7 ms·

This also isn't an apt comparison, because no one is claiming that enthusiasts should own the copyright to Mario Kart. A better comparison would be Steamboat W

by basseq 12y ago

This also isn't an apt comparison, because no one is claiming that enthusiasts should own the copyright to Mario Kart. A better comparison would be Steamboat Willie, but even that is confusing because copyright is so caught up with trademark Disney characters. IANAL, but it seems to be that Disney should be able to have exclusive ownership over Mickey the character, but not the work in which he first appeared. (Which muddies the water, I know.) Does Disney make any significant money off Steamboat Willie? (They actually might, given its culture status, I just don't know.)

smacktoward 12y ago
An even better comparison would be if the only way Disney would let you view Steamboat Willie in a Disney-owned-and-operated facility. Like, they'll sell you a ticket or a DVD or a download, but in all cases you have to bring it to a Disney facility to actually play it back. And then one day Disney closes all the facilities, and now you have some copy of the work without any legal way to view it. Which, if you accept the analogy, brings the situation pretty close to the one addressed by U.S. v. Paramount Pictures in 1948 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Paramount_Pictures,_Inc. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Paramount_Pict...), which ended the practice of studios owning their own theaters and refusing to show their pictures anywhere else.
DanTheManPR 12y ago
You can still buy Steamboat Willie on DVD. Using it as an example is sort of problematic, because it is not an orphaned work, and a lot of people don't see the problem with Disney maintaining control over it. A better example would be the many orphaned animated features from the late 20's and 30's who languish in legal limbo instead of being released into the public domain (if you can't think of any examples, that's a symptom of the problem more than anything else).
- dublinben 12y ago
  >You can still buy Steamboat Willie on DVD On an expensive (~$100), out-of-print DVD, only released in 2005. The work has been orphaned for far more of its lifetime than it has been available.
  - bufordsharkley 12y ago
    Well, that's the Disney Vault in action. (Which is a legitimate release strategy, and it's hard to claim that Disney doesn't generally try to keep its historical works available. I imagine it'll be re-released at some point in the future.)
zanny 12y ago
Super Mario Kart was released for the SNES in 1992. I would absolutely argue that it should be in the public domain by now. I would also argue that Mario Kart 8 should be as well, and I'd argue you should not have copyright at all.
nitrogen 12y ago
...it seems to be that Disney should be able to have exclusive ownership over Mickey the character... I have to disagree with this on cultural grounds. Part of the reason that copyright expires is to fertilize the ground from which new stories are grown. Shakespeare does not own Romeo. Dickens does not own Scrooge. To the extent that Mickey has become a part of our cultural mythos, Disney should not own Mickey. The only reasonable expectation a creator should have after a reasonably short copyright term is protection from malicious misattribution and defamation. Everything else in the last century of IP law is implemented completely wrong, in my opinion.

by basseq 12y ago

smacktoward 12y ago

An even better comparison would be if the only way Disney would let you view Steamboat Willie in a Disney-owned-and-operated facility. Like, they'll sell you a ticket or a DVD or a download, but in all cases you have to bring it to a Disney facility to actually play it back. And then one day Disney closes all the facilities, and now you have some copy of the work without any legal way to view it. Which, if you accept the analogy, brings the situation pretty close to the one addressed by U.S. v. Paramount Pictures in 1948 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Paramount_Pictures,_Inc. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Paramount_Pict...), which ended the practice of studios owning their own theaters and refusing to show their pictures anywhere else.

DanTheManPR 12y ago

You can still buy Steamboat Willie on DVD. Using it as an example is sort of problematic, because it is not an orphaned work, and a lot of people don't see the problem with Disney maintaining control over it. A better example would be the many orphaned animated features from the late 20's and 30's who languish in legal limbo instead of being released into the public domain (if you can't think of any examples, that's a symptom of the problem more than anything else).

dublinben 12y ago
>You can still buy Steamboat Willie on DVD On an expensive (~$100), out-of-print DVD, only released in 2005. The work has been orphaned for far more of its lifetime than it has been available.
- bufordsharkley 12y ago
  Well, that's the Disney Vault in action. (Which is a legitimate release strategy, and it's hard to claim that Disney doesn't generally try to keep its historical works available. I imagine it'll be re-released at some point in the future.)

zanny 12y ago

Super Mario Kart was released for the SNES in 1992. I would absolutely argue that it should be in the public domain by now. I would also argue that Mario Kart 8 should be as well, and I'd argue you should not have copyright at all.

nitrogen 12y ago

...it seems to be that Disney should be able to have exclusive ownership over Mickey the character... I have to disagree with this on cultural grounds. Part of the reason that copyright expires is to fertilize the ground from which new stories are grown. Shakespeare does not own Romeo. Dickens does not own Scrooge. To the extent that Mickey has become a part of our cultural mythos, Disney should not own Mickey. The only reasonable expectation a creator should have after a reasonably short copyright term is protection from malicious misattribution and defamation. Everything else in the last century of IP law is implemented completely wrong, in my opinion.