11 ms·

Silicon Valley: Abandoned

18 points by Hunchr 17y ago

baguasquirrel 17y ago
Ostensibly, this is good as it means cheap office space. There's a catch though... have any of you folks actually seen these buildings? They're not exactly in nice neighborhoods (I actually used to work next to one of these). Most of them are over the 101 which means it'll be a 15-20 minute drive to downtown for food. While it's true that Google is also past the 101, they can also afford to hire their own chefs. An apartment off of San Antonio/University/MenloAve/Castro/etc. seems preferable. The other bit of trouble is that they're all large office buildings. Are they set up so that they can be rented out by a small shop? I'm pointing at the Yahoo campus buildings in particular.
- Alex3917 17y ago
  "Ostensibly, this is good as it means cheap office space." Cheap office space in a dying empire that smart people are increasingly leaving because its citizens are too shortsighted to realize their economy will collapse if they don't pay for what they've purchased, too racist to let in the next generation of innovators, too stupid to educate their own kids, and too apathetic to fix the problem. Cap-and-trade is probably the last chance to fix the economy of the valley, and frankly it's not looking good right now.
  - grellas 17y ago
    The Valley will not soon be displaced and will do just fine in spite of the larger economic problems - nowhere else in the world will one find such an aggregation of talented entrepreneurs, monied investors, academic expertise, and, above all, critical relationships with those who know startups well and are integrally involved in launching and promoting them. With every cycle (I have seen them all), the Valley takes new shape in its economic drivers, and it will likely do so again this time around. But the tech revolution has fundamentally changed world commerce and is not about to slow down. The Valley remains its epicenter, in spite of any bleak short-term issues. Early-stage startups (my area of specialty) have not slowed but rather increased in the past year, and their quality is up (very often driven by immigrants or first-generation children of immigrants - this is a big change from 25 years ago). The venture-backed part of the startup world has been on hold and will largely remain so for the time being. In time, it too will emerge again, but this will depend on an eventual opening up of the IPO market. The Valley will survive and emerge stronger than ever, in my view. Opportunities for those seeking to launch new startups are as good as they ever have been (and office space is cheap and plentiful, and certainly not just in large office buildings but everywhere).
    - Alex3917 17y ago
      "The Valley will not soon be displaced and will do just fine in spite of the larger economic problems" Which seems more likely in twenty years: A) The CA/US debt, education, and political problems will be fixed B) In the near future Boris Johnson or some other politician who 'gets it' is able to convince their government to pass a series of bills that create the same economic/social conditions that created SV, and over the next twenty years this new area catches up to and surpasses SV despite SV's current massive advantage. As for education, IIRC it was one of the top three issues for every presidential election between 1964 and 2000 and virtually nothing changed. For the past two election cycles it hasn't even been one of the top five issues, and there's no evidence that it's coming back in 2012. The fact is that the vast majority of CA/USians can't read English proficiently, that is well enough to compare and contrast the viewpoints in two different newspaper articles. This means the vast majority of our population is completely useless in the modern economy. Not only are we making zero progress toward fixing this, but there is zero will to fix it. And even in the past when there was tons of will to fix it, it still proved unfixable. As for the CA/US debt, the vast majority of citizens STRONGLY support increasing the debt. A black-gay-atheist would have a better chance at winning the south in the 50s than a presidential candidate who supports the kind of tax increases needed to fix the debt. As for our other political problems, our policies are completely based around made-for-TV soundbites and not academic research. That's why our infrastructure is crumbling, we support torture, we're destroying the value of the dollar, etc. And I see zero sign of this changing. As much as I love SV-- and I still intend on moving there-- let's face the facts, the chances of someplace else catching up to SV are vastly better than the chances of fixing the problems facing the US.
      - skmurphy 17y ago
