6 ms·

Instead of this, Apple or Facebook could pay $20,000 to their partners, if they stayed at home with a kid.

by jkot 12y ago

nsxwolf 12y ago
My college educated wife chose to stay home. Some of her friends and family view this as a deliberately provocative anti-feminist choice, and we're in the midwest. I can only imagine those sentiments would be even more common in SV.
- knicholes 12y ago
  My wife is also college educated and stays home. I don't see how this is anti-feminist, though. The way I see it, it's a woman choosing to live the way she wants to live. It had never occurred to me that this could be anti-feminist. Then again, I live in Utah where a sizeable portion of the college-educated women major in Family and Consumer Sciences at BYU. Seriously, though. http://registrar.byu.edu/catalog/2011-2012ucat/departments/FamilyLife/FamConsSciEduMajor.php http://registrar.byu.edu/catalog/2011-2012ucat/departments/F... My wife graduated in marketing and has worked and is fully able to work as a professional. I kind of view it as noble for her to bear the responsibility of full-time child rearing. It's undoubtedly a more difficult task than my sitting around on a computer all day occasionally going to meetings with catered lunches. ;)
  - webnrrd2k 12y ago
    I agree - I understand that a key aspect of feminism is "a woman choosing to live the way she wants to live". That means women, as well as men, staying home with the kids, if that's their choice. They shouldn't be forced into traditional roles, but are perfectly welcome to choose them.
- Domenic_S 12y ago
  My college educated wife also chose to stay home! She knew that's what she wanted to do before college. I think it's hard to disparage when any partner chooses to stay home -- and isn't choice a core tenant of feminism?
  - needacig 12y ago
    See my theory here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9236049 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9236049 EDIT: Please, and if you want.
  - icebraining 12y ago
    I agree, and celebrate the choice, but if you feel more strongly about the oppression imposed by customs, it may feel something like seeing a battered wife returning to her aggressor (except the "aggressor" is society, not the husband). That said, even if you think the person made a poor choice, criticism and cutting off relations is a terrible response - in either case!
- blhack 12y ago
  Something more important that working? Blasphemy! /s
  - Apocryphon 12y ago
    Indeed, staying at home shouldn't be seen as anti-feminist. It should be seen as contra-modern-capitalism.
- danielweber 12y ago
  Her friends can suck it. It's your family, you make the decisions, because you live with the consequences. It's cliche, but: if someone stops being your friend because you leave the job market for personal reasons, they were never your friend.
  - icebraining 12y ago
    That may be true, but I'm guessing it's poor consolation when you're a new parent and have no one to talk to. Isolation and loneliness is a common theme in new mothers.
- needacig 12y ago
  I don't agree this is an anti-feminist choice, but I think people might see it that way because genuinely anti-feminist people like to claim that a woman's place is in the home and that women's brains aren't really suited for tasks that aren't nurturing. So women staying home to take care of the children, on a surface level, supports this traditional anti-feminist argument and this is why it could be seen as anti-feminist.
- Dewie 12y ago
  They think that a woman making a non-traditional[1] choice is anti-feminist? They think that woman should fall in line and do what is expected of her (out of ideology)? How wonderfully ironic. [1] staying at home might as well be the new non-traditional choice. Feminism is now the old guard.
msoad 12y ago
In many cases the partner is a professional himself and $20k don't get you anywhere with that situation.
s73v3r 12y ago
Or allow more remote work.
bentcorner 12y ago
$20,000 is roughly the cost of childcare for the year. It would be better spent on letting parents use that money towards that, allowing both partners to work. With a large enough population you could probably open an on-site care facility for children, which buys you better employee satisfaction, since you could integrate it with their workplace IT. That said, the $20k is a one time cost to freeze eggs, whereas the $20k you would give (to a partner or other childcare) would cover just one year. The egg freezing seems like the more economical choice, from Apple/FB's point of view.
- zelos 12y ago
  There seem like lots of other options that aren't so invasive. Better childcare, flexible/part time working hours, decent maternity/paternity leave, not expecting your employees to dedicate their entire existence to the Company.
sjg007 12y ago
Or offer day care, life balance, work from home etc.. Honestly, having a kid puts you out of the office but not necessarily out of work, especially tasks amenable to remote work.
throwaway03951 12y ago
Funny thing about using the $20,000 benefit for IVF: a clinic charges a lot more, like 2.5 times more, for the same service when going through insurance than when self-paying. With the $20,000 benefit you will end up out-of-pocket paying 50% of the self-pay amount. That is better than nothing but the service is not covered in full.

