugger etc ) , then I can use Qt Creator/Code Blocks/etc (which I don't need , Because I am not IDE user) , then Why should I use sublime , It does not fit in my either use cases.It is ide or text editor , If it is just text editor , what it provide which Emacs ( or vim) could not provide ? p.s. my comment should look like bias opinion , but it is not really. It is just question I have in my mind.

sanswork 12y ago
If you're happy with emacs or vim then you probably shouldn't use it. Many people aren't comfortable with those two or prefer a mouse based approach without the overhead of an IDE in which case Sublime is a pretty good choice with lots of customizability and available plugins. Edit: For me I do my coding/most everything in vim but if I get a new project I have to learn about I find it much more easy to navigate an unknown project in Sublime while I get it sorted in my mind.
- et1337 12y ago
  Sublime's vim keybindings are fairly complete as well.
- catern 12y ago
  You can use Emacs with a mouse just fine out of the box if you want.
- unfamiliar 12y ago
  I really disagree with the characterisation that it is for people who "prefer a mouse based approach." I hardly ever touch the mouse while using it. For me, the thing that sets sublime apart from vim and emacs is the fact that it is a full gui app. Things like go to definition, autocomplete, build panel, command pallete, sidebar, context menus, are all technically possible in vim, but hacking these features into a command line interface always ends up seeming clunky, confusing and slow. This also helps discoverability of features. If I want to do something, 99% of the time I can just search for the command in the menu or in the command pallete. Then they keyboard shortcut is clearly visible, and if it is a feature that I expect to use often I will make note of it. In vim (for me at least) this would require searching online for how to do something plus 10 minutes memorising the obscure commands to type into the command line. Compared to IDE's, sublime has most of their features that I use on a regular basis, but is comparatively light to use. I'd much rather pop open sublime to quickly edit a file than launch eclipse.
  - sjolsen 12y ago
    >For me, the thing that sets sublime apart from vim and emacs is the fact that it is a full gui app. Things like go to definition, autocomplete, build panel, command pallete, sidebar, context menus, are all technically possible in vim, but hacking these features into a command line interface always ends up seeming clunky, confusing and slow. I can't speak for vim, but Emacs is also a "full gui app." It has go to definition (in fact, I wouldn't be surprised if this idea was invented in some incarnation of Emacs), autocompletion, and various other such features like gdb integration and build message hyperlinking. The discoverability argument applies as well.
    - kasabali 12y ago
      I disagree, Emacs isn't a "full gui app" even if it has a gui with menus and can show images etc.; because almost all kind of interaction happens inside buffers opened in (new) windows. there are no proper dialogs/popups (they're not used even if it's possible), so Emacs is not a proper GUI app as anyone would expect. I don't claim it's a good or bad thing, a lot of people love emacs because of it's buffer/window centric approach, but it's not even remotely close to what you would expect from a modern gui, so Emacs is still oddball when compared to all the other gui's, which is why new users still struggle with it even though on paper Emacs has all the features other gui editors have.
      - sjolsen 12y ago
        So all in context, it sounds to me like you're saying that what sets Sublime Text apart from Emacs is simply that it uses a familiar user interface. I suppose that's fair enough. What I wouldn't say is fair, though, is characterizing something as incomplete and especially improper simply for being different from what you're used to.
        kasabali 12y ago
        > What I wouldn't say is fair, though, is characterizing something as incomplete and especially improper simply for being different from what you're used to. I didn't tell them to offense Emacs fans, so sorry if you're offended. And the point is not being different from what I am used to, it's being different from what the rest of the world used to, only the Emacs users are accustomed to the Emacs convention of graphical ui's, and the way Emacs does it is not a proper gui in the sense that they invented their own conventions and they're different from every other GUI convention in the world. I'm not implying anything insulting here. Incomplete GUI is another thing, yes, Emacs gui is incomplete because it does not use all existing GUI facilities and conventions to the full extent, and prefer existing Emacs ui facilities instead of gui toolkit's. Again, being incomplete is their choice, that doesn't mean it's a bad thing as I said in my previous comment (and a lot of people actually love it), but if you find that offensive I can't help with that.
Cthulhu_ 12y ago
You don't, really. It's just a solid editor in a GUI environment, not as heavy as an IDE, not as esoteric or hard to learn (sorry guys) as emacs or vim. I've used it pretty much full time for three years programming JS. Autocomplete is non-existent in JS, and WebStorm was just too bulky / laggy for me. The SublimeLinter plugin was enough error handling for me, and there was a Grunt listener running at all times running other validations and doing autorefresh.
methou 12y ago
IMHO, sublime is a lazy yet flexible editor, it has very fancy out-of-box experience, you don't have to download a lot of stuff from the internet and make your own customizations before you can finally gets started with what you intended to do few hours earlier. I know that both vim/emacs have very handy package manager, but they don't ship with vim/emacs.
