5 ms·

Brain Wound Eliminates Man's Mental Illness (1988)

47 points by denysonique 12y ago

ghshephard 12y ago
Reading through the treatment, it seems somewhat perilous to reproduce in the manner described. One would hope that a surgical treatment replicating the effects (if not the exact manner) of this cure could be researched - thought that to is not without it's challenges...
- meowface 12y ago
  It's no different from a lobotomy. It has a decent chance of correcting the targeted affliction, but with destructive side effects often far worse than the original condition. In some rare cases lobotomies successfully treated mental illness without impacting functioning in other ways though, just like what happened here.
  - ars 12y ago
    In concept no. But it's more targeted so might work better.
- PhasmaFelis 12y ago
  It appears that it already exists, according to the last paragraph: > As a last resort, neurosurgeons will occasionally remove part of the left front lobe of the brain, where the obsessive behavior is thought to originate. The operation is probably performed between 10 and 30 times a year in the United States, with mixed results, said Dr. Thomas Ballantine of Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston.
RandomCode 12y ago
God is perfectly just. Not even suicide will let you niggers get away from damnation.
spitfire 12y ago
I can't help but think of surgical tamping rods.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
ccleve 12y ago
The most famous similar case is that of Phineas Gage. The brain injuries he suffered were of enormous importance to science. The whole story is fascinating. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage
- arbuge 12y ago
  Gage went in the other direction, from well balanced to exhibiting many negative qualities. He survived, but other than that I'm not sure it was very positive for him personally.
edgarvm 12y ago
old news: February 25, 1988
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- dang 12y ago
  Old news is welcome on Hacker News.
paulsutter 12y ago
So there are 1.5 million brain injuries per year in the US[1], and they found one with a positive outcome. Publication bias[2] is the most charitable explanation, but really it shows that even the New York Times is prone to sensationalism[3] [1] https://www.braintrauma.org/tbi-faqs/tbi-statistics/ https://www.braintrauma.org/tbi-faqs/tbi-statistics/ [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_bias http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_bias [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sensationalism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sensationalism EDIT: No that does NOT make it interesting. It suggests that it would take order of 1.5 million more brain injuries to reproduce it. Hardly a medical advance.
- coldtea 12y ago
  >So there are 1.5 million brain injuries per year in the US[1], and they found one with a positive outcome. Which is what makes it interesting, duh!
- azakai 12y ago
  Did they claim the positive outcome indicated a medical advance of any sort? Perhaps I missed it.
- chockablock 12y ago
  You have deeply missed the point of this case report. We don't know what causes OCD (and we knew even less when this kid shot himself in 1983; the paper was not written until 5 years later). When you get spontaneous remission due to an injury, that is a hint that the damaged region might be important in the disease process. Unusual cases like these have the potential to rapidly accelerate our understanding of disease, which is why medical journals still publish case reports. No one is proposing treating OCD with firearms.
  - paulsutter 12y ago
    Funny, you and I agree that we don't know what causes OCD, but the article states flat out that the damaged portion of his brain is responsible for OCD. That's the only medical-ish claim in the article, it's made with no references, and you still think this article is useful?
chockablock 12y ago
As of 2014, deep brain stimulation (DBS, think pacemaker for the brain) is formally recommended in the US for treatment-resistant OCD. http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/282899.php http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/282899.php In the SF Bay area, Stanford, UCSF and Kaiser all have very active DBS practices treating a range of conditions. https://stanfordhealthcare.org/medical-clinics/deep-brain-stimulation-program/conditions.html https://stanfordhealthcare.org/medical-clinics/deep-brain-st... http://neurosurgery.ucsf.edu/index.php/deep-brain-stimulation-for-OCD.html http://neurosurgery.ucsf.edu/index.php/deep-brain-stimulatio...
- TheMakeA 12y ago
  Wow, UCSF has a pretty long list of requirements before this is an option!
- jsm386 12y ago
  For some perspective NIH has a fairly straightforward overview of the various Brain Stimulation Therapies being practiced today @ http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/brain-stimulation-therapies/brain-stimulation-therapies.shtml http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/brain-stimulation-ther...
mrleinad 12y ago
"Brain Wound Eliminates Man's Mental Illness".. doesn't this sum up all neurosurgery in a single sentence? Or aren't surgical procedures "inflicted wounds"?
- jtheory 12y ago
  Neurosurgery attempting to treat mental illness is called "pschosurgery". It tends to be a bit chilling to read about, and not really popular these days. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosurgery http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosurgery
mikepalmer 12y ago
WTF, I love you too, mom.
gokulg 12y ago
miracle ?
stretchwithme 12y ago
Isn't that how radial keratotomy, the forerunner of lasik, got started? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radial_keratotomy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radial_keratotomy
nashashmi 12y ago
> George had also retained the same I.Q. he had before becoming ill, Dr. Solyum said, and he returned to school, got a new job and is now in his second year of college. #3% in U.S. May Be Compulsive The story was also reported in today's issue of The Los Angeles Times. I don't think he could have done so well in college if he did not have OCD in the beginning. The OCD got severe so he opted for suicide. So what is the real lesson here? Let mental illnesses do their thing until they get out of hand? And then perform surgery to remove what made them gifted in the first place so their gifts could reign unfettered? Or something else? Like incredible powers (mental illnesses) be given incredibly powerful management techniques for restraint. Isn't that how management works with highly talented members who are restrained from going too deep?
- jsprogrammer 12y ago
  >I don't think he could have done so well in college if he did not have OCD in the beginning. Why do you say that? >So what is the real lesson here? Let mental illnesses do their thing until they get out of hand? And then perform surgery to remove what made them gifted in the first place so their gifts could reign unfettered? According to the article he seemed to retain whatever "gifts" he may have (had).
galago 12y ago
Is he still alive? How is he doing?!!
sfttemp88 12y ago
I have literally become a phd in OCD., and this is how I got rid of it, or at least it's not hindering my life like before., obviously in addition to some med. So the point is, read as much as you can, and try to master the OCD like a physic, my phsic told me, you know more than me. though he had 50 years experience. How this help, after all what you read is going in the brain, after excessive study, your brain would reach a point, where it would be aware, the you have OCD, this is where, the things start to go from good to better. If you are unable to deep consciousness that you have OCD, it would overcome again and again. In short, it's the mental illness, and only your brain can fix it. You just need make your brain realize that you have a problem, once the brain deeply acknowledge it, it will fix it. Once your brain acknowledges, it would a lot easy to shift your focus away. Shifting focus away from the OCD thought is the key for elimination. If you get OCD thought shift your focus, but it's easier said than done, you can only do it, once your brain has acknowledged you have OCD. and for that you have to deeply study OCD
aaron695 12y ago
DOI: 10.1192/bjp.151.6.855 http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/151/6/855 http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/151/6/855 Obviously the real story is not as simplistic. Newspapers in 1988 are the same as today, full of just so stories. That said, the real story is quite interesting and sad if you have access to the article.