Instead of this, Apple or Facebook could pay $20,000 to their partners, if they stayed at home with a kid.

by jkot 12y ago

Instead of this, Apple or Facebook could pay $20,000 to their partners, if they stayed at home with a kid.

My college educated wife chose to stay home. Some of her friends and family view this as a deliberately provocative anti-feminist choice, and we're in the midwest. I can only imagine those sentiments would be even more common in SV.

knicholes 12y ago
My wife is also college educated and stays home. I don't see how this is anti-feminist, though. The way I see it, it's a woman choosing to live the way she wants to live. It had never occurred to me that this could be anti-feminist. Then again, I live in Utah where a sizeable portion of the college-educated women major in Family and Consumer Sciences at BYU. Seriously, though. http://registrar.byu.edu/catalog/2011-2012ucat/departments/FamilyLife/FamConsSciEduMajor.php http://registrar.byu.edu/catalog/2011-2012ucat/departments/F... My wife graduated in marketing and has worked and is fully able to work as a professional. I kind of view it as noble for her to bear the responsibility of full-time child rearing. It's undoubtedly a more difficult task than my sitting around on a computer all day occasionally going to meetings with catered lunches. ;)
- webnrrd2k 12y ago
  I agree - I understand that a key aspect of feminism is "a woman choosing to live the way she wants to live". That means women, as well as men, staying home with the kids, if that's their choice. They shouldn't be forced into traditional roles, but are perfectly welcome to choose them.
Domenic_S 12y ago
My college educated wife also chose to stay home! She knew that's what she wanted to do before college. I think it's hard to disparage when any partner chooses to stay home -- and isn't choice a core tenant of feminism?
- needacig 12y ago
  See my theory here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9236049 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9236049 EDIT: Please, and if you want.
- icebraining 12y ago
  I agree, and celebrate the choice, but if you feel more strongly about the oppression imposed by customs, it may feel something like seeing a battered wife returning to her aggressor (except the "aggressor" is society, not the husband). That said, even if you think the person made a poor choice, criticism and cutting off relations is a terrible response - in either case!
blhack 12y ago
Something more important that working? Blasphemy! /s
- Apocryphon 12y ago
  Indeed, staying at home shouldn't be seen as anti-feminist. It should be seen as contra-modern-capitalism.
danielweber 12y ago
Her friends can suck it. It's your family, you make the decisions, because you live with the consequences. It's cliche, but: if someone stops being your friend because you leave the job market for personal reasons, they were never your friend.
- icebraining 12y ago
  That may be true, but I'm guessing it's poor consolation when you're a new parent and have no one to talk to. Isolation and loneliness is a common theme in new mothers.
needacig 12y ago
I don't agree this is an anti-feminist choice, but I think people might see it that way because genuinely anti-feminist people like to claim that a woman's place is in the home and that women's brains aren't really suited for tasks that aren't nurturing. So women staying home to take care of the children, on a surface level, supports this traditional anti-feminist argument and this is why it could be seen as anti-feminist.
Dewie 12y ago
They think that a woman making a non-traditional[1] choice is anti-feminist? They think that woman should fall in line and do what is expected of her (out of ideology)? How wonderfully ironic. [1] staying at home might as well be the new non-traditional choice. Feminism is now the old guard.

msoad 12y ago

In many cases the partner is a professional himself and $20k don't get you anywhere with that situation.

s73v3r 12y ago

Or allow more remote work.

bentcorner 12y ago

$20,000 is roughly the cost of childcare for the year. It would be better spent on letting parents use that money towards that, allowing both partners to work. With a large enough population you could probably open an on-site care facility for children, which buys you better employee satisfaction, since you could integrate it with their workplace IT. That said, the $20k is a one time cost to freeze eggs, whereas the $20k you would give (to a partner or other childcare) would cover just one year. The egg freezing seems like the more economical choice, from Apple/FB's point of view.

zelos 12y ago
There seem like lots of other options that aren't so invasive. Better childcare, flexible/part time working hours, decent maternity/paternity leave, not expecting your employees to dedicate their entire existence to the Company.

sjg007 12y ago

Or offer day care, life balance, work from home etc.. Honestly, having a kid puts you out of the office but not necessarily out of work, especially tasks amenable to remote work.

throwaway03951 12y ago

Funny thing about using the $20,000 benefit for IVF: a clinic charges a lot more, like 2.5 times more, for the same service when going through insurance than when self-paying. With the $20,000 benefit you will end up out-of-pocket paying 50% of the self-pay amount. That is better than nothing but the service is not covered in full.