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There won't be one. Bigotry cannot be fought with facts. While some forms of obesity have been linked to physical health and or genetic factors, even if you di

There won't be one. Bigotry cannot be fought with facts. While some forms of obesity have been linked to physical health and or genetic factors, even if you discount that the remaining research has suggested it is a mental health disorder not that dissimilar from e.g. alcoholism, exercise addiction, sex addiction, drug addiction, smoking, and so on. Essentially food causes pleasure centres in the brain to fire, these make people feel less depressed, tired, or just happier in general. So food is often used to treat depression, which unfortunately as the person gains weight can cause both tiredness, lethargy, and depression to grow, so they need even more food to fight it (rinse, repeat). But all this won't change perception, because perception isn't about facts. For example, homophobes don't hate gay people for any logical reason that you can fight with facts and evidence, it is deeper than that. You have to deal with the core of their hate, which is often self-hate, or fear. Ultimately these are people picking on others with a mental health issue. It only makes the depression worse. But they rationalise their bullying as "helping" (even if there is evidence that it hurts, not helps), but really this all comes from a core of self-hate or fear, rather than any logical part.

morganvachon 12y ago
I'm curious what your opinion of diabetes is then; is that simply a "food addiction" too?
- UnoriginalGuy 12y ago
  I literally don't understand what it is you're asking me. Type-2 diabetes is a disease. One which has both genetic factors (e.g. some families get it more than other families) and non-genetic factors (e.g. unhealthy food consumption, heavy sugary food consumption). Food addiction is a mental health issue that causes people to over-consume foods. These foods are often chosen to give the best "buzz" (so often high in sugar, high in salt, etc). Having a food addiction, if untreated, could increase a person's likelihood of getting type-2 diabetes. In the same way that having a heroin addiction could increase someone's likelihood of having a stroke or heart attack.
  - morganvachon 12y ago
    I apologize, I misread your comment about mental health as being the only cause of obesity, and that's not what you are saying. I just re-read your original comment and realized that. Please excuse my lack of reading comprehension today.
dragonwriter 12y ago
> While some forms of obesity have been linked to physical health and or genetic factors, even if you discount that the remaining research has suggested it is a mental health disorder not that dissimilar from e.g. alcoholism, exercise addiction, sex addiction, drug addiction, smoking, and so on. The research on alcohol, drug, and other addictions seems to indicate that they are physical health disorders -- often with substantial genetic contributions -- and, in fact, the entire idea of separate "mental health disorders" and "physical health disorders" relies on mind being somehow not a product of the physical state of the body, which, while it certainly connects to beliefs of many popular religions (e.g., concerning the soul), doesn't appear to have any scientific basis at all.
- UnoriginalGuy 12y ago
  I'll concede that point. Addiction may be more physically/genetically based than we currently realise.
bloaf 12y ago
The core of the issue is 1. Obesity is unhealthy (i.e. persisting in obesity is self-destructive) 2. Obesity is obvious (i.e. ignorance of your obesity is not an excuse) 3. Obesity is treatable (whether from a mental-health angle or otherwise) I'm honestly not sure what the mental-health roots of obesity has to do with anything. It may be hard to quit smoking, that doesn't stop me from correctly judging that people who smoke are engaging in a self-destructive behavior. It may take professional help for some people to stop gambling, but I'm still going to judge harshly the parent who gambles away money that should be spent on their children. I would not humor the excuses of an obese person who fails to get help anymore than I would humor the excuses of someone who broke their arm but refuses to get it fixed.
- Red_Tarsius 12y ago
  I fully agree with you, but it's no use; no matter how polite you're, somehow they will find your comment offensive, confusing fat shaming with common sense.
- dragonwriter 12y ago
  Your use of the phrase "persisting in obesity" and your comparison with smoking demonstrates that you are equating an action (like smoking) with a condition (obesity).
  - bloaf 12y ago
    In this case, that sounds like a distinction without a difference: Persisting in a smoking addiction (condition) is as bad as persisting in obesity (condition.) Regularly smoking (action) is as bad as regularly eating too much (action.) Edit: It is because in both cases, persisting in the condition requires the action.
    - dragonwriter 12y ago
      The difference is critical because people often attempt to change action specifically to correct the condition of obesity without success -- there is lots of inaccurate, overgeneralized, false, harmful, and otherwise not-helpful information available on fitness and health issues. People may remain obese while actively choosing to take action to address that condition. It is a mistake to equate remaining obese with persisting in anything.

