11 ms·

French guy here as well, and this was exactly my reaction. It seemed very exotic, this notion that an employer was allowed to fire you just because a bunch of p

by a3_nm 12y ago

French guy here as well, and this was exactly my reaction. It seemed very exotic, this notion that an employer was allowed to fire you just because a bunch of people on the Internet have started disliking you in a vocal way because of something you said (as an individual, not reflecting your employer's opinion, not illegal). This feels like the main issue here. Barring substantial improvements in everyone's maturity, you won't be able to prevent random people on the Internet from focusing on you for whatever reason. The actual individual actions that follow, however (the employer arbitrarily sacking you, people refusing you service, people harassing you, etc.) are what crosses the line, in my opinion.

audessuscest 12y ago
you're wrong, this happened in France too, and it happened a lot last year : http://rue89.nouvelobs.com/2014/01/02/quenelle-nabil-perd-emploi-sans-comprendre-pourquoi-248704 http://rue89.nouvelobs.com/2014/01/02/quenelle-nabil-perd-em... just one example...
- rihegher 12y ago
  Ok but when I wrote fired, I was thinking about permanent position (CDI). The article state that he has been forced to quit his job rather than being fired, which is not really clear. His position may has just been a seasonal one as the place he was working in is apparently opened during summer only.
mintplant 12y ago
You might not be fired, but you can be arrested for expressing an inappropriate opinion in France. See the string of recent arrests over comments people made about the Charlie Hebdo shootings.
- rihegher 12y ago
  Really? I'll be interested in sources then, because I've just never heard of such things in France. From what I know even well known public figures that has been sentenced about innapropriate expressions just had been fined (Le pen) or had their show cancelled in some cities (Dieudonné)
  - zimbu668 12y ago
    I don't know about people being arrested for comments about Charlie Hebdo, but people have been fined and imprisoned for statements about the Holocaust: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_against_Holocaust_denial#Prosecutions_and_convictions http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_against_Holocaust_denial#P...
    - rihegher 12y ago
      Thank you very much. The english version of wikipedia state that Roger Garaudy and Jean Plantin has been jailed whereas the french version of their wikipedia pages state they hasn't been. So it would be good to have reliable sources. BUT you actually pointed me to a guy that has been an exception to both of my statements. Vincent Reynouard has been jailed for revisionism after having published a book and a video tape about the massacre of small village in south of France during War World 2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oradour-sur-Glane https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oradour-sur-Glane And even before that he lost his job as a teacher because he had some revisionist document on its work computer http://www.liberation.fr/france/1997/04/23/le-prof-revisionniste-de-honfleur-revoque_201922 http://www.liberation.fr/france/1997/04/23/le-prof-revisionn... So he is really the exception which proves the rule.
  - mintplant 12y ago
    Sure thing. France: Dieudonné sera jugé pour «apologie de terrorisme» http://www.rfi.fr/france/20150114-france-dieudonne-sera-juge-apologie-terrorisme-renvoye-correctionnelle/ http://www.rfi.fr/france/20150114-france-dieudonne-sera-juge... France arrests 54 for ‘defending terrorism’ after Charlie Hebdo attack The Justice Ministry said that 54 people, including four minors, have been detained for defending or verbally threatening terrorism since the Charlie Hebdo attack. Several have already been convicted under special measures for immediate sentencing. http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/1/14/france-charliehebdoarrests.html http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/1/14/france-charl... France arrests 54 in hate speech crackdown, boosts anti-ISIS support http://www.cbsnews.com/news/french-lawmakers-approve-more-airstrikes-against-isis/ http://www.cbsnews.com/news/french-lawmakers-approve-more-ai... French Comedian Dieudonne Goes On Trial For 'Defending Terrorism' http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/02/04/383767811/french-comedian-dieudonne-goes-on-trial-for-defending-terrorism http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/02/04/383767811/fre... Why French Law Treats Dieudonné and Charlie Hebdo Differently http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/french-law-treats-dieudonne-charlie-hebdo-differently http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/french-law-treats-di...

by a3_nm 12y ago

audessuscest 12y ago

you're wrong, this happened in France too, and it happened a lot last year : http://rue89.nouvelobs.com/2014/01/02/quenelle-nabil-perd-emploi-sans-comprendre-pourquoi-248704 http://rue89.nouvelobs.com/2014/01/02/quenelle-nabil-perd-em... just one example...

rihegher 12y ago
Ok but when I wrote fired, I was thinking about permanent position (CDI). The article state that he has been forced to quit his job rather than being fired, which is not really clear. His position may has just been a seasonal one as the place he was working in is apparently opened during summer only.

mintplant 12y ago

You might not be fired, but you can be arrested for expressing an inappropriate opinion in France. See the string of recent arrests over comments people made about the Charlie Hebdo shootings.

rihegher 12y ago
Really? I'll be interested in sources then, because I've just never heard of such things in France. From what I know even well known public figures that has been sentenced about innapropriate expressions just had been fined (Le pen) or had their show cancelled in some cities (Dieudonné)
- zimbu668 12y ago
  I don't know about people being arrested for comments about Charlie Hebdo, but people have been fined and imprisoned for statements about the Holocaust: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_against_Holocaust_denial#Prosecutions_and_convictions http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_against_Holocaust_denial#P...
  - rihegher 12y ago
    Thank you very much. The english version of wikipedia state that Roger Garaudy and Jean Plantin has been jailed whereas the french version of their wikipedia pages state they hasn't been. So it would be good to have reliable sources. BUT you actually pointed me to a guy that has been an exception to both of my statements. Vincent Reynouard has been jailed for revisionism after having published a book and a video tape about the massacre of small village in south of France during War World 2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oradour-sur-Glane https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oradour-sur-Glane And even before that he lost his job as a teacher because he had some revisionist document on its work computer http://www.liberation.fr/france/1997/04/23/le-prof-revisionniste-de-honfleur-revoque_201922 http://www.liberation.fr/france/1997/04/23/le-prof-revisionn... So he is really the exception which proves the rule.
- mintplant 12y ago
  Sure thing. France: Dieudonné sera jugé pour «apologie de terrorisme» http://www.rfi.fr/france/20150114-france-dieudonne-sera-juge-apologie-terrorisme-renvoye-correctionnelle/ http://www.rfi.fr/france/20150114-france-dieudonne-sera-juge... France arrests 54 for ‘defending terrorism’ after Charlie Hebdo attack The Justice Ministry said that 54 people, including four minors, have been detained for defending or verbally threatening terrorism since the Charlie Hebdo attack. Several have already been convicted under special measures for immediate sentencing. http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/1/14/france-charliehebdoarrests.html http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/1/14/france-charl... France arrests 54 in hate speech crackdown, boosts anti-ISIS support http://www.cbsnews.com/news/french-lawmakers-approve-more-airstrikes-against-isis/ http://www.cbsnews.com/news/french-lawmakers-approve-more-ai... French Comedian Dieudonne Goes On Trial For 'Defending Terrorism' http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/02/04/383767811/french-comedian-dieudonne-goes-on-trial-for-defending-terrorism http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/02/04/383767811/fre... Why French Law Treats Dieudonné and Charlie Hebdo Differently http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/french-law-treats-dieudonne-charlie-hebdo-differently http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/french-law-treats-di...