4 ms·

I don't particularly like the idea of harassing possibly innocent students. Innocent students might be under pressure with no proof of innocence, since they ass

by MollyR 12y ago

I don't particularly like the idea of harassing possibly innocent students. Innocent students might be under pressure with no proof of innocence, since they assumed to be guilty. They might do a cost/benefit analysis and admit guilt. Also if cheating is really such a concern, why not just handle it in a similar way to the american GRE's or SAT's ?

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
mixedmath 12y ago
When you suggest handling it like American GREs and SATs, what do you mean? Do you mean computer-given multiple choice tests? Or is there something about how they handle paper and pencil exams that you think should be widely adopted?
- bodyfour 12y ago
  A good start would be to not let students pick which seat they take the test in. They can still attempt to copy their neighbor's work but can't collude with someone to make it easy.
- MollyR 12y ago
  I'm going more by there security practices in general, not really one in particular . https://www.ets.org/gre/institutions/about/security/ https://www.ets.org/gre/institutions/about/security/ I think if academic integrity is huge issue, perhaps we should adopt some formal rules for all tests, rather than being at the whims of different professors, or universities. Essentially we need some kind of check and balance before we try to discredit students on a metric like the one being described this article. The GRE's as a specific example have a high degree of trust and a fairly proven track record for being secure and preventing cheating. It might not be that much of stretch to apply whatever they seem to be doing to combat academic integrity issues. I think I rambled a bit, but I hope that made sense
bodyfour 12y ago
I agree -- visually judging outliers is a pretty poor test of statistical significance. The fact that they sat near each other does give them some weight though. The big problem is that it only works for people who share a fairly unique answer set. In other words, they need to all have a decent number of wrong answers which correlate. What about people at the bottom-right of the graph who had a high correlation simply because they answered nearly all of the questions correctly? Certainly most of them are innocent, but how would we know? It seems this technique can only finger people who cheat and still end up with a mediocre grade, not those who cheat and end up acing the exam.
xkcd-sucks 12y ago
Based on the policies of the two universities at which I've taught, it seems like there's no possible benefit to admitting guilt. The only foolproof way to "convict" someone of cheating is to have (several) people witness/record the incident. If a student accused of cheating categorically denies everything, they're usually in the clear (although faculty will say nasty things in private).
- navait 12y ago
  Breaking connections to faculty has consequences, namely in letters of recommendation.
  - brg 12y ago
    Letters of recommendation have almost no bearing on life. The only exceptions are for someone headed to graduate school, but at that point they likely have a pool of faculty members from which to choose.
- dubya 12y ago
  This varies between schools. At my current school it's fairly straightforward to say "I saw this student looking at X's paper" and show that the answers are more similar than would be expected. Multiply choice would be harder of course, but free response or incorrect math calculations are pretty convincing. Students have recourse, but the appeals process here is not much work for the faculty member making the accusation until maybe the final level.

by MollyR 12y ago

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

mixedmath 12y ago

When you suggest handling it like American GREs and SATs, what do you mean? Do you mean computer-given multiple choice tests? Or is there something about how they handle paper and pencil exams that you think should be widely adopted?

bodyfour 12y ago
A good start would be to not let students pick which seat they take the test in. They can still attempt to copy their neighbor's work but can't collude with someone to make it easy.
MollyR 12y ago
I'm going more by there security practices in general, not really one in particular . https://www.ets.org/gre/institutions/about/security/ https://www.ets.org/gre/institutions/about/security/ I think if academic integrity is huge issue, perhaps we should adopt some formal rules for all tests, rather than being at the whims of different professors, or universities. Essentially we need some kind of check and balance before we try to discredit students on a metric like the one being described this article. The GRE's as a specific example have a high degree of trust and a fairly proven track record for being secure and preventing cheating. It might not be that much of stretch to apply whatever they seem to be doing to combat academic integrity issues. I think I rambled a bit, but I hope that made sense

bodyfour 12y ago

I agree -- visually judging outliers is a pretty poor test of statistical significance. The fact that they sat near each other does give them some weight though. The big problem is that it only works for people who share a fairly unique answer set. In other words, they need to all have a decent number of wrong answers which correlate. What about people at the bottom-right of the graph who had a high correlation simply because they answered nearly all of the questions correctly? Certainly most of them are innocent, but how would we know? It seems this technique can only finger people who cheat and still end up with a mediocre grade, not those who cheat and end up acing the exam.

xkcd-sucks 12y ago

Based on the policies of the two universities at which I've taught, it seems like there's no possible benefit to admitting guilt. The only foolproof way to "convict" someone of cheating is to have (several) people witness/record the incident. If a student accused of cheating categorically denies everything, they're usually in the clear (although faculty will say nasty things in private).

navait 12y ago
Breaking connections to faculty has consequences, namely in letters of recommendation.
- brg 12y ago
  Letters of recommendation have almost no bearing on life. The only exceptions are for someone headed to graduate school, but at that point they likely have a pool of faculty members from which to choose.
dubya 12y ago
This varies between schools. At my current school it's fairly straightforward to say "I saw this student looking at X's paper" and show that the answers are more similar than would be expected. Multiply choice would be harder of course, but free response or incorrect math calculations are pretty convincing. Students have recourse, but the appeals process here is not much work for the faculty member making the accusation until maybe the final level.