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The title is very click-baity, I think we can all agree on that. However, a lot of the points made within are completely legit. The Bitcoin world is rife with

The title is very click-baity, I think we can all agree on that. However, a lot of the points made within are completely legit. The Bitcoin world is rife with scams and one of the primary uses of Bitcoin is to engage in illegal transactions. The benefits of de-regulation are obvious, but the downsides are killing it right now. A lot of people are stuck on the "regulation is evil!" rehtoric due to the current issues with the NSA and the government in general, but I think everyone needs to take a step back and realize that a radical shift in the opposite direction is not the answer. The technology is interesting, and I definitely think we'll see the ideas behind some of these new cryptocurrencies working to change the future of currency in general, but Bitcoin itself is not that future. I also see that the /r/bitcoin defense force is in full swing here, unsurprisingly.

lsadam0 12y ago
I won't disagree that CryptoCurrencies have by and large been used for illegal transactions. Though, my response would be: So? Any technology can be applied to do something illegal. Do you think this fact played 0 part in the Internet itself thriving? I don't see us scrambling to throw away steak knives just because some people have been stabbed.
- GlickWick 12y ago
  The problem is that the majority of money changing hands appears to be for illegal uses. When the internet was in its infancy, this was absolutely not the case. I'm sure there was something going on, but it wasn't the primary use.
  - lsadam0 12y ago
    Again, I would say: So? So cryptocurrency found a large push from a utility that was largely illegal. Who cares? Does it diminish the utility of the technology in any way whatsoever?
    - GlickWick 12y ago
      If you want eventually widespread adoption, the foundation of the currency cannot be illegal. This isn't even a case of questionable morality, there's some really obviously huge illegal transactions going through on Bitcoin. If you're really so blind that you can't see why this is very bad news for widespread adoption of Bitcoin, you need to take a step back and see things more objectively.
      - logfromblammo 12y ago
        You're making an inference based on conditional probabilities that is not supportable by logic and mathematics. Bitcoin has widespread adoption among criminals because they cannot reasonably make use of personal checks or card-based payments. It is their best alternative to cash for certain use cases. For everyone else, Bitcoin has to be better than a debit card, rather than better than cash. This requires widespread adoption and financial service businesses using Bitcoin. The foundation of the currency has little to do with the character of early adopters. I don't judge my stereo by the pretentiousness of the first audiophile to review it. Likewise, I don't care that people use Bitcoin to buy weed. There are only two problems I have with Bitcoin: 1. I can't pay all my bills with it. 2. I can't get paid for my work with it. I can certainly jump through additional hoops to convert my dollar-denominated bank accounts into Bitcoin, but that does not actually improve my life right now. I have no compelling reason to use Bitcoin other than a vague desire to have some long-term alternative to the existing financial service businesses. I have no reason to believe that Bitcoin will be that long-term viable alternative. I think that such an alternative will likely emerge within the next decade, but I don't think I have seen it yet. I see potential. But I don't buy potential; I buy value. The bad news for widespread adoption of Bitcoin is really that it hasn't happened yet.
jgrowl 12y ago
I find arguments against Bitcoin by talking about scams and illegal transactions completely baffling. The same thing happens with cash simply because it is a medium for exchanging value. It is an inherent property of currency.
- GlickWick 12y ago
  It is, but it's much easier to prevent these types of scams with cash. As much as people hate banks and such, things like chargebacks are also possible in more extreme situations. In Bitcoin, once your money is in their hands, you're toast.
- tormeh 12y ago
  That's also why suitcases full of cash are considered suspicious and you can't bring with you as much as you want across borders[0][1]. The problem is acknowledged (though not solved) when dealing with cash, so that's not a valid argument for ignoring it in Bitcoin. 0: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/customs/customs_controls/cash_controls/index_en.htm http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/customs/customs_control... 1: https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/778/~/declaring-currency-when-entering-the-u.s.-in-transit-to-a-foreign-destination https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/778/~/declaring...
grubles 12y ago
>one of the primary uses of Bitcoin is to engage in illegal transactions. Do you have a source for that statement?

lsadam0 12y ago

I won't disagree that CryptoCurrencies have by and large been used for illegal transactions. Though, my response would be: So? Any technology can be applied to do something illegal. Do you think this fact played 0 part in the Internet itself thriving? I don't see us scrambling to throw away steak knives just because some people have been stabbed.

GlickWick 12y ago
The problem is that the majority of money changing hands appears to be for illegal uses. When the internet was in its infancy, this was absolutely not the case. I'm sure there was something going on, but it wasn't the primary use.
- lsadam0 12y ago
  Again, I would say: So? So cryptocurrency found a large push from a utility that was largely illegal. Who cares? Does it diminish the utility of the technology in any way whatsoever?
  - GlickWick 12y ago
    If you want eventually widespread adoption, the foundation of the currency cannot be illegal. This isn't even a case of questionable morality, there's some really obviously huge illegal transactions going through on Bitcoin. If you're really so blind that you can't see why this is very bad news for widespread adoption of Bitcoin, you need to take a step back and see things more objectively.
    - logfromblammo 12y ago
      You're making an inference based on conditional probabilities that is not supportable by logic and mathematics. Bitcoin has widespread adoption among criminals because they cannot reasonably make use of personal checks or card-based payments. It is their best alternative to cash for certain use cases. For everyone else, Bitcoin has to be better than a debit card, rather than better than cash. This requires widespread adoption and financial service businesses using Bitcoin. The foundation of the currency has little to do with the character of early adopters. I don't judge my stereo by the pretentiousness of the first audiophile to review it. Likewise, I don't care that people use Bitcoin to buy weed. There are only two problems I have with Bitcoin: 1. I can't pay all my bills with it. 2. I can't get paid for my work with it. I can certainly jump through additional hoops to convert my dollar-denominated bank accounts into Bitcoin, but that does not actually improve my life right now. I have no compelling reason to use Bitcoin other than a vague desire to have some long-term alternative to the existing financial service businesses. I have no reason to believe that Bitcoin will be that long-term viable alternative. I think that such an alternative will likely emerge within the next decade, but I don't think I have seen it yet. I see potential. But I don't buy potential; I buy value. The bad news for widespread adoption of Bitcoin is really that it hasn't happened yet.

jgrowl 12y ago

I find arguments against Bitcoin by talking about scams and illegal transactions completely baffling. The same thing happens with cash simply because it is a medium for exchanging value. It is an inherent property of currency.

GlickWick 12y ago
It is, but it's much easier to prevent these types of scams with cash. As much as people hate banks and such, things like chargebacks are also possible in more extreme situations. In Bitcoin, once your money is in their hands, you're toast.
tormeh 12y ago
That's also why suitcases full of cash are considered suspicious and you can't bring with you as much as you want across borders[0][1]. The problem is acknowledged (though not solved) when dealing with cash, so that's not a valid argument for ignoring it in Bitcoin. 0: http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/customs/customs_controls/cash_controls/index_en.htm http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/customs/customs_control... 1: https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/778/~/declaring-currency-when-entering-the-u.s.-in-transit-to-a-foreign-destination https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/778/~/declaring...

grubles 12y ago

>one of the primary uses of Bitcoin is to engage in illegal transactions. Do you have a source for that statement?