4 ms·

I believe there is truth to what you say. It's very difficult to prove of course, but I've definitely noticed that certain founders seem to face a lot more skep

by paul 12y ago

I believe there is truth to what you say. It's very difficult to prove of course, but I've definitely noticed that certain founders seem to face a lot more skepticism than others. The great part about this business is that I can make money by investing in those that others are missing :)

Mz 12y ago
Unless they are so discouraged and boo-ed down that they give up, don't bother, can't get what they need to make it work and so on. In which case, you are leaving money on the table by allowing HN to remain too much of a Boy Zone.
- graeme 12y ago
  Realistically, what could be done about it? Serious question. I had the same reaction as you to these comments. It seemed like Jessica was getting a lot of skepticism relative to what PG or one of the male partners would have received from similar claims. But I don't know how I would change things. Any suggestions? Note: I'm truly baffled that many commentors here seem to think that judging character is i. impossible to do correctly, ii. undesirable, iii. skill in judging character is intrinsically impossible to evaluate
  - Mz 12y ago
    It is something I have been working on for a long time. I think things are getting better on HN. I think my comments here were relatively well-received. There was a time when my experience of HN was pretty negative. If you are male, some things that you can do include: Engage women in discussion about ideas and a) don't gush at them just because it's a woman speaking up b) don't give them condescending pats on the head of "encouragement" as if they would be more successful if only their girlie little feelings are helped to be more positive c) and invite them to push back. I previously had a blog post about "shoving matches." I am not currently finding it, which may mean it was not republished when my blog was moved, likely due to combination of it probably wasn't that well written and I am frequently busy with other things. In a nutshell, think of the scene in "Remember the Titans" where the white team captain gets into a shoving match with a black team member. Initially, the black team member is afraid to push back. That's the kind of thing that could end badly in the racist environment in which they live. But the team captain shoves again and invites him to shove back. He does finally shove back, they engage in a friendly shoving match, and that is the moment where the team becomes a team and race stops mattering. This can be done to a woman. It is possible to encourage her to argue with you in public in a way that is not dismissive of her. It is possible to invite women to stand their ground and defend their ideas. And that's one of the big things that needs to happen on HN.
    - graeme 12y ago
      Oh, actually I meant what could the mods do about it? Since you mentioned allowing HN to be a boy zone. I think (hope?) I'm fine personally as far as female engagement goes. I run a forum in my niche, a niche that's slightly majority female.
      - Mz 12y ago
        It would be nice if there were a visible female presence on the mod team. And/or if Jessica herself would be so kind as to participate more regularly here. Either one (or both) of those would do wonders. Having said that, the new moderator Dan G. has been a very valuable resource for me in the last year. I think appointing him was a good move and I think things are already moving in a better direction for HN wrt the participation of women here.
- paul 12y ago
  I hope not! Many of our best startups are disliked by hn...
  - Mz 12y ago
    It appears to me that women face special challenges in networking and this leads to challenges in problem solving for a fledgling business. I came to HN to network and, until very recently it was a major fail for me. It is gradually getting better, but it's taken a lot of work on my end to get it better. I am not talking about "women need to be liked." I am talking about "Women need to be able to access knowledge that is currently overwhelmingly held by men." If they can't effectively do that, they are going to tend to have lower success rates.
- gargarplex 12y ago
  "Boy Zone" is tone deaf and insulting. You call yourself a woman yet refer to male participants, collectively, as boys. Quit it.
  - Mz 12y ago
    I used to use the term "Old Boys Club" on HN, which was not well received, in part because most members here aren't that old. When criticized for that, I asked for suggestions for an alternate term. No one offered me any. "Boy Zone" is a term I learned on MetaFilter which gets used as a label for a male dominated environment. I am open to suggestions as to how else to succinctly describe the situation. But, so far, having been on the look-out for other terms for a few years, "Old Boys Club" and "Boy Zone" are the only two I know of. Both are guilty of using the term "boy."
    - gargarplex 12y ago
      I appreciate the kind and considerate response. Thank you. Your thoughtfulness and good intentions are all I could ask for. Thank you.
scobar 12y ago
Have you noticed any specific traits founders who face increased skepticism have that aren't apparent in other founders?

