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Considering talent, you also must consider the culture of the region. Minnesotans are generally very understated and humble. I have met many people here who at

Considering talent, you also must consider the culture of the region. Minnesotans are generally very understated and humble. I have met many people here who at first blush consider themselves average, but are amazingly talented. There are truly amazing people here. They just aren't broadcasting it--and their not looking for work.

toddgardner 12y ago
I believe most Minnesotans are a little uncomfortable by this attention, and we'd like to go back to quietly making lots of money now.
michaelochurch 12y ago
Agree. There are a lot of semi-offensive comments about "brain drain" and talent level. It's more subtle than that. There is a lot of talent in the Midwest. What you don't get outside of the Bay, at the highest levels of specialty, is a continuous rather than discrete/illiquid market. (New York has a continuous market, but you're competing with Wall Street for anyone good.) This is a pain point for job-seekers and companies looking for talent. If you're looking for someone with 5 years of Clojure experience, production experience with three specific NoSQL products, and an extensive knowledge of the Javascript world... you can find that in SF at some price. In the Midwest, you might have to train up into the role... or, if you're a job seeker, accept an 80% match on the tech stack. It's a quantity rather than quality issue (pound for pound, the talent levels in Minneapolis and San Francisco aren't very different) but this allows employers and job seekers both to be very finicky ("purple unicorn" searches) in the Bay. It also makes it possible in the Bay, if you're adept at this game, to double your comp in a bidding war. It's much harder to start a bidding war in a Midwestern city of 500,000. This "bidding war" effect is also why you see some not-that-talented engineers making a lot of money. In the Bay, you have Haskell engineers at $125k and Java engineers making $300k. Why the inversion? The Java engineer can get 3 employers into a bidding war at the same time; that's nearly impossible to do if you're a Haskell engineer.
- sjg007 12y ago
  java 300k where? and yes please!

toddgardner 12y ago

I believe most Minnesotans are a little uncomfortable by this attention, and we'd like to go back to quietly making lots of money now.

michaelochurch 12y ago

Agree. There are a lot of semi-offensive comments about "brain drain" and talent level. It's more subtle than that. There is a lot of talent in the Midwest. What you don't get outside of the Bay, at the highest levels of specialty, is a continuous rather than discrete/illiquid market. (New York has a continuous market, but you're competing with Wall Street for anyone good.) This is a pain point for job-seekers and companies looking for talent. If you're looking for someone with 5 years of Clojure experience, production experience with three specific NoSQL products, and an extensive knowledge of the Javascript world... you can find that in SF at some price. In the Midwest, you might have to train up into the role... or, if you're a job seeker, accept an 80% match on the tech stack. It's a quantity rather than quality issue (pound for pound, the talent levels in Minneapolis and San Francisco aren't very different) but this allows employers and job seekers both to be very finicky ("purple unicorn" searches) in the Bay. It also makes it possible in the Bay, if you're adept at this game, to double your comp in a bidding war. It's much harder to start a bidding war in a Midwestern city of 500,000. This "bidding war" effect is also why you see some not-that-talented engineers making a lot of money. In the Bay, you have Haskell engineers at $125k and Java engineers making $300k. Why the inversion? The Java engineer can get 3 employers into a bidding war at the same time; that's nearly impossible to do if you're a Haskell engineer.

sjg007 12y ago
java 300k where? and yes please!