        Silicon Valley is more than 100 years old. I blogged about this in http://www.skmurphy.com/blog/2008/11/05/steve-blank-on-secret-history-of-silicon-valley-at-chm-nov-20/ http://www.skmurphy.com/blog/2008/11/05/steve-blank-on-secre... but here is one quick data point: California Landmark NO. 836 PIONEER ELECTRONICS RESEARCH LABORATORY - This is the original site of the laboratory and factory of Federal Telegraph Company, founded in 1909 by Cyril F. Elwell. Here, Dr. Lee de Forest, inventor of the three-element radio vacuum tube, devised the first vacuum tube amplifier and oscillator in 1911-13. Worldwide developments based on this research led to modern radio communication, television, and the electronics age. Location: In sidewalk, SE corner of Channing Ave and Emerson St, Palo Alto Radio technologies preceded and prepared the way for electronics and semiconductors, and it was fueled with risk capital.
  - anamax 17y ago
    > Cap-and-trade is basically the last chance to fix the economy of the valley, and frankly it's not looking for good right now. Cap-and-trade is intended to increase govt control and pass out goodies to well-connected folks. It's unclear how either of those will "fix the valley". (Yes, there are well-connected folks in the valley who will benefit, but ....)
    - Alex3917 17y ago
      It's unfortunate that it has proved impossible to get a bill through the house/senate without adding various handouts for specific industries or even companies. That being said, creating a system that assigns a monetary value to each ton of carbon will still create the biggest economic boom in US history. What's more, like the dotcom boom it will be one that anyone can participate in, not just those who are well connected to the government or whatever.
      - protomyth 17y ago
        Where does the money driving the boom come from? I am unclear how increasing the cost of production of good and energy will generate an economic boom.
        Alex3917 17y ago
        First, you're not increasing the cost of goods and energy, you're increasing the cost of carbon. The idea is that the money flows to whoever can create those goods and services using the least carbon. While the cost of goods does go up, the increase is minimal because the system is designed to find the least expensive solution. The money comes in because the entrepreneurs who are able to find the most cost-effective ways to reduce carbon will get billions of dollars. So tons of highly intelligent and competent people will flock to the valley in an attempt to make it rich, creating dozens of public companies and several million jobs in the process.
        deleted 17y ago
        [deleted]
  - anamax 17y ago
    > Cap-and-trade is probably the last chance to fix the economy of the valley, and frankly it's not looking good right now. One way to distinguish folks who actually care about carbon from folks pushing some other agenda is to bring up nuclear. If nuclear is their top short term priority, they're serious about carbon. If it isn't, they're using carbon to push another agenda. And no, it doesn't take a long time to get nuclear on-line. What takes a long time is people-imposed constraints that add nothing to safety, efficiency, etc If those constraints are more important than carbon....
- willwagner 17y ago
  It takes a while for office prices to go down (at least it did in 2000-2001 after the first web crash). It's a great time to renegotiate an existing lease (lower price for a longer contract so you won't bolt after your initial lease expires) but most of those landlords of the big buildings would rather write it off than lower their price dramatically (or break it up in smaller chunks). Another way to go if you have established connections with some larger companies that have downsized is to sublease some cubicle space from them. You lose some of your own identity by being in the middle of a bigger company, but sometimes it can be super cheap and you get some of the amenities of a bigger company like not dealing with phones, internet, security systems, etc. The company wins by offsetting some of their costs (or getting a tiny bit of equity) and just filling up some cubicles has a positive impact on a company's morale.
- timcederman 17y ago
  I used to work right next to Google. It was fine - plenty of small cafes in office parks, and the incredibly awesome Country Deli a 10 minute walk away. I miss those sandwiches a lot.
ryanwaggoner 17y ago
Someone really should have proof-read these captions.
timcederman 17y ago
I can't recommend http://burbed.com http://burbed.com enough for people around here for some good perspective on Silicon Valley real estate.
- albertcardona 17y ago
  The columns remind me of the let's-converge-to-the-classics-in-the-safest-way-possible-because-we-lack-guts-and-imagination in "The Fountainhead", by Ayn Rand.
skmurphy 17y ago
High vacancy in a central location means cheap rents that facilitate face to face interaction. Perhaps there is room for a half dozen different kinds of co-working / hacker dojo spaces that can now afford to come into existence.
steveplace 17y ago
Story Title: Linkbait CRE sucks, but it sucks less in that area.

