4 ms·

This is the first time Google is developing an office complex from scratch and it's somehow "Edifice Complex"? Mind you this is a $400 billion company.

by btian 12y ago

Fomite 12y ago
You can object to it if you want, but it's a well known phenomena - starting to build buildings is often a bad sign for the company's long-term future prospects. And since we're talking about companies peaking, the size of the company isn't particularly relevant. It is, of course, not a universal law, but lavish new office spaces are one of those things that don't seem to go well.
- btian 12y ago
  > it's a well known phenomena Do you have any data to back it up or did you just made it up?
  - Fomite 12y ago
    http://www.businessinsider.com/poorly-timed-headquarters-2009-11 http://www.businessinsider.com/poorly-timed-headquarters-200... Or from a16z: "Pouring huge money into overly glorious new headquarters — “The Edifice Complex” — then repeating two years later. There’s also a danger in signaling to employees “we’ve made it, we’re amazing” (and while everyone hates the cramped but collaborative space when they’re in it, they miss it terribly after the move)."
    - btian 12y ago
      That's anecdote, not data. Having 10 examples doesn't validate your point. And for the a16z stuff you quoted, the first paragraph says "10 ways to damage your fast-growing tech startup". Thanks for classifying Google as a fast-growing tech startup, but I think the startup phase was over a long time ago.
      - deleted 12y ago
        [deleted]
      - Fomite 12y ago
        You had asked for data that it was a well-known phenomena. A major business publication and a well-known VC firm both referring to it by name is decent data for it being well-known, and the best you're going to get without paying me.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
- benihana 12y ago
  >but it's a well known phenomena I'm a bit dubious when the top google link of this well known phenomenon is an urban dictionary definition.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
  - mattmanser 12y ago
    That says more about you than the term, it's not top in an incog search.
    - nostrademons 12y ago
      (Not OP) I just tried - it's top in an incognito search as well. I wouldn't be surprised if it's geolocation-based.
- alex_anglin 12y ago
  Data centers are buildings. They've built a bunch of those successfully.
  - protomyth 12y ago
    I think the original term comes from a headquarters where the company leaders want to express themselves. "Utility" buildings are pretty common and dictated by function for the most part. This happens to governments when they decide to build the "New City Hall". It generally goes really badly.
- davidcgl 12y ago
  The BI article [1] you linked to only shows a correlation between a handful of companies' failure and their new buildings. They failed because of other factors; new buildings only accelerated their downfall. If this is the norm we wouldn't even have Google (and FB, Apple, Microsoft, Apple, etc) campuses today. [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/poorly-timed-headquarters-2009-11?op=1 http://www.businessinsider.com/poorly-timed-headquarters-200...
- TaylorAlexander 12y ago
  I think perhaps starting to build buildings is a sign of a company's maturity, and that separately many companies that achieve this maturity end up struggling to maintain the focus they enjoyed during their growth. So maybe it is that big successful companies tend to build buildings, and that success sometimes is the downfall of an innovative company.
  - hga 12y ago
    Exactly. I at least view this phenomena as more likely signaling a peak than a downfall. It's often a sign that some of the people at the top believe they have nothing better to do than immerse themselves in creating a special building. They are by definition not as focused on the company's business. If this is happening with Google, it doesn't signal doom, but, as you say, a degree of maturity.
    - Fomite 12y ago
      "Exactly. I at least view this phenomena as more likely signaling a peak than a downfall." - You do realize that a "peak" inherently implies a decline, yes?
      - hga 12y ago
        Yes, but peak does not necessarily equal "downfall", it could be the start of a plateau, which can be very consequential, especially for a previously high growth tech company. I'm also using it loosely, it could also, after a while, be followed by another growth period. Or a decline could be slow, Google's business isn't necessarily of the sort where a fall would be quick.
Symbiote 12y ago
It's at least the second time they've announced something, since they announced a £650M / $1G building in London in 2013¹. But it seems that's stalled.² ¹ http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/googles-uk-base-will-have-room-for-4500-employees-8677716.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/googles-uk-b... ² http://www.techworld.com/news/startups/google-rent-offices-at-kings-cross-as-it-stalls-on-uk-hq-3593913/ http://www.techworld.com/news/startups/google-rent-offices-a...

