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The Way I Work: Jason Fried of 37Signals
- hotshothenry 17y agoInc magazine database fail
- grinich 17y agoFatal error: Call to undefined function: query() in /content/public_web_sites/www.inc.com/reflex /lib/dbi.class.php on line 152 Ouch. Here's a printer-friendly version with the full text. http://www.inc.com/magazine/20091101/the-way-i-work-jason-fried-of-37signals_Printer_Friendly.html http://www.inc.com/magazine/20091101/the-way-i-work-jason-fr...
- yan 17y agoHow high-traffic web sites still not obfuscate these errors, or even allow them to happen in the first place, is far beyond me.
- jrockway 17y agoWhat difference does it make? People are used to weird errors, so it doesn't scare away "normal people" anymore than a fail whale would. People trying to break the code are not aided much by one filename and line number, either. It's annoying to look at, and I wouldn't do it... but it doesn't really matter.
- yan 17y agoIt's just a show of a lack of professionalism. I view exposing low-level errors as akin to spelling mistakes, typos, poor photo work, and other symptoms that show the content producers just didn't take the extra step to differentiate from amateurs. I hate to beat the cliche, but just one of the reasons I feel happy when using most of Apple's products: they just scream that even the details were very much thought about.
- wensing 17y agoExcept the time my iPhone went into Chinese-language panic mode and started warning me that something completely arcane was happening and would only shut down after I took out the SIM. PS: No, the phone has never been jailbroken.
- TrevorJ 17y agoI wasn't aware that you could even take out the SIM without some serious physical hackery to get the case open.
- throw_away 17y agothat's what the mystery key is inside the packaging. you put that through the hole on the top by the headphone jack and out pops the sim card.
- groby_b 17y agoOr just drop the iPhone from 4+ feet. Works every time for me ;) (Not that I want to do it..)
- philwelch 17y agoThere's a removable SIM caddy at the top that can be popped open with a paperclip or a key included in the iPhone 3G packaging. It's the battery that can't be easily removed.
- TrevorJ 17y agoOh, interesting, I did not know that. Thanks.
- btucker 17y agoFor the most part I agree, but giving out full path names definitely can make exploiting other holes easier.
- nir 17y agoIt's about craftsmanship. It might not cause any harm, but an error message like that in this type of site just shows you don't care for your craft.
- chrismear 17y agoWith a decent error page, you can at least give ordinary people a link back to the home page.
- tibbon 17y agoWe know he certainly doesn't work in PHP, and makes sites that scale a bit better :)
- laut 17y agoNot working in PHP doesn't automatically makes sites scale better. Yahoo!, Facebook and more use PHP.
- tibbon 17y agoTotally true. Two totally separate points I meant. He doesn't work in PHP and (unlike the site that this was originally posted on) he makes stable/scalable sites :) No doubt, PHP is faster than Ruby in many instances.
- edw519 17y agoI have no idea how many hours my employees work -- I just know they get the work done. I wish someone would just tattoo this on the forehead of every PHB (backwards, of course).
- jrockway 17y agoMost people's jobs aren't to do work, it's to keep their chair warm. That requires 8 hours a day of work.
- staunch 17y agoThe basic idea behind office hours is that if you can't make people work, you can at least prevent them from having fun. If employees have to be in the building a certain number of hours a day, and are forbidden to do non-work things while there, then they must be working. In theory. In practice they spend a lot of their time in a no-man's land, where they're neither working nor having fun. http://www.paulgraham.com/opensource.html http://www.paulgraham.com/opensource.html "Workplaces"
- dolinsky 17y agoThe way I work: Always turn error notification off on live and have a process scanning the error logs so I'm notified of it. This might also be my biggest hangup with using PHP.
- wvenable 17y agoI have PHP put up a nice error page for every error. With (very minor) trickery, you can even put up nice pages for fatal errors. Unless it's a database connection error, I have the site automatically email me a full stack trace and all other relevant details. You don't even have to turn off error notification in the PHP.INI file, you can control that from your script.
- dolinsky 17y agoI believe your trickery involves capturing the output buffer and grep'ing for a fatal error, yes? We thought of doing that, but our site commands too much traffic for that to be a feasible option. If it's something less intrusive, I'm all ears.
- wvenable 17y agoYou can't capture the output buffer on a fatal error; the script just aborts. You do have to wait till the end of your script to write your output otherwise this doesn't work very well but here is some (simplified) code: $errorTemplate = file_get_contents("errortemplate.html"); $templates = explode('%error%', $text, 2); ini_set('error_prepend_string', $templates[0]); ini_set('error_append_string', $templates[1]); ini_set('html_errors', '0'); The errortemplate.html file is a static HTML file that can contain anything you want. Ours is themed up just like any other page on our website. When a fatal error is triggered, the text %error% will be replaced with the fatal error text. We place that into a form using a hidden textarea so our users can submit it to us. <textarea style="display: none;">%error%</textarea> The server log will contain the fatal error, so you don't care about users submitting it you can just wrap it in a comment. <!-- %error% --> And that's all there is to it.
