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My daughters are 6 and 8. One of the biggest questions they have before starting any new game is "can I be a girl?" Even in Minecraft, their favorite, they try

My daughters are 6 and 8. One of the biggest questions they have before starting any new game is "can I be a girl?" Even in Minecraft, their favorite, they try to dress up the character as much as possible. They're terribly disappointed when where are no girl characters and offhand, they only bought/play one game without a girl character (GTA V, though we skip the missions which contain the questionable for kids content). Even in Myst, they asked/pretend the main character is a girl (though the intro makes it rather clear that's not the case). It's really surprising to me, since as a boy I often chose female characters and didn't really think about it. But game devs could easily be losing money by alienating so much of the market. (Though girl characters for purchase, so long clearly identified in demos or marketing materials, is probably a cynical way to fix the situation. Spending $5 to make my daughters enjoy a game is an automatic buy.) And it extends further, too. When buying a ThinkPad for my 6-yr-old, she really wanted a colored one. Even when explaining it's a superior platform, how it'll hook into her audio hardware, etc., she was only OK with the platform after I said we could get one of those vinyl skins printed up for her ThinkPad, so it wouldn't be all black. Maybe this is all well-known, but it's just amazing to see how strong the "feminine drive" is, essentially naturally, at such s young age. (We severely restrict the amount of shitty girls kid's TV shows, no Barbie, no Disney products, biggest toys are LEGO, etc.)

zanny 12y ago
> (We severely restrict the amount of shitty girls kid's TV shows, no Barbie, no Disney products, biggest toys are LEGO, etc.) If they go to public school peer relations and student body culture will override prior teaching. When presented with the girls sitting next to them talking about the shows and toys you never exposed them to, they are met with the decision to have faith in their parents or seek to fit in with the status quo. It is why it is so hard to break childhood stereotypes, because unless you can get a majority of parents to pressure the disjunction, the culture of their classroom will limit what you can do.
- MichaelGG 12y ago
  Fortunately, at the moment, we have a governess so there's not that particular issue. But I do see the pressure applied from friends that... lack taste. What can you do but try? In the future I hope to be able to afford private schools with a focus on getting students interested in things. That'll hopefully bring out like minded families. Basically, I just want to increase their saving throws vs crap.
  - zanny 12y ago
    Thats why I love home schooling and recommend it to others when possible (and a lot of the mid tier or senior engineers at many of the SV companies that frequent this site can easily have their spouses work part time or stay at home to raise their children optimally). Problem is that you often end up seeing career driven smart engineers marrying career driven smart spouses. That isn't to say distance them from their own age group. They need tons of exposure to those their own age. But if you do that you can have them going to all the activities and clubs they are interested in in the evening while dodging the cult of personality and familiarity that is the public classroom. And if you can save your children from the brain drain, they will find myriad interests in a vibrant world for them to pursue.
- ianbicking 12y ago
  > If they go to public school peer relations and student body culture will override prior teaching. When presented with the girls sitting next to them talking about the shows and toys you never exposed them to, they are met with the decision to have faith in their parents or seek to fit in with the status quo. I don't think it's quite that hard. If you expect to counteract the influence simply by removing offending messages, then yes, it will not be successful in the face of peers. But if you explain and teach your family's value system that explains WHY you avoid Barbie and the like, that can be much more sticky.
  - zanny 12y ago
    Except from the childs perspective you are preaching ethics and equality and esoteric concepts about human rights and freedoms while they are in the now and immediately disassociated from their peer group due to dissimilar attachment to culturally normative and popular topics. It makes them resent you because they end up with few friends in a sea of those who will antagonize them for being different, even if those are the "good" friends you want them to have.
nacs 12y ago
> Even in Minecraft Not sure if you're saying Minecraft does or does not have female characters but Minecraft has actually supported skins pretty much since the beginning (over 4+ years now) so you can be male, female or whatever you want to be really. Also recently they added a default female character skin so players without a custom skin are randomly given a male or female skin.
- pdkl95 12y ago
  If you're using modded Minecraft, there are a few mods that add alternate player models. Currently, I think the preferred mod is "More Player Models"[1], which supports a variety of model parts including various fantasy creatures in addition to female version of the usual "Steve" model. It can use the regular player skins on some models, and includes an in-game editor. Also, Notch has written[2] about the gender situation in Minecraft. He was attempting to make everything "genderless" (or "both"), which he now suggests might not have been the best decision. [1] http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/mapping-and-modding/minecraft-mods/1291730-more-player-models-2-adds-a-character-creation http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/mapping-and-modding/min... [2] http://notch.tumblr.com/post/28188312756/gender-in-minecraft http://notch.tumblr.com/post/28188312756/gender-in-minecraft
a3voices 12y ago
You can be a heavily customizable girl in GTA 5 online.

