6 ms·

Reddit User confirms Siri/Cortana transactions are recorded

94 points by benbristow 12y ago

krick 12y ago
Well, yeah, it might be common knowledge for some, but many don't know, don't care and I enjoy every time it's "revealed" by some community over and over again. But seriously though, is there a way to do something with Android phone (like using third-party firmware, removing some programs, configuring firewall) to be somewhat sure it's "safe" while still being usable?
Irishsteve 12y ago
You can check the audio that Google stores out in - https://history.google.com/history/audio https://history.google.com/history/audio
- error54 12y ago
  You can check out where you've been as well - https://maps.google.com/locationhistory/b/0/ https://maps.google.com/locationhistory/b/0/
- FLUX-YOU 12y ago
  Other useful things that were posted in that thread: https://www.google.com/settings/takeout https://www.google.com/settings/takeout https://www.google.com/settings/dashboard https://www.google.com/settings/dashboard
ebbv 12y ago
A more accurate title would be "Reddit user claims Siri/Cortana transactions are recorded." He doesn't supply any proof.
- LLWM 12y ago
  If someone claimed the sky was blue, would you require them to provide proof before believing them?
  - lolsal 12y ago
    Yes. My observations count as a type of proof.
  - adricnet 12y ago
    Objection: argumentative. And yes, if the claim didn't match with my observations I would expect that they have or be prepared to provide proof in some reaonable form. "Extraordinary claims .." and all that.
    - LLWM 12y ago
      The point is that the claim does match and is not extraordinary in any way.
- hawleyal 12y ago
  This story is old. The user is just confirming it by his experience.
s3r3nity 12y ago
Only "recorded" in the sense that your Google/Bing/Yahoo searches are "recorded," or your browsing history is "recorded". You don't think your Google Now voice searches aren't? I knew that my searches were probably tracked when I started using Cortana (similar to any other search - unless you're using DDG,) and personally I'm ok with it if it results in a great experience for me. And I'm amazed almost daily at how solid Cortana (and Google voice search for that matter) is.
- cortesoft 12y ago
  It is a BIT different to keep a voice recording, because you can recognize a voice recording, unlike a written sentence.
  - falcolas 12y ago
    Not to mention the recording of your surroundings, and audio from before and after the query. Such a recording contains quite a bit more than your average search engine query.
    - slg 12y ago
      And your search engine query can contain your IP address, geographic information, unique browser fingerprint, and your account information if you are logged in. If Google, Apple, Microsoft, or some malicious entity with access to their data wants to identify you, it is likely trivially easy whether through voice or text data.
      - falcolas 12y ago
        Oh, absolutely. The difference is that with voice, they also have the potential to identify the people with you, what you're watching on TV, what radio station is on, etc.
  - SilasX 12y ago
    I'm confident that the usual wiretapping laws will be enforced in this area, just as if an ordinary citizen recorded someone's phone call.
ibejoeb 12y ago
I was under the impression that this was common knowledge. Here's a 2-year-old article about it in Wired: http://www.wired.com/2013/04/siri-two-years/ http://www.wired.com/2013/04/siri-two-years/ --- Once the voice recording is six months old, Apple “disassociates” your user number from the clip, deleting the number from the voice file. But it keeps these disassociated files for up to 18 more months for testing and product improvement purposes. “Apple may keep anonymized Siri data for up to two years,” Muller says “If a user turns Siri off, both identifiers are deleted immediately along with any associated data.” ---
- toomuchtodo 12y ago
  > “Apple may keep anonymized Siri data for up to two years,” Muller says “If a user turns Siri off, both identifiers are deleted immediately along with any associated data.” Would these mean turning off Siri every week/month and then turning it back on would prevent long term storage of your voice data?
  - ntumlin 12y ago
    That's assuming they actually delete the data though.
- RandomBK 12y ago
  If Apple "disassociates" the data, how can they delete the files when a user turns Siri off? Doesn't that imply they still know which piece of data belonged to a certain user?
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
  - manicdee 12y ago
    1) Apple deletes associated data when the user turns Siri off. 2) Apple dis-associates data after six months. 1 & 2 = data older than six months is not deleted, bit is not directly associated with you. So that Siri search for that topic only of interest to communist homosexual terrorist Jews will not have your user ID but might still be identifiable from voice analysis. You can't escape Macarthyism that easily.
chippy 12y ago
I think the main thing from this claim is that the audio is shared with third parties.
- frik 12y ago
  Apple Siri uses Nuance speech recognition technology; afaik Siri run on their server at launch. It seems they outsourced tasks to another company to improve the speech recognition. The classification task that the Reddit user does can be used by Nuance to improve their data. As another Reddit user mentioned that after doing the job for a while you will start recognizing speakers: http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/2wzmmr/everything_youve_ever_said_to_siricortana_has/covn14e http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/2wzmmr/everythin...
  - billyhoffman 12y ago
    There are hundreds of millions of iOS and Android devices out there. If someone is starting to recognize voices, it supports a common sense reaction that a subset of voice commands are being used for QA/QC purposes to improve accuracy.
    - frik 12y ago
      That's definitely the case. Plus there are some heavy users while many users try out Siri/GoogleNow/Cortana just a few times and never come back.
speechduh 12y ago
Uhm, yes, duh. Isn't this common knowledge? How do people think speech recognition systems are trained? What's more upsetting is that this person is so uninformed about speech systems that they think this is weird, AND they have access. The only people who should have access are the people who are actually doing science. Ahhh. Reading clarified it: this is someone who got hired to do transcription. "I'm given an audio file (sound bite) and the corresponding text based translation (how the phone translated the speech). My job is to listen to the file, compare it to the text and provide feed back on how correctly the sound bite was interpreted by the phone. If the text and speech are a perfect match, I just move on. However, if the phone either translated something incorrectly due to a heavy accent or loud background noise, I note that in my evaluation. "
bdcravens 12y ago
Title says "Siri/Cortana", yet a large amount of the discussion revolves around the saved history for Google Now: https://history.google.com/history/audio https://history.google.com/history/audio