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- dschobel 17y agoI don't read fiction. I find it a waste of time. There are so many amazing things that are real; I don't need to spend any time on a made-up story. Pretty strange comment to come from a creative type, no?
- jasonfried 17y agoI don't think it's strange that I don't read fiction. I've met plenty of other "creative" people who don't read fiction either. Nothing against other people reading fiction, I'm just not interested in it. I watch movies and I'll watch TV shows, but if I'm going to spend dozens and dozens of hours reading, I'd rather read about something that's real. There's plenty of creativity in the real world. More than I'd ever be able to discover in 100 lifetimes.
- axod 17y agoDo you not read fiction at all ever, or just not regularly? I don't regularly read fiction, but I have about 3 novels that I've read in my lifetime that were absolutely spell binding, like the best movie * 1000. Never been absolutely tied to a book that you literally can't put it down until you finish it?
- jasonfried 17y agoI don't read fiction at all anymore. Used to, but I have limited time for reading these days so I choose to focus on non-fiction. That's what I find the most stimulating and interesting.
- jrockway 17y agoYou don't really get to see into the author's mind when you are reading non-fiction; it's all about the facts. With fiction, the author's creativity is not restrained by actual happenings. (Books like "1984" are worth reading, even if they are not a factual account of events that took place in 1984.)
- tptacek 17y agoI enjoy cooking, but I'm single, and I don't like to cook for myself. I go out often, but I don't like fancy dining experiences. I find people putting a napkin on my lap uncomfortable, and don't like worrying about using the wrong fork. That's too bad, because very few fine dining places are about that stuffy service, use-the-right-fork nonsense anymore, and Chicago is an epicenter for creative new food. He should check out Moto, Schwa, or even Alinea; nobody is going to touch his lap.
- jasonfried 17y agoYup, I've enjoyed some of the great new-wave fine dining places in Chicago and other cities, but I almost always prefer a hole in the wall with great food. I'd rather eat at Club Lago or Club Lucky than a fancy Italian place. I love food so I'll check out any restaurant, but I just feel more comfortable in places like Lago.
- tptacek 17y agoYou want to go to the LTH list of "Great Neighboorhood Restaurants": http://lthforum.com/bb/viewtopic.php?p=215187#p215187 http://lthforum.com/bb/viewtopic.php?p=215187#p215187 Start at the top, work your way down the list. Two notes: * This is a PHPBB --- that's it, just a PHPBB --- that gives awards that are so authoritative in Chicago that very trendy restaurants (Kuma's, for instance) hang them in the window. * As far as I can tell, no other city has anything like LTH, even NYC. The "LTH of San Francisco", for instance, is the CHOW message boards. No trendy restaurant has ever hung a printed-out CHOW message board comment in their window.
- dabeeeenster 17y agoI live about two miles from my office. I drive there most of the time. I should bike more, but I saw someone on a bike get hit two years ago, and it really freaked me out. I figure I'm better off driving. So not only is he needlessly adding to global CO2, but also to the number of cars on the road. A shame. 2 miles from the office is less than 10 minutes by bike...
- dabeeeenster 17y agoWhy am I getting modded down for this? DRIVING TWO MILES TO WORK! That's insane...
- xal 17y agobecause many people drive their car for less then a quarter of that.
- dabeeeenster 17y agoWhat's crazy is that it's not rational at all. Has he never witnessed a serious car accident? He is no doubt aware of the local and global environmental impact of doing something as selfish as driving two miles to work and back most days, and yet I get modded down for pointing this out. Talk about cognitive dissonance...
- dannyr 17y agoWhich accident would you most likely survive? Get hit in a car or get hit on a bike?
- ciupicri 17y agoAnd which accident is more likely probable? I think that everything should be taken into consideration.
- caffeine 17y agoWell at this point I think you're just getting -'d for whining about being -'d ... Be that as it may - I'm not certain what the mortality statistics are on cars vs bikes. I would prefer to avoid accidents in either modality. I found it uncharitable of you to attack Fried after he admitted what is a personal (and yes, perhaps irrational) reason for avoiding cycling to work. Rather than lambasting the man, you could have proposed alternative solutions that would accommodate his instinct for personal survival and your concern for the larger biosphere. For example, filling up an efficient car with co-workers and/or using public transportation are ways in which to travel on four or more wheels while minimizing emissions, no?
- goodkarma 17y agoAll I'm seeing is: Fatal error: Call to undefined function: query() in /content/public_web_sites/www.inc.com/reflex/lib/dbi.class.php on line 152
- goodkarma 17y agoOkay they fixed the problem. I'd delete my comment if I could but I can't. No need to take away any more of my karma! Thanks.
- fjabre 17y agoSounds like someone I could chill with. Gyokuro tea is good but it's a bitch to make. Try Silver Needle tea instead. =) Wonderfully honest and as always I love the stab at the ridiculous hype surrounding gigantic user bases that lose money on 'every meal' served. An excellent read.
- jasonfried 17y agoBig fan of Silver Needle too. And thanks for the kind words.
- ojbyrne 17y ago"I don't read fiction. I find it a waste of time. There are so many amazing things that are real; I don't need to spend any time on a made-up story" a little later: "I just wind down by reading or watching TV. I relate to Larry David on Curb Your Enthusiasm. I also watch House, M.D" I find that a little weird. I personally think reading fiction is an indication that you have an imagination.