- omaranto 12y ago
  Emacs's package manager does come with Emacs, starting with some recent version (I don't know which version, though).
  - catern 12y ago
    Emacs 24, released in 2012.
    - omaranto 12y ago
      I hoped that was the answer, but feared it was more like 24.3 or 25.
- deong 12y ago
  I give ST a try for a few months a year or so ago. Maybe this is no longer true, but at the time, the first thing everyone did with ST is download and install Package Control, which is no more integrated with ST and doesn't really work any better than the Emacs equivalent (can't speak to Vim). My impression was ST gives you something that is almost as powerful as Emacs or Vim without requiring nearly as big of a shift in how you deal with text in the other applications you use all the time. That and the fact that it looks prettier and more like a platform-native application I think explains the appeal. The amount of customization needed didn't seem all that much less to me.
  - aninhumer 12y ago
    I've found Package Control to be pretty painless. I can go from "Huh, I need syntax support for this language" back to editing in a few seconds. The other thing is that when I do want to customise something in ST, it will usually just involve editing a single obvious value in a JSON file, rather than hunting through docs to find out what keywords I needed to add to my vimrc.
codeshaman 12y ago
Good question. From my perspective, it's a text editor done properly which doesn't get in your way. You almost don't feel it. Put it another way - there are very few annoyances that I've noticed about it. It's very fast, it's configurable, it takes me 2 minutes to set it up on a new machine and have the same environment, regardless of the OS. Here's a story: I've recently started learning Clojure and I've been looking into editors which are best suited for it - I've tried LightTable, looks nice, but still rough around edges and slow, I've given a (new) shot to Emacs, but got discouraged when I realised I'd still have to learn all the shortcuts and stuff in addition to Clojure, IntelliJ Idea.... But then it struck me - does Sublime have a Clojure REPL ? It sure does and it's very nice.. 10 minutes later I was hacking away with a split screen and REPL, just like in Emacs. And I didn't have to do anything complicated, no files to edit, no environment vars to set up, it was easy.
- escherize 12y ago
  This sounds like a compelling way to get non-emacs users to start hacking clojure! Then, sorry if it sounds nit-picky, but hacking some clojure with a split-screen and REPL is not just like emacs. Cider [1] has like a million features that elevate it above just a repl + code. Then there's clojure refactor mode [2] which lets you rename files and keep the namespaces in sync, unwind threaded forms, and 30+ other things.
  - Ironballs 12y ago
    For those curious, escherize means: [1] https://github.com/clojure-emacs/cider https://github.com/clojure-emacs/cider [2] https://github.com/clojure-emacs/clj-refactor.el https://github.com/clojure-emacs/clj-refactor.el The examples in [3] showcase the features of clj-refactor rather neatly. [3] https://github.com/clojure-emacs/clj-refactor.el/tree/master/examples https://github.com/clojure-emacs/clj-refactor.el/tree/master...
on_and_off 12y ago
I don't see why you are getting downvoted, this is a legitimate question. Sublime is certainly not an IDE. AFAIK it can not do any of the things that make IDEs worth using : automatic refactoring, statistical analysis of your code, ... (not that it tries to). It is a text editor with plugins. The barrier to entry is way lower than for something like vi or Emacs and that's it.
whizzkid 12y ago
I am using Sublime for programming and here is why i use it over Vim or Emacs or an IDE. Vim is "way to go" editor for me on remote connections to server. But on my local machine, vim requires lots of configuration in order to let me be productive (at least for me). For example, Vim's regex engine is slow comparing to Sublime, which will be freezing for 2-3 seconds when you are doing some complex search and replace. This can be fixed by some config, but Sublime doesn't have this problem at all. Sublime is easy to use from dummy programmers to experts. Not Emacs or Vim. IDEs are mostly specific to a programming language, if not, they are memory hog to handle everything and takes around a minute to get ready for me to start typing code. One of the best features of Sublime is that, it lets to decide if you want a text editor or a IDE like experience from it. Customise it however you want. Of course it is not for everyone, I guess the best is to give it a try and see yourself.
aninhumer 12y ago
For me, Sublime Text feels like an editor with the ethos of Vim/Emacs, but designed in the 21st century, without all the legacy baggage. The key-bindings are based on modern GUI standards. The configuration uses simple JSON files. It provides most commonly used features as standard. Vim/Emacs are still probably more powerful once learned, but after using vim for a few years (admittedly not trying that hard to improve), I felt I was able to get to the same efficiency in Sublime in a few weeks.
hobarrera 12y ago
This question is pretty much like a vim user asking why he should use emacs (or viceversa). Sure, they cover a lot of common features each, plus their big differences. Sublime is just another alternative. No real reason to use it if you prefer what you already have. It's just a matter of trying it out and seeing how it works for you. Note: I no longer use sublime. vim+ctrlp+other plugins has replaced it for me.