morganvachon 12y ago

I'm curious what your opinion of diabetes is then; is that simply a "food addiction" too?

UnoriginalGuy 12y ago
I literally don't understand what it is you're asking me. Type-2 diabetes is a disease. One which has both genetic factors (e.g. some families get it more than other families) and non-genetic factors (e.g. unhealthy food consumption, heavy sugary food consumption). Food addiction is a mental health issue that causes people to over-consume foods. These foods are often chosen to give the best "buzz" (so often high in sugar, high in salt, etc). Having a food addiction, if untreated, could increase a person's likelihood of getting type-2 diabetes. In the same way that having a heroin addiction could increase someone's likelihood of having a stroke or heart attack.
- morganvachon 12y ago
  I apologize, I misread your comment about mental health as being the only cause of obesity, and that's not what you are saying. I just re-read your original comment and realized that. Please excuse my lack of reading comprehension today.

dragonwriter 12y ago

> While some forms of obesity have been linked to physical health and or genetic factors, even if you discount that the remaining research has suggested it is a mental health disorder not that dissimilar from e.g. alcoholism, exercise addiction, sex addiction, drug addiction, smoking, and so on. The research on alcohol, drug, and other addictions seems to indicate that they are physical health disorders -- often with substantial genetic contributions -- and, in fact, the entire idea of separate "mental health disorders" and "physical health disorders" relies on mind being somehow not a product of the physical state of the body, which, while it certainly connects to beliefs of many popular religions (e.g., concerning the soul), doesn't appear to have any scientific basis at all.

UnoriginalGuy 12y ago
I'll concede that point. Addiction may be more physically/genetically based than we currently realise.

bloaf 12y ago

The core of the issue is 1. Obesity is unhealthy (i.e. persisting in obesity is self-destructive) 2. Obesity is obvious (i.e. ignorance of your obesity is not an excuse) 3. Obesity is treatable (whether from a mental-health angle or otherwise) I'm honestly not sure what the mental-health roots of obesity has to do with anything. It may be hard to quit smoking, that doesn't stop me from correctly judging that people who smoke are engaging in a self-destructive behavior. It may take professional help for some people to stop gambling, but I'm still going to judge harshly the parent who gambles away money that should be spent on their children. I would not humor the excuses of an obese person who fails to get help anymore than I would humor the excuses of someone who broke their arm but refuses to get it fixed.

Red_Tarsius 12y ago
I fully agree with you, but it's no use; no matter how polite you're, somehow they will find your comment offensive, confusing fat shaming with common sense.
dragonwriter 12y ago
Your use of the phrase "persisting in obesity" and your comparison with smoking demonstrates that you are equating an action (like smoking) with a condition (obesity).
- bloaf 12y ago
  In this case, that sounds like a distinction without a difference: Persisting in a smoking addiction (condition) is as bad as persisting in obesity (condition.) Regularly smoking (action) is as bad as regularly eating too much (action.) Edit: It is because in both cases, persisting in the condition requires the action.
  - dragonwriter 12y ago
    The difference is critical because people often attempt to change action specifically to correct the condition of obesity without success -- there is lots of inaccurate, overgeneralized, false, harmful, and otherwise not-helpful information available on fitness and health issues. People may remain obese while actively choosing to take action to address that condition. It is a mistake to equate remaining obese with persisting in anything.