47 points by denysonique 12y ago

Reading through the treatment, it seems somewhat perilous to reproduce in the manner described. One would hope that a surgical treatment replicating the effects (if not the exact manner) of this cure could be researched - thought that to is not without it's challenges...

meowface 12y ago
It's no different from a lobotomy. It has a decent chance of correcting the targeted affliction, but with destructive side effects often far worse than the original condition. In some rare cases lobotomies successfully treated mental illness without impacting functioning in other ways though, just like what happened here.
- ars 12y ago
  In concept no. But it's more targeted so might work better.
PhasmaFelis 12y ago
It appears that it already exists, according to the last paragraph: > As a last resort, neurosurgeons will occasionally remove part of the left front lobe of the brain, where the obsessive behavior is thought to originate. The operation is probably performed between 10 and 30 times a year in the United States, with mixed results, said Dr. Thomas Ballantine of Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston.

RandomCode 12y ago

God is perfectly just. Not even suicide will let you niggers get away from damnation.

spitfire 12y ago

I can't help but think of surgical tamping rods.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

ccleve 12y ago

The most famous similar case is that of Phineas Gage. The brain injuries he suffered were of enormous importance to science. The whole story is fascinating. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage

arbuge 12y ago
Gage went in the other direction, from well balanced to exhibiting many negative qualities. He survived, but other than that I'm not sure it was very positive for him personally.

edgarvm 12y ago

old news: February 25, 1988

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
dang 12y ago
Old news is welcome on Hacker News.

paulsutter 12y ago

So there are 1.5 million brain injuries per year in the US[1], and they found one with a positive outcome. Publication bias[2] is the most charitable explanation, but really it shows that even the New York Times is prone to sensationalism[3] [1] https://www.braintrauma.org/tbi-faqs/tbi-statistics/ https://www.braintrauma.org/tbi-faqs/tbi-statistics/ [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_bias http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Publication_bias [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sensationalism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sensationalism EDIT: No that does NOT make it interesting. It suggests that it would take order of 1.5 million more brain injuries to reproduce it. Hardly a medical advance.