zanny 12y ago

> (We severely restrict the amount of shitty girls kid's TV shows, no Barbie, no Disney products, biggest toys are LEGO, etc.) If they go to public school peer relations and student body culture will override prior teaching. When presented with the girls sitting next to them talking about the shows and toys you never exposed them to, they are met with the decision to have faith in their parents or seek to fit in with the status quo. It is why it is so hard to break childhood stereotypes, because unless you can get a majority of parents to pressure the disjunction, the culture of their classroom will limit what you can do.

MichaelGG 12y ago
Fortunately, at the moment, we have a governess so there's not that particular issue. But I do see the pressure applied from friends that... lack taste. What can you do but try? In the future I hope to be able to afford private schools with a focus on getting students interested in things. That'll hopefully bring out like minded families. Basically, I just want to increase their saving throws vs crap.
- zanny 12y ago
  Thats why I love home schooling and recommend it to others when possible (and a lot of the mid tier or senior engineers at many of the SV companies that frequent this site can easily have their spouses work part time or stay at home to raise their children optimally). Problem is that you often end up seeing career driven smart engineers marrying career driven smart spouses. That isn't to say distance them from their own age group. They need tons of exposure to those their own age. But if you do that you can have them going to all the activities and clubs they are interested in in the evening while dodging the cult of personality and familiarity that is the public classroom. And if you can save your children from the brain drain, they will find myriad interests in a vibrant world for them to pursue.
ianbicking 12y ago
> If they go to public school peer relations and student body culture will override prior teaching. When presented with the girls sitting next to them talking about the shows and toys you never exposed them to, they are met with the decision to have faith in their parents or seek to fit in with the status quo. I don't think it's quite that hard. If you expect to counteract the influence simply by removing offending messages, then yes, it will not be successful in the face of peers. But if you explain and teach your family's value system that explains WHY you avoid Barbie and the like, that can be much more sticky.
- zanny 12y ago
  Except from the childs perspective you are preaching ethics and equality and esoteric concepts about human rights and freedoms while they are in the now and immediately disassociated from their peer group due to dissimilar attachment to culturally normative and popular topics. It makes them resent you because they end up with few friends in a sea of those who will antagonize them for being different, even if those are the "good" friends you want them to have.

nacs 12y ago

> Even in Minecraft Not sure if you're saying Minecraft does or does not have female characters but Minecraft has actually supported skins pretty much since the beginning (over 4+ years now) so you can be male, female or whatever you want to be really. Also recently they added a default female character skin so players without a custom skin are randomly given a male or female skin.

pdkl95 12y ago
If you're using modded Minecraft, there are a few mods that add alternate player models. Currently, I think the preferred mod is "More Player Models"[1], which supports a variety of model parts including various fantasy creatures in addition to female version of the usual "Steve" model. It can use the regular player skins on some models, and includes an in-game editor. Also, Notch has written[2] about the gender situation in Minecraft. He was attempting to make everything "genderless" (or "both"), which he now suggests might not have been the best decision. [1] http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/mapping-and-modding/minecraft-mods/1291730-more-player-models-2-adds-a-character-creation http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/mapping-and-modding/min... [2] http://notch.tumblr.com/post/28188312756/gender-in-minecraft http://notch.tumblr.com/post/28188312756/gender-in-minecraft

a3voices 12y ago

You can be a heavily customizable girl in GTA 5 online.