by paul 12y ago

Mz 12y ago

Unless they are so discouraged and boo-ed down that they give up, don't bother, can't get what they need to make it work and so on. In which case, you are leaving money on the table by allowing HN to remain too much of a Boy Zone.

graeme 12y ago
Realistically, what could be done about it? Serious question. I had the same reaction as you to these comments. It seemed like Jessica was getting a lot of skepticism relative to what PG or one of the male partners would have received from similar claims. But I don't know how I would change things. Any suggestions? Note: I'm truly baffled that many commentors here seem to think that judging character is i. impossible to do correctly, ii. undesirable, iii. skill in judging character is intrinsically impossible to evaluate
- Mz 12y ago
  It is something I have been working on for a long time. I think things are getting better on HN. I think my comments here were relatively well-received. There was a time when my experience of HN was pretty negative. If you are male, some things that you can do include: Engage women in discussion about ideas and a) don't gush at them just because it's a woman speaking up b) don't give them condescending pats on the head of "encouragement" as if they would be more successful if only their girlie little feelings are helped to be more positive c) and invite them to push back. I previously had a blog post about "shoving matches." I am not currently finding it, which may mean it was not republished when my blog was moved, likely due to combination of it probably wasn't that well written and I am frequently busy with other things. In a nutshell, think of the scene in "Remember the Titans" where the white team captain gets into a shoving match with a black team member. Initially, the black team member is afraid to push back. That's the kind of thing that could end badly in the racist environment in which they live. But the team captain shoves again and invites him to shove back. He does finally shove back, they engage in a friendly shoving match, and that is the moment where the team becomes a team and race stops mattering. This can be done to a woman. It is possible to encourage her to argue with you in public in a way that is not dismissive of her. It is possible to invite women to stand their ground and defend their ideas. And that's one of the big things that needs to happen on HN.
  - graeme 12y ago
    Oh, actually I meant what could the mods do about it? Since you mentioned allowing HN to be a boy zone. I think (hope?) I'm fine personally as far as female engagement goes. I run a forum in my niche, a niche that's slightly majority female.
    - Mz 12y ago
      It would be nice if there were a visible female presence on the mod team. And/or if Jessica herself would be so kind as to participate more regularly here. Either one (or both) of those would do wonders. Having said that, the new moderator Dan G. has been a very valuable resource for me in the last year. I think appointing him was a good move and I think things are already moving in a better direction for HN wrt the participation of women here.
paul 12y ago
I hope not! Many of our best startups are disliked by hn...
- Mz 12y ago
  It appears to me that women face special challenges in networking and this leads to challenges in problem solving for a fledgling business. I came to HN to network and, until very recently it was a major fail for me. It is gradually getting better, but it's taken a lot of work on my end to get it better. I am not talking about "women need to be liked." I am talking about "Women need to be able to access knowledge that is currently overwhelmingly held by men." If they can't effectively do that, they are going to tend to have lower success rates.
gargarplex 12y ago
"Boy Zone" is tone deaf and insulting. You call yourself a woman yet refer to male participants, collectively, as boys. Quit it.
- Mz 12y ago
  I used to use the term "Old Boys Club" on HN, which was not well received, in part because most members here aren't that old. When criticized for that, I asked for suggestions for an alternate term. No one offered me any. "Boy Zone" is a term I learned on MetaFilter which gets used as a label for a male dominated environment. I am open to suggestions as to how else to succinctly describe the situation. But, so far, having been on the look-out for other terms for a few years, "Old Boys Club" and "Boy Zone" are the only two I know of. Both are guilty of using the term "boy."
  - gargarplex 12y ago
    I appreciate the kind and considerate response. Thank you. Your thoughtfulness and good intentions are all I could ask for. Thank you.

scobar 12y ago

Have you noticed any specific traits founders who face increased skepticism have that aren't apparent in other founders?