by 0xFFC 12y ago

sanswork 12y ago

If you're happy with emacs or vim then you probably shouldn't use it. Many people aren't comfortable with those two or prefer a mouse based approach without the overhead of an IDE in which case Sublime is a pretty good choice with lots of customizability and available plugins. Edit: For me I do my coding/most everything in vim but if I get a new project I have to learn about I find it much more easy to navigate an unknown project in Sublime while I get it sorted in my mind.

et1337 12y ago
Sublime's vim keybindings are fairly complete as well.
catern 12y ago
You can use Emacs with a mouse just fine out of the box if you want.
unfamiliar 12y ago
I really disagree with the characterisation that it is for people who "prefer a mouse based approach." I hardly ever touch the mouse while using it. For me, the thing that sets sublime apart from vim and emacs is the fact that it is a full gui app. Things like go to definition, autocomplete, build panel, command pallete, sidebar, context menus, are all technically possible in vim, but hacking these features into a command line interface always ends up seeming clunky, confusing and slow. This also helps discoverability of features. If I want to do something, 99% of the time I can just search for the command in the menu or in the command pallete. Then they keyboard shortcut is clearly visible, and if it is a feature that I expect to use often I will make note of it. In vim (for me at least) this would require searching online for how to do something plus 10 minutes memorising the obscure commands to type into the command line. Compared to IDE's, sublime has most of their features that I use on a regular basis, but is comparatively light to use. I'd much rather pop open sublime to quickly edit a file than launch eclipse.
- sjolsen 12y ago
  >For me, the thing that sets sublime apart from vim and emacs is the fact that it is a full gui app. Things like go to definition, autocomplete, build panel, command pallete, sidebar, context menus, are all technically possible in vim, but hacking these features into a command line interface always ends up seeming clunky, confusing and slow. I can't speak for vim, but Emacs is also a "full gui app." It has go to definition (in fact, I wouldn't be surprised if this idea was invented in some incarnation of Emacs), autocompletion, and various other such features like gdb integration and build message hyperlinking. The discoverability argument applies as well.
  - kasabali 12y ago
    I disagree, Emacs isn't a "full gui app" even if it has a gui with menus and can show images etc.; because almost all kind of interaction happens inside buffers opened in (new) windows. there are no proper dialogs/popups (they're not used even if it's possible), so Emacs is not a proper GUI app as anyone would expect. I don't claim it's a good or bad thing, a lot of people love emacs because of it's buffer/window centric approach, but it's not even remotely close to what you would expect from a modern gui, so Emacs is still oddball when compared to all the other gui's, which is why new users still struggle with it even though on paper Emacs has all the features other gui editors have.
    - sjolsen 12y ago
      So all in context, it sounds to me like you're saying that what sets Sublime Text apart from Emacs is simply that it uses a familiar user interface. I suppose that's fair enough. What I wouldn't say is fair, though, is characterizing something as incomplete and especially improper simply for being different from what you're used to.
      - kasabali 12y ago
        > What I wouldn't say is fair, though, is characterizing something as incomplete and especially improper simply for being different from what you're used to. I didn't tell them to offense Emacs fans, so sorry if you're offended. And the point is not being different from what I am used to, it's being different from what the rest of the world used to, only the Emacs users are accustomed to the Emacs convention of graphical ui's, and the way Emacs does it is not a proper gui in the sense that they invented their own conventions and they're different from every other GUI convention in the world. I'm not implying anything insulting here. Incomplete GUI is another thing, yes, Emacs gui is incomplete because it does not use all existing GUI facilities and conventions to the full extent, and prefer existing Emacs ui facilities instead of gui toolkit's. Again, being incomplete is their choice, that doesn't mean it's a bad thing as I said in my previous comment (and a lot of people actually love it), but if you find that offensive I can't help with that.

Cthulhu_ 12y ago

You don't, really. It's just a solid editor in a GUI environment, not as heavy as an IDE, not as esoteric or hard to learn (sorry guys) as emacs or vim. I've used it pretty much full time for three years programming JS. Autocomplete is non-existent in JS, and WebStorm was just too bulky / laggy for me. The SublimeLinter plugin was enough error handling for me, and there was a Grunt listener running at all times running other validations and doing autorefresh.

methou 12y ago

IMHO, sublime is a lazy yet flexible editor, it has very fancy out-of-box experience, you don't have to download a lot of stuff from the internet and make your own customizations before you can finally gets started with what you intended to do few hours earlier. I know that both vim/emacs have very handy package manager, but they don't ship with vim/emacs.

