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> Also remember that Google brought us HTTP/2 when Microsoft and Apple were completely ignoring the web. You only have that half-right, Microsoft hasn't been i

> Also remember that Google brought us HTTP/2 when Microsoft and Apple were completely ignoring the web. You only have that half-right, Microsoft hasn't been ignoring the web for several years, but Apple still is. The problem for Microsoft is that it can't move the web anymore. The center of gravity is in mobile and they don't have any market share there. Apple doesn't want to move the web, their walled garden is making much more money for them and there's no need for competition.

blinkingled 12y ago
MS still has lion's share of the desktop and enterprise though - they could have put out something open like SPDY with IIS and IE support built in and that would have made a difference.
zghst 12y ago
Apple is damn right for ignoring the web, JS is an extremely immature language (I say that working with it everyday, even with ES6 and experimental ES7 features). Developing a real app with JS, where you have rewrite everything that's already in UIKit, Foundation, etc from the ground up, sucks ass. Your app is automatically slower, less APIs to work with, and is extremely limited in technologies. It can't do layout or many features better than the frameworks that countless engineers at Apple built and work on. It's waaay less about walled garden and more about quality and the philosophy of the web. Is the web supposed to be what many of us want it to be? I love that browsers are being beefed up, but it increases the attack surface for hackers, increases more points of failure in your application because of some weird quirk by one vendor, there will be 20 people with 20 different frameworks and 20 different ways on how to do an app the right way, and most important, newbies will become extremely overwhelmed by the noise and lack of direction in on the platform. If the web was a better platform, apps would not be so successful. But it's not (for now), it sucks so horribly and keeps me frustrated. We need more companies like Facebook (React) and Google (less so because of their scatter brain strategy: Angular, Web Components, Polymer, whatever Gmail and Youtube are built on) that shape the web
rimantas 12y ago
And now you got it completely wrong. Where did stuff like canvas, CSS animations and transforms appeared and who was driving that?
- Touche 12y ago
  Need some updated examples. Those are very old features. It's nice that Apple has done some good things on the Web but they are not a leading actor and we shouldn't pretend that they are.

blinkingled 12y ago

MS still has lion's share of the desktop and enterprise though - they could have put out something open like SPDY with IIS and IE support built in and that would have made a difference.

zghst 12y ago

Apple is damn right for ignoring the web, JS is an extremely immature language (I say that working with it everyday, even with ES6 and experimental ES7 features). Developing a real app with JS, where you have rewrite everything that's already in UIKit, Foundation, etc from the ground up, sucks ass. Your app is automatically slower, less APIs to work with, and is extremely limited in technologies. It can't do layout or many features better than the frameworks that countless engineers at Apple built and work on. It's waaay less about walled garden and more about quality and the philosophy of the web. Is the web supposed to be what many of us want it to be? I love that browsers are being beefed up, but it increases the attack surface for hackers, increases more points of failure in your application because of some weird quirk by one vendor, there will be 20 people with 20 different frameworks and 20 different ways on how to do an app the right way, and most important, newbies will become extremely overwhelmed by the noise and lack of direction in on the platform. If the web was a better platform, apps would not be so successful. But it's not (for now), it sucks so horribly and keeps me frustrated. We need more companies like Facebook (React) and Google (less so because of their scatter brain strategy: Angular, Web Components, Polymer, whatever Gmail and Youtube are built on) that shape the web

rimantas 12y ago

And now you got it completely wrong. Where did stuff like canvas, CSS animations and transforms appeared and who was driving that?

Touche 12y ago
Need some updated examples. Those are very old features. It's nice that Apple has done some good things on the Web but they are not a leading actor and we shouldn't pretend that they are.