18 points by Hunchr 17y ago

Ostensibly, this is good as it means cheap office space. There's a catch though... have any of you folks actually seen these buildings? They're not exactly in nice neighborhoods (I actually used to work next to one of these). Most of them are over the 101 which means it'll be a 15-20 minute drive to downtown for food. While it's true that Google is also past the 101, they can also afford to hire their own chefs. An apartment off of San Antonio/University/MenloAve/Castro/etc. seems preferable. The other bit of trouble is that they're all large office buildings. Are they set up so that they can be rented out by a small shop? I'm pointing at the Yahoo campus buildings in particular.

Alex3917 17y ago
"Ostensibly, this is good as it means cheap office space." Cheap office space in a dying empire that smart people are increasingly leaving because its citizens are too shortsighted to realize their economy will collapse if they don't pay for what they've purchased, too racist to let in the next generation of innovators, too stupid to educate their own kids, and too apathetic to fix the problem. Cap-and-trade is probably the last chance to fix the economy of the valley, and frankly it's not looking good right now.
- grellas 17y ago
  The Valley will not soon be displaced and will do just fine in spite of the larger economic problems - nowhere else in the world will one find such an aggregation of talented entrepreneurs, monied investors, academic expertise, and, above all, critical relationships with those who know startups well and are integrally involved in launching and promoting them. With every cycle (I have seen them all), the Valley takes new shape in its economic drivers, and it will likely do so again this time around. But the tech revolution has fundamentally changed world commerce and is not about to slow down. The Valley remains its epicenter, in spite of any bleak short-term issues. Early-stage startups (my area of specialty) have not slowed but rather increased in the past year, and their quality is up (very often driven by immigrants or first-generation children of immigrants - this is a big change from 25 years ago). The venture-backed part of the startup world has been on hold and will largely remain so for the time being. In time, it too will emerge again, but this will depend on an eventual opening up of the IPO market. The Valley will survive and emerge stronger than ever, in my view. Opportunities for those seeking to launch new startups are as good as they ever have been (and office space is cheap and plentiful, and certainly not just in large office buildings but everywhere).
  - Alex3917 17y ago
    "The Valley will not soon be displaced and will do just fine in spite of the larger economic problems" Which seems more likely in twenty years: A) The CA/US debt, education, and political problems will be fixed B) In the near future Boris Johnson or some other politician who 'gets it' is able to convince their government to pass a series of bills that create the same economic/social conditions that created SV, and over the next twenty years this new area catches up to and surpasses SV despite SV's current massive advantage. As for education, IIRC it was one of the top three issues for every presidential election between 1964 and 2000 and virtually nothing changed. For the past two election cycles it hasn't even been one of the top five issues, and there's no evidence that it's coming back in 2012. The fact is that the vast majority of CA/USians can't read English proficiently, that is well enough to compare and contrast the viewpoints in two different newspaper articles. This means the vast majority of our population is completely useless in the modern economy. Not only are we making zero progress toward fixing this, but there is zero will to fix it. And even in the past when there was tons of will to fix it, it still proved unfixable. As for the CA/US debt, the vast majority of citizens STRONGLY support increasing the debt. A black-gay-atheist would have a better chance at winning the south in the 50s than a presidential candidate who supports the kind of tax increases needed to fix the debt. As for our other political problems, our policies are completely based around made-for-TV soundbites and not academic research. That's why our infrastructure is crumbling, we support torture, we're destroying the value of the dollar, etc. And I see zero sign of this changing. As much as I love SV-- and I still intend on moving there-- let's face the facts, the chances of someplace else catching up to SV are vastly better than the chances of fixing the problems facing the US.
    - skmurphy 17y ago
