4 ms·

Libel is a legal term. Can you point to a specific instance of speech from Ellis that you are talking about? I think the truth of a statement matters in libel l

Libel is a legal term. Can you point to a specific instance of speech from Ellis that you are talking about? I think the truth of a statement matters in libel laws in the U.S., but I'm not a lawyer. You disregard the possiblity that Ellis is trying to warn other women more than she is trying to make an accusation that would lead to the appropriate action against him.

dogma1138 12y ago
Libel is also a dictionary term. "Libel is a method of defamation expressed by print, writing, pictures, signs, effigies, or any communication embodied in physical form that is injurious to a person's reputation, exposes a person to public hatred, contempt or ridicule, or injures a person in his/her business or profession." I'm not qualified to turn this into a legal discussion, and i don't think many of us on these site are either, but heck. I don't disregard anything i just don't think she has any right to do so, and neither does anyone else. Being accused in such cases especially when sexual assault of one type or another is involved is just as harmful as being found guilty of that. Accusing someone without actually going to court is even worse because it doesn't give them the platform to clear their name. When the only thing you have is "she said, he said" it tends to create a "guilty by default" situation, if nothing else than just because most people would rather err on the side of caution.
- graeme 12y ago
  I don't know which dictionary you used, but any dictionary I checked says libel is a false statement. I checked oxford and merriam webster. http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/libel http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/libel The definition you cited appears to come from Cornell's Wex legal dictionary. The libel page says libel is a form of defamation, and the defamation page says defamation involves falsehood. https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/libel https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/libel https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation You said, in an earlier comment "Calling some one on twitter is libel pure and simple, true or not it doesn't matter." That's just not correct, you're using the word libel wrong.
  - dogma1138 12y ago
    Well since we had a "legal" discussion, i thought i would use a legal terms dictionary, so is the one i used ;) https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/libel https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/libel Apparently based on actual court cases the falseness of a statement is not a necessity what is tho is the malicious intent to cause damages. So not sure where you got that it has to be false, not from that link for sure.
    - graeme 12y ago
      As I said above, libel is a form of defamation; that's on the libel page. And if you click through to defamation, it says a defamation case (such as libel or slander) must prove four elements: 1) a false statement purporting to be fact; 2) publication or communication of that statement to a third person; 3) fault; and 4) damages, or some harm caused to the person or entity who is the subject of the statement. https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation The comments about malice on the libel page relate to punitive damages. That has nothing to do with the elements of libel itself.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]

dogma1138 12y ago

Libel is also a dictionary term. "Libel is a method of defamation expressed by print, writing, pictures, signs, effigies, or any communication embodied in physical form that is injurious to a person's reputation, exposes a person to public hatred, contempt or ridicule, or injures a person in his/her business or profession." I'm not qualified to turn this into a legal discussion, and i don't think many of us on these site are either, but heck. I don't disregard anything i just don't think she has any right to do so, and neither does anyone else. Being accused in such cases especially when sexual assault of one type or another is involved is just as harmful as being found guilty of that. Accusing someone without actually going to court is even worse because it doesn't give them the platform to clear their name. When the only thing you have is "she said, he said" it tends to create a "guilty by default" situation, if nothing else than just because most people would rather err on the side of caution.

graeme 12y ago
I don't know which dictionary you used, but any dictionary I checked says libel is a false statement. I checked oxford and merriam webster. http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/libel http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/libel The definition you cited appears to come from Cornell's Wex legal dictionary. The libel page says libel is a form of defamation, and the defamation page says defamation involves falsehood. https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/libel https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/libel https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation You said, in an earlier comment "Calling some one on twitter is libel pure and simple, true or not it doesn't matter." That's just not correct, you're using the word libel wrong.
- dogma1138 12y ago
  Well since we had a "legal" discussion, i thought i would use a legal terms dictionary, so is the one i used ;) https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/libel https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/libel Apparently based on actual court cases the falseness of a statement is not a necessity what is tho is the malicious intent to cause damages. So not sure where you got that it has to be false, not from that link for sure.
  - graeme 12y ago
    As I said above, libel is a form of defamation; that's on the libel page. And if you click through to defamation, it says a defamation case (such as libel or slander) must prove four elements: 1) a false statement purporting to be fact; 2) publication or communication of that statement to a third person; 3) fault; and 4) damages, or some harm caused to the person or entity who is the subject of the statement. https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/defamation The comments about malice on the libel page relate to punitive damages. That has nothing to do with the elements of libel itself.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]