- tokenadult 17y ago"If a restaurant served more food than everybody else but lost money on every diner, would it be successful? No. But on the Internet, for some reason, if you have more users than everyone else, you're successful. No, you're not." That seems like an important business principle that is often forgotten in reporting on Internet-based companies. Keeping revenue in mind can have some powerful effects on a company's future. Especially, the example is good because it focuses on making revenue by pleasing customers who could take their business elsewhere.
- 9oliYQjP 17y agoAn interesting thing is that Jeff Bezos is the only investor in 37 Signals according to that article. Amazon.com was the poster boy for "Don't worry about spending money now, we'll be profitable one day" mentality. That said, most other dot com companies slightly misinterpreted this strategy. One thing that Amazon.com did differently than its counterparts which were also losing money was it pursued moderate and steady growth rather than exponential curve growth. I think we see a similar situation these days in startups. It's all about scaling up as fast as possible to millions of users. But here we have a company liked 37 Signals saying "don't worry about scalability, we'll get their one day, just throw more hardware at the problem". Scale eventually, has sort of been a 37 Signals tenet hasn't it? For all the companies pursuing functional this, and threaded-that, jumping onboard the latest greatest languages and platforms for scalability, 37 Signals and Rails is chugging along quite nicely. In fact, I bet they'd reply "What scalability problem?" if anyone were to ask, as they likely don't have one right now.
- tedunangst 17y agoThe other thing amazon did differently is actually have a revenue stream.
- rudin 17y agoGoing with the restaurant metaphor, it is a lot easier to get into profit if you have paying customers but they are losing you money, (Amazon) than if the customers are getting a free lunch. The scalability of the internet can really help with the first case while in the second it still isn't sure if you have a viable business model.
- JMiao 17y ago+1 for relating with Larry David. I often joke with my cofounder, Sam, that PG/tlb/Paul Buchheit are the Larry Davids of the software world.
- ptn 17y agoPlus, they chop your day into small bits, so you have only 20 minutes of free time here or 45 minutes there. Creative people need unstructured time to get in the zone. You can't do that in 20 minutes. That bit reminded me of pg, because it's something he said too and because of the writing style.
- deleted 17y ago[deleted]
- agbell 17y agoThis was great. Jason Fried, ordinary dude. I am considering subscribing to Inc. They have some great stuff (like the street smarts column http://www.inc.com/magazine/columns/streetsmarts/ http://www.inc.com/magazine/columns/streetsmarts/)
- hop 17y agoJason, With all of 37signals beautifully clean and minimalist design and function, I always wondered why your homepage http://37signals.com http://37signals.com is so busy - a bunch of text with little whitespace, icons with cartoon word balloons, contrasting colored boxes on a white bg... Seems like way more noise than signal. Did some A/B testing prove it superior?
- kapitti 17y agoAny chance that those remote hobby farms actually have high speed internet available in those rural areas?
- HeyLaughingBoy 17y agoMine does.
- mhartl 17y agoGiven the history (http://37signals.com/svn/posts/1088-how-not-to-apply-for-a-job http://37signals.com/svn/posts/1088-how-not-to-apply-for-a-j..., and the ensuing discussion at http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=219085 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=219085), it's lamentable yet somehow sadly appropriate that this article misspells "37signals" both in the title and throughout the rest of the article. (N.B. I'm with Jason on this one.)
- dtran 17y agoReally interesting question - how much do you need to interact with your coworkers to be effective? Can a company operate with all of its employees working remotely? For those of you that went to Startup School or have heard Tony Hsieh's talk from it, what do you think about the way 37signals employees work vs. Zappos where Hsieh encouraged managers to spend a lot of time outside of work with their team?
- jorleif 17y agoI thought about exactly the same thing. What is also worth considering, is if there is a lot of individual variation in the need to interact. In my experience many people are not the "self-driven" kind that are often considered ideal. What should one do with them? Even self-driven people are usually driven only to do some particular things, and these might not be the things that the whole company benefits most from.
- dtran 17y agoI definitely agree that it probably varies for different people - that seems like the biggest challenge of being a manager. Which people do you have to micromanage vs. which people will create amazing things if you just completely leave them alone. What about with co-founders for a startup - do you believe that they should always work together since it's so important that they mold the vision/initial product together, or is there any room to work separately if both people are driven enough?
- pistoriusp 17y agoI've read 18 books this year, 14 of those were fictional. I'm pretty sure that I gained/ learned more from the fictional books. But I guess that's a matter of perception. P.S. Also a bit annoyed and shocked that people "don't read fiction."
- Nekojoe 17y agoI did enjoy reading that interview. It's always interesting to get insight into other people's way of working. What struck me most about that interview was how it was written. How simple the wording is. It's clear to read, the language he uses is straight to the point and it's concise. I assume the interview as over e-mail. The sentences he uses are short and unambiguous. Plus they're easy to parse. I wonder how long it took to write that interview? If it just comes naturally or if he had to edit and tweak it a lot.