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The question I was answering above was "why Saudi Arabia and not Iran? Aren't they both bad?" Regarding your other points, I'll answer them below (and I admit m

by olympus 12y ago

The question I was answering above was "why Saudi Arabia and not Iran? Aren't they both bad?" Regarding your other points, I'll answer them below (and I admit my attitude upfront on the first one, you just posted that you are frustrated with people with a willful blind spot and then you give me #1): 1. Iran's calling for the death of Israel and the USA is just a single missed translation? Give me a break. A news article from five days ago: "As usual, Iranians chanted "Death to America" and also denounced Israel." http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/02/11/385396449/on-.. http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/02/11/385396449/on-.... It's a slogan over there: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_to_America http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_to_America. And they aren't alone in their rhetoric. North Korea says it too. And guess what? We've isolated them as much as we can as well. The countries that are willing to openly say "Death to America" are ones that haven't matured enough on the world stage to realize that you should say one thing and do another. The rhetoric alone isn't enough to start a war, but their actions aren't that innocent. Iran's first "blue water navy" excursion was planned to sail all the way to the coast of the USA and enter our territorial waters, just to say that they could (but their ship didn't make it). They built a mock US aircraft carrier and practiced shooting anti-ship missiles at it. They aren't just talking big, they are actively posturing as the opposition to the US influence in the region. 2. Yeah, Israel does some stuff. The Jews have killed a lot of people (even going back to biblical times). They usually get a pass because they are seen as the "small fry" backed into a corner by all the Muslim countries surrounding them. It isn't true, but that is the story that is spun. Similar to how we treat the Saudis, we let Israel get away with a lot of things that we should probably put a stop to--seriously, pretty much anybody with sense can see that compromise is the best way to solve the Israel/Palestine issue, but when two peoples hate each other that much, sometimes it's easier to watch them punch it out. If you try to break up a fight, you risk getting punched yourself. And besides, we don't get along with the Israelis as much as most people think. Seriously, we share more intel with New Zealand than we do with Israel.

lars 12y ago
About the "Death to America" phrase - that doesn't really have the meaning you ascribe to it. Taxi drivers in Tehran will mumble "Death to traffic" - it's a figure of speech that's much milder than it's literal interpretation. If you were to say "goddamn Iranians", the literal interpretation would be that you wish for Iranians to burn and suffer for eternity in the depths of hell. Of course, what you're actually saying is something much milder.
discardorama 12y ago
> "As usual, Iranians chanted "Death to America" and also denounced Israel." The "As usual" should tell you that it is nothing new. It started back in 1979 after their revolution; and you must admit that the US did some really shady things in Iran leading up to the revolution (including the overthrow of Mossadegh). I would really recommend you watch Rick Steves' trip to Iran. The people there are much more liberal than almost any other middle-eastern country, and most don't harbor ill-will towards America; despite the fact that we did everything short of active combat for Iraq in the Iran-Iraq war! No one can estimate the number of Iranians killed based on US intel and US support. And while you do quote "death to america" repeatedly, how about all the threats that everyone from McCain to Bush to Obama have hurled at Iran? "All options are on the table" ... "military force can be used" ... etc. etc. And what about the sanctions? Nations would be within their rights to consider sanctions an "act of war". And Stuxnet? If Iran did the same to us? Obama has stated explicitly that a "cyberattack" would be considered an act of war!!
saiya-jin 12y ago
Subjective experience here - been in Iran (Tehran, Isfahan, Yazd and places between those, backpacking & mountaineering). I think we all know better than to judge whole country of 80 million based on few radicals that are conveniently showed in TV? I have met several hundred people, most were very fond of west, US too (that surprised me), few didn't care and there was exactly 1 taxi driver in Isfahan, who asked me if I knew Obama - because he is war criminal... arguably not very bright type :) Maybe my experience isn't representative of the whole country, but few people screaming Death to america aren't either. We get it, you (US) want influence there, because of oil. And because of... oil. You don't like that there is actually somebody who doesn't care that much and isn't afraid. A bit egoistic, and I don't get what do you expect to get in long term, except for keeping whole region unstable, with weak rulers who bow in front of you... ah wait

by olympus 12y ago

lars 12y ago

About the "Death to America" phrase - that doesn't really have the meaning you ascribe to it. Taxi drivers in Tehran will mumble "Death to traffic" - it's a figure of speech that's much milder than it's literal interpretation. If you were to say "goddamn Iranians", the literal interpretation would be that you wish for Iranians to burn and suffer for eternity in the depths of hell. Of course, what you're actually saying is something much milder.

discardorama 12y ago

> "As usual, Iranians chanted "Death to America" and also denounced Israel." The "As usual" should tell you that it is nothing new. It started back in 1979 after their revolution; and you must admit that the US did some really shady things in Iran leading up to the revolution (including the overthrow of Mossadegh). I would really recommend you watch Rick Steves' trip to Iran. The people there are much more liberal than almost any other middle-eastern country, and most don't harbor ill-will towards America; despite the fact that we did everything short of active combat for Iraq in the Iran-Iraq war! No one can estimate the number of Iranians killed based on US intel and US support. And while you do quote "death to america" repeatedly, how about all the threats that everyone from McCain to Bush to Obama have hurled at Iran? "All options are on the table" ... "military force can be used" ... etc. etc. And what about the sanctions? Nations would be within their rights to consider sanctions an "act of war". And Stuxnet? If Iran did the same to us? Obama has stated explicitly that a "cyberattack" would be considered an act of war!!

saiya-jin 12y ago

Subjective experience here - been in Iran (Tehran, Isfahan, Yazd and places between those, backpacking & mountaineering). I think we all know better than to judge whole country of 80 million based on few radicals that are conveniently showed in TV? I have met several hundred people, most were very fond of west, US too (that surprised me), few didn't care and there was exactly 1 taxi driver in Isfahan, who asked me if I knew Obama - because he is war criminal... arguably not very bright type :) Maybe my experience isn't representative of the whole country, but few people screaming Death to america aren't either. We get it, you (US) want influence there, because of oil. And because of... oil. You don't like that there is actually somebody who doesn't care that much and isn't afraid. A bit egoistic, and I don't get what do you expect to get in long term, except for keeping whole region unstable, with weak rulers who bow in front of you... ah wait