94 points by benbristow 12y ago

krick 12y ago

Well, yeah, it might be common knowledge for some, but many don't know, don't care and I enjoy every time it's "revealed" by some community over and over again. But seriously though, is there a way to do something with Android phone (like using third-party firmware, removing some programs, configuring firewall) to be somewhat sure it's "safe" while still being usable?

Irishsteve 12y ago

You can check the audio that Google stores out in - https://history.google.com/history/audio https://history.google.com/history/audio

error54 12y ago
You can check out where you've been as well - https://maps.google.com/locationhistory/b/0/ https://maps.google.com/locationhistory/b/0/
FLUX-YOU 12y ago
Other useful things that were posted in that thread: https://www.google.com/settings/takeout https://www.google.com/settings/takeout https://www.google.com/settings/dashboard https://www.google.com/settings/dashboard

ebbv 12y ago

A more accurate title would be "Reddit user claims Siri/Cortana transactions are recorded." He doesn't supply any proof.

LLWM 12y ago
If someone claimed the sky was blue, would you require them to provide proof before believing them?
- lolsal 12y ago
  Yes. My observations count as a type of proof.
- adricnet 12y ago
  Objection: argumentative. And yes, if the claim didn't match with my observations I would expect that they have or be prepared to provide proof in some reaonable form. "Extraordinary claims .." and all that.
  - LLWM 12y ago
    The point is that the claim does match and is not extraordinary in any way.
hawleyal 12y ago
This story is old. The user is just confirming it by his experience.

s3r3nity 12y ago

Only "recorded" in the sense that your Google/Bing/Yahoo searches are "recorded," or your browsing history is "recorded". You don't think your Google Now voice searches aren't? I knew that my searches were probably tracked when I started using Cortana (similar to any other search - unless you're using DDG,) and personally I'm ok with it if it results in a great experience for me. And I'm amazed almost daily at how solid Cortana (and Google voice search for that matter) is.