This is the first time Google is developing an office complex from scratch and it's somehow "Edifice Complex"? Mind you this is a $400 billion company.

by btian 12y ago

This is the first time Google is developing an office complex from scratch and it's somehow "Edifice Complex"? Mind you this is a $400 billion company.

Fomite 12y ago

You can object to it if you want, but it's a well known phenomena - starting to build buildings is often a bad sign for the company's long-term future prospects. And since we're talking about companies peaking, the size of the company isn't particularly relevant. It is, of course, not a universal law, but lavish new office spaces are one of those things that don't seem to go well.

btian 12y ago
> it's a well known phenomena Do you have any data to back it up or did you just made it up?
- Fomite 12y ago
  http://www.businessinsider.com/poorly-timed-headquarters-2009-11 http://www.businessinsider.com/poorly-timed-headquarters-200... Or from a16z: "Pouring huge money into overly glorious new headquarters — “The Edifice Complex” — then repeating two years later. There’s also a danger in signaling to employees “we’ve made it, we’re amazing” (and while everyone hates the cramped but collaborative space when they’re in it, they miss it terribly after the move)."
  - btian 12y ago
    That's anecdote, not data. Having 10 examples doesn't validate your point. And for the a16z stuff you quoted, the first paragraph says "10 ways to damage your fast-growing tech startup". Thanks for classifying Google as a fast-growing tech startup, but I think the startup phase was over a long time ago.
    - deleted 12y ago
      [deleted]
    - Fomite 12y ago
      You had asked for data that it was a well-known phenomena. A major business publication and a well-known VC firm both referring to it by name is decent data for it being well-known, and the best you're going to get without paying me.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
benihana 12y ago
>but it's a well known phenomena I'm a bit dubious when the top google link of this well known phenomenon is an urban dictionary definition.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- mattmanser 12y ago
  That says more about you than the term, it's not top in an incog search.
  - nostrademons 12y ago
    (Not OP) I just tried - it's top in an incognito search as well. I wouldn't be surprised if it's geolocation-based.
alex_anglin 12y ago
Data centers are buildings. They've built a bunch of those successfully.
- protomyth 12y ago
  I think the original term comes from a headquarters where the company leaders want to express themselves. "Utility" buildings are pretty common and dictated by function for the most part. This happens to governments when they decide to build the "New City Hall". It generally goes really badly.
davidcgl 12y ago
The BI article [1] you linked to only shows a correlation between a handful of companies' failure and their new buildings. They failed because of other factors; new buildings only accelerated their downfall. If this is the norm we wouldn't even have Google (and FB, Apple, Microsoft, Apple, etc) campuses today. [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/poorly-timed-headquarters-2009-11?op=1 http://www.businessinsider.com/poorly-timed-headquarters-200...
TaylorAlexander 12y ago
I think perhaps starting to build buildings is a sign of a company's maturity, and that separately many companies that achieve this maturity end up struggling to maintain the focus they enjoyed during their growth. So maybe it is that big successful companies tend to build buildings, and that success sometimes is the downfall of an innovative company.
- hga 12y ago
  Exactly. I at least view this phenomena as more likely signaling a peak than a downfall. It's often a sign that some of the people at the top believe they have nothing better to do than immerse themselves in creating a special building. They are by definition not as focused on the company's business. If this is happening with Google, it doesn't signal doom, but, as you say, a degree of maturity.
  - Fomite 12y ago
    "Exactly. I at least view this phenomena as more likely signaling a peak than a downfall." - You do realize that a "peak" inherently implies a decline, yes?
    - hga 12y ago
      Yes, but peak does not necessarily equal "downfall", it could be the start of a plateau, which can be very consequential, especially for a previously high growth tech company. I'm also using it loosely, it could also, after a while, be followed by another growth period. Or a decline could be slow, Google's business isn't necessarily of the sort where a fall would be quick.

Symbiote 12y ago

It's at least the second time they've announced something, since they announced a £650M / $1G building in London in 2013¹. But it seems that's stalled.² ¹ http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/googles-uk-base-will-have-room-for-4500-employees-8677716.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/googles-uk-b... ² http://www.techworld.com/news/startups/google-rent-offices-at-kings-cross-as-it-stalls-on-uk-hq-3593913/ http://www.techworld.com/news/startups/google-rent-offices-a...