4 ms·

TL;DR If the user keeps to the default installer settings and goes next, next, next... AND in Safari deliberately selects "Install" (not pre-selected) in the c

TL;DR If the user keeps to the default installer settings and goes next, next, next... AND in Safari deliberately selects "Install" (not pre-selected) in the confirmation window, the ask.com toolbar will be installed.

smhenderson 12y ago
So similar to Windows and avoidable but still annoying. I can kind of understand some small software developers out there doing this stuff to make a few extra dollars but Oracle? It just seems so unnecessary. I guess they just can't get their head around giving something away for free.
- powertower 12y ago
  Some more information... "When you have a commercial relationship like this, not only are you dealing with your [own] corporate policies on communication, and revenue recognition and all that kind of stuff, but you also have a commercial partnership and agreement that you have to abide by and follow," said Smith during the call. Smith also defended the practice by saying Oracle had inherited the deal when it acquired Sun Microsystems, the creator of Java, in 2010. "This is not a new business, this is not something that Oracle started," Smith said. "This is a business that Sun initiated a long time ago." Sun had bundled third-party software with Java since at least 2005, when it offered a Google toolbar. In the following years, Sun made similar arrangements with Microsoft and Yahoo, before switching to Ask.com. With Java, it's true our installer waits 10 minutes before running the install process, but this to ensure the JRE [Java Runtime Environment] updates properly without additional strain on a user's computer," an Ask.com spokeswoman said in an email reply to questions Monday. "This is not intended to trick users." http://www.computerworld.com/article/2494794/malware-vulnerabilities/oracle-will-continue-to-bundle--crapware--with-java.html http://www.computerworld.com/article/2494794/malware-vulnera...
  - yellowapple 12y ago
    The defense that "hurr durr Sun did it and we just haven't removed it yet" doesn't apply when you're actively adding it to installers on other platforms.
eloisant 12y ago
It still changes your browser homepage with an opt-out checkbox, it's pretty bad.
oneeyedpigeon 12y ago
It appears to tell you you've installed the extension, then ask you if you want to install it. Anyway, it would be fairly simple for someone not paying careful attention to install something completely unrelated to what they're actually trying to install; that's a trojan in my book.
- moondowner 12y ago
  I agree. That's why paying attention is important when installing 3rd party software. Especially when an installer requests admin privileges.
MatthiasP 12y ago
Which is probably what the average user does, if I extrapolate the data from friends and family. Installing adware with security updates is just so wrong on several points. It is difficult enough to get non-techies to install security updates and now you additionally have to teach them to watch out for crapware that someone sneaks in there. I'm choosing C# over Java whenever I can, just because of the ask.com toolbar, seriously I find it that annoying.
organsnyder 12y ago
That's not the point. As someone who is actually a fairly big fan of Java, my concern is the damage this continues to do to Java's image in the minds of non-technical users (especially those in executive positions).
- sigzero 12y ago
  This has already been played out on Windows. It isn't damaging anything reputation wise.
  - TeMPOraL 12y ago
    Indeed. Developers will keep chosing JVM for technical reasons, managers will keep choosing Java for business reasons, and the end-user doesn't have any choice. Want the application to run? Install Java.
    - rdsnsca 12y ago
      Na... look for an app that doesn't need it. Haven't had Java on any of my machines for 5 years and i don't miss it one bit.
      - moondowner 12y ago
        Many websites/webapps run on Java on the server side. Also some desktop apps come with Java bundled together. The user just installs the app and runs it.

smhenderson 12y ago

So similar to Windows and avoidable but still annoying. I can kind of understand some small software developers out there doing this stuff to make a few extra dollars but Oracle? It just seems so unnecessary. I guess they just can't get their head around giving something away for free.

powertower 12y ago
Some more information... "When you have a commercial relationship like this, not only are you dealing with your [own] corporate policies on communication, and revenue recognition and all that kind of stuff, but you also have a commercial partnership and agreement that you have to abide by and follow," said Smith during the call. Smith also defended the practice by saying Oracle had inherited the deal when it acquired Sun Microsystems, the creator of Java, in 2010. "This is not a new business, this is not something that Oracle started," Smith said. "This is a business that Sun initiated a long time ago." Sun had bundled third-party software with Java since at least 2005, when it offered a Google toolbar. In the following years, Sun made similar arrangements with Microsoft and Yahoo, before switching to Ask.com. With Java, it's true our installer waits 10 minutes before running the install process, but this to ensure the JRE [Java Runtime Environment] updates properly without additional strain on a user's computer," an Ask.com spokeswoman said in an email reply to questions Monday. "This is not intended to trick users." http://www.computerworld.com/article/2494794/malware-vulnerabilities/oracle-will-continue-to-bundle--crapware--with-java.html http://www.computerworld.com/article/2494794/malware-vulnera...
- yellowapple 12y ago
  The defense that "hurr durr Sun did it and we just haven't removed it yet" doesn't apply when you're actively adding it to installers on other platforms.

eloisant 12y ago

It still changes your browser homepage with an opt-out checkbox, it's pretty bad.

oneeyedpigeon 12y ago

It appears to tell you you've installed the extension, then ask you if you want to install it. Anyway, it would be fairly simple for someone not paying careful attention to install something completely unrelated to what they're actually trying to install; that's a trojan in my book.

moondowner 12y ago
I agree. That's why paying attention is important when installing 3rd party software. Especially when an installer requests admin privileges.

MatthiasP 12y ago

Which is probably what the average user does, if I extrapolate the data from friends and family. Installing adware with security updates is just so wrong on several points. It is difficult enough to get non-techies to install security updates and now you additionally have to teach them to watch out for crapware that someone sneaks in there. I'm choosing C# over Java whenever I can, just because of the ask.com toolbar, seriously I find it that annoying.

organsnyder 12y ago

That's not the point. As someone who is actually a fairly big fan of Java, my concern is the damage this continues to do to Java's image in the minds of non-technical users (especially those in executive positions).

sigzero 12y ago
This has already been played out on Windows. It isn't damaging anything reputation wise.
- TeMPOraL 12y ago
  Indeed. Developers will keep chosing JVM for technical reasons, managers will keep choosing Java for business reasons, and the end-user doesn't have any choice. Want the application to run? Install Java.
  - rdsnsca 12y ago
    Na... look for an app that doesn't need it. Haven't had Java on any of my machines for 5 years and i don't miss it one bit.
    - moondowner 12y ago
      Many websites/webapps run on Java on the server side. Also some desktop apps come with Java bundled together. The user just installs the app and runs it.