      Silicon Valley is more than 100 years old. I blogged about this in http://www.skmurphy.com/blog/2008/11/05/steve-blank-on-secret-history-of-silicon-valley-at-chm-nov-20/ http://www.skmurphy.com/blog/2008/11/05/steve-blank-on-secre... but here is one quick data point: California Landmark NO. 836 PIONEER ELECTRONICS RESEARCH LABORATORY - This is the original site of the laboratory and factory of Federal Telegraph Company, founded in 1909 by Cyril F. Elwell. Here, Dr. Lee de Forest, inventor of the three-element radio vacuum tube, devised the first vacuum tube amplifier and oscillator in 1911-13. Worldwide developments based on this research led to modern radio communication, television, and the electronics age. Location: In sidewalk, SE corner of Channing Ave and Emerson St, Palo Alto Radio technologies preceded and prepared the way for electronics and semiconductors, and it was fueled with risk capital.
- anamax 17y ago
  > Cap-and-trade is basically the last chance to fix the economy of the valley, and frankly it's not looking for good right now. Cap-and-trade is intended to increase govt control and pass out goodies to well-connected folks. It's unclear how either of those will "fix the valley". (Yes, there are well-connected folks in the valley who will benefit, but ....)
  - Alex3917 17y ago
    It's unfortunate that it has proved impossible to get a bill through the house/senate without adding various handouts for specific industries or even companies. That being said, creating a system that assigns a monetary value to each ton of carbon will still create the biggest economic boom in US history. What's more, like the dotcom boom it will be one that anyone can participate in, not just those who are well connected to the government or whatever.
    - protomyth 17y ago
      Where does the money driving the boom come from? I am unclear how increasing the cost of production of good and energy will generate an economic boom.
      - Alex3917 17y ago
        First, you're not increasing the cost of goods and energy, you're increasing the cost of carbon. The idea is that the money flows to whoever can create those goods and services using the least carbon. While the cost of goods does go up, the increase is minimal because the system is designed to find the least expensive solution. The money comes in because the entrepreneurs who are able to find the most cost-effective ways to reduce carbon will get billions of dollars. So tons of highly intelligent and competent people will flock to the valley in an attempt to make it rich, creating dozens of public companies and several million jobs in the process.
        deleted 17y ago
        [deleted]
- anamax 17y ago
  > Cap-and-trade is probably the last chance to fix the economy of the valley, and frankly it's not looking good right now. One way to distinguish folks who actually care about carbon from folks pushing some other agenda is to bring up nuclear. If nuclear is their top short term priority, they're serious about carbon. If it isn't, they're using carbon to push another agenda. And no, it doesn't take a long time to get nuclear on-line. What takes a long time is people-imposed constraints that add nothing to safety, efficiency, etc If those constraints are more important than carbon....
willwagner 17y ago
It takes a while for office prices to go down (at least it did in 2000-2001 after the first web crash). It's a great time to renegotiate an existing lease (lower price for a longer contract so you won't bolt after your initial lease expires) but most of those landlords of the big buildings would rather write it off than lower their price dramatically (or break it up in smaller chunks). Another way to go if you have established connections with some larger companies that have downsized is to sublease some cubicle space from them. You lose some of your own identity by being in the middle of a bigger company, but sometimes it can be super cheap and you get some of the amenities of a bigger company like not dealing with phones, internet, security systems, etc. The company wins by offsetting some of their costs (or getting a tiny bit of equity) and just filling up some cubicles has a positive impact on a company's morale.
timcederman 17y ago
I used to work right next to Google. It was fine - plenty of small cafes in office parks, and the incredibly awesome Country Deli a 10 minute walk away. I miss those sandwiches a lot.

ryanwaggoner 17y ago

Someone really should have proof-read these captions.

timcederman 17y ago

I can't recommend http://burbed.com http://burbed.com enough for people around here for some good perspective on Silicon Valley real estate.

albertcardona 17y ago
The columns remind me of the let's-converge-to-the-classics-in-the-safest-way-possible-because-we-lack-guts-and-imagination in "The Fountainhead", by Ayn Rand.

skmurphy 17y ago

High vacancy in a central location means cheap rents that facilitate face to face interaction. Perhaps there is room for a half dozen different kinds of co-working / hacker dojo spaces that can now afford to come into existence.

steveplace 17y ago

Story Title: Linkbait CRE sucks, but it sucks less in that area.