4 ms·

Sidenote: it's so weird the English language uses the same word "justice" for the legal system and the moral concept. In German for example the two are differen

by pluma 12y ago

Sidenote: it's so weird the English language uses the same word "justice" for the legal system and the moral concept. In German for example the two are different, making it easy to explain to people how the legal system is about equal application of the law, not personal closure. The domain "justice.gov" just sounds like propaganda (imagine "freedom.gov") to me as a non-native speaker who mostly hears the term used in that second (moral) meaning.

lucb1e 12y ago
I'm not sure which German words you are referring to, but as a Dutch person "justice.gov" sounds like propaganda to me too.
- mrottenkolber 12y ago
  Die Gerechtigkeit und das Recht? Not sure but could be.
  - pluma 12y ago
    Gerechtigkeit (moral justice) and Justiz (the justice system). Recht is actually in a similar spot as justice: Recht can mean "law" (as in Rechtsstaat, "state of laws") or "right" (as in Menschenrechte, "human rights").
  - ptaipale 12y ago
    Or perhaps die Gerechtigkeit und die Justiz. But I must say that in my ear, "Department of Corrections" sounds perhaps even more like propaganda, or doublespeak...
bhayden 12y ago
I'm an American, when I think "justice system" I think of justice not on a personal level, but on a punishment level. Justice is having a punishment that fits the crime. If someone wanted personal justice, I think they usually qualify it with "personal" before "justice".
- pluma 12y ago
  Interesting. I don't think of the justice system as concerning punishment at all. The primary functions to me are rehabilitation and prevention (via incapacitation). Even though my view certainly isn't representative, it seems to me that American culture is far more concerned with punishment or retribution than rehabilitation than we are in Germany. Sure, we have tabloids calling for "severe punishments" as well, but in general the system seems to be far more concerned with protecting the public (and maybe converting the criminal to a law-abiding citizen in the process).
  - bhayden 12y ago
    The prison system in the US is designed to create repeat offenders. This is because we have a lot of for-profit prisons that benefit from repeat offenders. There is no rehabilitation going on, I assure you. Quite the opposite is true.
    - pluma 12y ago
      Unsurprising, especially with how prison rape seems to be considered par for the course in the public conscience. The only thing that confuses me is how the public doesn't seem to mind, especially when it comes to young black men (who seem to be considered criminals a priori these days).

by pluma 12y ago

lucb1e 12y ago

I'm not sure which German words you are referring to, but as a Dutch person "justice.gov" sounds like propaganda to me too.

mrottenkolber 12y ago
Die Gerechtigkeit und das Recht? Not sure but could be.
- pluma 12y ago
  Gerechtigkeit (moral justice) and Justiz (the justice system). Recht is actually in a similar spot as justice: Recht can mean "law" (as in Rechtsstaat, "state of laws") or "right" (as in Menschenrechte, "human rights").
- ptaipale 12y ago
  Or perhaps die Gerechtigkeit und die Justiz. But I must say that in my ear, "Department of Corrections" sounds perhaps even more like propaganda, or doublespeak...

bhayden 12y ago

I'm an American, when I think "justice system" I think of justice not on a personal level, but on a punishment level. Justice is having a punishment that fits the crime. If someone wanted personal justice, I think they usually qualify it with "personal" before "justice".

pluma 12y ago
Interesting. I don't think of the justice system as concerning punishment at all. The primary functions to me are rehabilitation and prevention (via incapacitation). Even though my view certainly isn't representative, it seems to me that American culture is far more concerned with punishment or retribution than rehabilitation than we are in Germany. Sure, we have tabloids calling for "severe punishments" as well, but in general the system seems to be far more concerned with protecting the public (and maybe converting the criminal to a law-abiding citizen in the process).
- bhayden 12y ago
  The prison system in the US is designed to create repeat offenders. This is because we have a lot of for-profit prisons that benefit from repeat offenders. There is no rehabilitation going on, I assure you. Quite the opposite is true.
  - pluma 12y ago
    Unsurprising, especially with how prison rape seems to be considered par for the course in the public conscience. The only thing that confuses me is how the public doesn't seem to mind, especially when it comes to young black men (who seem to be considered criminals a priori these days).