coldtea 12y ago
>So there are 1.5 million brain injuries per year in the US[1], and they found one with a positive outcome. Which is what makes it interesting, duh!
azakai 12y ago
Did they claim the positive outcome indicated a medical advance of any sort? Perhaps I missed it.
chockablock 12y ago
You have deeply missed the point of this case report. We don't know what causes OCD (and we knew even less when this kid shot himself in 1983; the paper was not written until 5 years later). When you get spontaneous remission due to an injury, that is a hint that the damaged region might be important in the disease process. Unusual cases like these have the potential to rapidly accelerate our understanding of disease, which is why medical journals still publish case reports. No one is proposing treating OCD with firearms.
- paulsutter 12y ago
  Funny, you and I agree that we don't know what causes OCD, but the article states flat out that the damaged portion of his brain is responsible for OCD. That's the only medical-ish claim in the article, it's made with no references, and you still think this article is useful?

chockablock 12y ago

As of 2014, deep brain stimulation (DBS, think pacemaker for the brain) is formally recommended in the US for treatment-resistant OCD. http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/282899.php http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/282899.php In the SF Bay area, Stanford, UCSF and Kaiser all have very active DBS practices treating a range of conditions. https://stanfordhealthcare.org/medical-clinics/deep-brain-stimulation-program/conditions.html https://stanfordhealthcare.org/medical-clinics/deep-brain-st... http://neurosurgery.ucsf.edu/index.php/deep-brain-stimulation-for-OCD.html http://neurosurgery.ucsf.edu/index.php/deep-brain-stimulatio...

TheMakeA 12y ago
Wow, UCSF has a pretty long list of requirements before this is an option!
jsm386 12y ago
For some perspective NIH has a fairly straightforward overview of the various Brain Stimulation Therapies being practiced today @ http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/brain-stimulation-therapies/brain-stimulation-therapies.shtml http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/brain-stimulation-ther...

mrleinad 12y ago

"Brain Wound Eliminates Man's Mental Illness".. doesn't this sum up all neurosurgery in a single sentence? Or aren't surgical procedures "inflicted wounds"?

jtheory 12y ago
Neurosurgery attempting to treat mental illness is called "pschosurgery". It tends to be a bit chilling to read about, and not really popular these days. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosurgery http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosurgery

mikepalmer 12y ago

WTF, I love you too, mom.

gokulg 12y ago

miracle ?

stretchwithme 12y ago

Isn't that how radial keratotomy, the forerunner of lasik, got started? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radial_keratotomy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radial_keratotomy

nashashmi 12y ago

> George had also retained the same I.Q. he had before becoming ill, Dr. Solyum said, and he returned to school, got a new job and is now in his second year of college. #3% in U.S. May Be Compulsive The story was also reported in today's issue of The Los Angeles Times. I don't think he could have done so well in college if he did not have OCD in the beginning. The OCD got severe so he opted for suicide. So what is the real lesson here? Let mental illnesses do their thing until they get out of hand? And then perform surgery to remove what made them gifted in the first place so their gifts could reign unfettered? Or something else? Like incredible powers (mental illnesses) be given incredibly powerful management techniques for restraint. Isn't that how management works with highly talented members who are restrained from going too deep?

jsprogrammer 12y ago
>I don't think he could have done so well in college if he did not have OCD in the beginning. Why do you say that? >So what is the real lesson here? Let mental illnesses do their thing until they get out of hand? And then perform surgery to remove what made them gifted in the first place so their gifts could reign unfettered? According to the article he seemed to retain whatever "gifts" he may have (had).

galago 12y ago

Is he still alive? How is he doing?!!

sfttemp88 12y ago

I have literally become a phd in OCD., and this is how I got rid of it, or at least it's not hindering my life like before., obviously in addition to some med. So the point is, read as much as you can, and try to master the OCD like a physic, my phsic told me, you know more than me. though he had 50 years experience. How this help, after all what you read is going in the brain, after excessive study, your brain would reach a point, where it would be aware, the you have OCD, this is where, the things start to go from good to better. If you are unable to deep consciousness that you have OCD, it would overcome again and again. In short, it's the mental illness, and only your brain can fix it. You just need make your brain realize that you have a problem, once the brain deeply acknowledge it, it will fix it. Once your brain acknowledges, it would a lot easy to shift your focus away. Shifting focus away from the OCD thought is the key for elimination. If you get OCD thought shift your focus, but it's easier said than done, you can only do it, once your brain has acknowledged you have OCD. and for that you have to deeply study OCD

aaron695 12y ago

DOI: 10.1192/bjp.151.6.855 http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/151/6/855 http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/151/6/855 Obviously the real story is not as simplistic. Newspapers in 1988 are the same as today, full of just so stories. That said, the real story is quite interesting and sad if you have access to the article.