omaranto 12y ago
Emacs's package manager does come with Emacs, starting with some recent version (I don't know which version, though).
- catern 12y ago
  Emacs 24, released in 2012.
  - omaranto 12y ago
    I hoped that was the answer, but feared it was more like 24.3 or 25.
deong 12y ago
I give ST a try for a few months a year or so ago. Maybe this is no longer true, but at the time, the first thing everyone did with ST is download and install Package Control, which is no more integrated with ST and doesn't really work any better than the Emacs equivalent (can't speak to Vim). My impression was ST gives you something that is almost as powerful as Emacs or Vim without requiring nearly as big of a shift in how you deal with text in the other applications you use all the time. That and the fact that it looks prettier and more like a platform-native application I think explains the appeal. The amount of customization needed didn't seem all that much less to me.
- aninhumer 12y ago
  I've found Package Control to be pretty painless. I can go from "Huh, I need syntax support for this language" back to editing in a few seconds. The other thing is that when I do want to customise something in ST, it will usually just involve editing a single obvious value in a JSON file, rather than hunting through docs to find out what keywords I needed to add to my vimrc.

codeshaman 12y ago

Good question. From my perspective, it's a text editor done properly which doesn't get in your way. You almost don't feel it. Put it another way - there are very few annoyances that I've noticed about it. It's very fast, it's configurable, it takes me 2 minutes to set it up on a new machine and have the same environment, regardless of the OS. Here's a story: I've recently started learning Clojure and I've been looking into editors which are best suited for it - I've tried LightTable, looks nice, but still rough around edges and slow, I've given a (new) shot to Emacs, but got discouraged when I realised I'd still have to learn all the shortcuts and stuff in addition to Clojure, IntelliJ Idea.... But then it struck me - does Sublime have a Clojure REPL ? It sure does and it's very nice.. 10 minutes later I was hacking away with a split screen and REPL, just like in Emacs. And I didn't have to do anything complicated, no files to edit, no environment vars to set up, it was easy.

escherize 12y ago
This sounds like a compelling way to get non-emacs users to start hacking clojure! Then, sorry if it sounds nit-picky, but hacking some clojure with a split-screen and REPL is not just like emacs. Cider [1] has like a million features that elevate it above just a repl + code. Then there's clojure refactor mode [2] which lets you rename files and keep the namespaces in sync, unwind threaded forms, and 30+ other things.
- Ironballs 12y ago
  For those curious, escherize means: [1] https://github.com/clojure-emacs/cider https://github.com/clojure-emacs/cider [2] https://github.com/clojure-emacs/clj-refactor.el https://github.com/clojure-emacs/clj-refactor.el The examples in [3] showcase the features of clj-refactor rather neatly. [3] https://github.com/clojure-emacs/clj-refactor.el/tree/master/examples https://github.com/clojure-emacs/clj-refactor.el/tree/master...

on_and_off 12y ago

I don't see why you are getting downvoted, this is a legitimate question. Sublime is certainly not an IDE. AFAIK it can not do any of the things that make IDEs worth using : automatic refactoring, statistical analysis of your code, ... (not that it tries to). It is a text editor with plugins. The barrier to entry is way lower than for something like vi or Emacs and that's it.

whizzkid 12y ago

I am using Sublime for programming and here is why i use it over Vim or Emacs or an IDE. Vim is "way to go" editor for me on remote connections to server. But on my local machine, vim requires lots of configuration in order to let me be productive (at least for me). For example, Vim's regex engine is slow comparing to Sublime, which will be freezing for 2-3 seconds when you are doing some complex search and replace. This can be fixed by some config, but Sublime doesn't have this problem at all. Sublime is easy to use from dummy programmers to experts. Not Emacs or Vim. IDEs are mostly specific to a programming language, if not, they are memory hog to handle everything and takes around a minute to get ready for me to start typing code. One of the best features of Sublime is that, it lets to decide if you want a text editor or a IDE like experience from it. Customise it however you want. Of course it is not for everyone, I guess the best is to give it a try and see yourself.

aninhumer 12y ago

For me, Sublime Text feels like an editor with the ethos of Vim/Emacs, but designed in the 21st century, without all the legacy baggage. The key-bindings are based on modern GUI standards. The configuration uses simple JSON files. It provides most commonly used features as standard. Vim/Emacs are still probably more powerful once learned, but after using vim for a few years (admittedly not trying that hard to improve), I felt I was able to get to the same efficiency in Sublime in a few weeks.

hobarrera 12y ago

This question is pretty much like a vim user asking why he should use emacs (or viceversa). Sure, they cover a lot of common features each, plus their big differences. Sublime is just another alternative. No real reason to use it if you prefer what you already have. It's just a matter of trying it out and seeing how it works for you. Note: I no longer use sublime. vim+ctrlp+other plugins has replaced it for me.