cortesoft 12y ago
It is a BIT different to keep a voice recording, because you can recognize a voice recording, unlike a written sentence.
- falcolas 12y ago
  Not to mention the recording of your surroundings, and audio from before and after the query. Such a recording contains quite a bit more than your average search engine query.
  - slg 12y ago
    And your search engine query can contain your IP address, geographic information, unique browser fingerprint, and your account information if you are logged in. If Google, Apple, Microsoft, or some malicious entity with access to their data wants to identify you, it is likely trivially easy whether through voice or text data.
    - falcolas 12y ago
      Oh, absolutely. The difference is that with voice, they also have the potential to identify the people with you, what you're watching on TV, what radio station is on, etc.
- SilasX 12y ago
  I'm confident that the usual wiretapping laws will be enforced in this area, just as if an ordinary citizen recorded someone's phone call.

ibejoeb 12y ago

I was under the impression that this was common knowledge. Here's a 2-year-old article about it in Wired: http://www.wired.com/2013/04/siri-two-years/ http://www.wired.com/2013/04/siri-two-years/ --- Once the voice recording is six months old, Apple “disassociates” your user number from the clip, deleting the number from the voice file. But it keeps these disassociated files for up to 18 more months for testing and product improvement purposes. “Apple may keep anonymized Siri data for up to two years,” Muller says “If a user turns Siri off, both identifiers are deleted immediately along with any associated data.” ---

toomuchtodo 12y ago
> “Apple may keep anonymized Siri data for up to two years,” Muller says “If a user turns Siri off, both identifiers are deleted immediately along with any associated data.” Would these mean turning off Siri every week/month and then turning it back on would prevent long term storage of your voice data?
- ntumlin 12y ago
  That's assuming they actually delete the data though.
RandomBK 12y ago
If Apple "disassociates" the data, how can they delete the files when a user turns Siri off? Doesn't that imply they still know which piece of data belonged to a certain user?
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- manicdee 12y ago
  1) Apple deletes associated data when the user turns Siri off. 2) Apple dis-associates data after six months. 1 & 2 = data older than six months is not deleted, bit is not directly associated with you. So that Siri search for that topic only of interest to communist homosexual terrorist Jews will not have your user ID but might still be identifiable from voice analysis. You can't escape Macarthyism that easily.

chippy 12y ago

I think the main thing from this claim is that the audio is shared with third parties.

frik 12y ago
Apple Siri uses Nuance speech recognition technology; afaik Siri run on their server at launch. It seems they outsourced tasks to another company to improve the speech recognition. The classification task that the Reddit user does can be used by Nuance to improve their data. As another Reddit user mentioned that after doing the job for a while you will start recognizing speakers: http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/2wzmmr/everything_youve_ever_said_to_siricortana_has/covn14e http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/2wzmmr/everythin...
- billyhoffman 12y ago
  There are hundreds of millions of iOS and Android devices out there. If someone is starting to recognize voices, it supports a common sense reaction that a subset of voice commands are being used for QA/QC purposes to improve accuracy.
  - frik 12y ago
    That's definitely the case. Plus there are some heavy users while many users try out Siri/GoogleNow/Cortana just a few times and never come back.

speechduh 12y ago

Uhm, yes, duh. Isn't this common knowledge? How do people think speech recognition systems are trained? What's more upsetting is that this person is so uninformed about speech systems that they think this is weird, AND they have access. The only people who should have access are the people who are actually doing science. Ahhh. Reading clarified it: this is someone who got hired to do transcription. "I'm given an audio file (sound bite) and the corresponding text based translation (how the phone translated the speech). My job is to listen to the file, compare it to the text and provide feed back on how correctly the sound bite was interpreted by the phone. If the text and speech are a perfect match, I just move on. However, if the phone either translated something incorrectly due to a heavy accent or loud background noise, I note that in my evaluation. "

bdcravens 12y ago

Title says "Siri/Cortana", yet a large amount of the discussion revolves around the saved history for Google Now: https://history.google.com/history/audio https://history.google.com/history/audio