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That's a very fair question. When I first presented my corporate open source anti-patterns talk at FISL in 2012[1][2], I closed by saying that I was certain tha

That's a very fair question. When I first presented my corporate open source anti-patterns talk at FISL in 2012[1][2], I closed by saying that I was certain that we (Joyent) were making mistakes, and that they would have to come back in 2022 to hear what they were. Suffice it to say that after the developments of the last year -- which include not just the io.js fork but also us open sourcing our entire stack[3] -- I'm really looking forward to doing that update, and hope to do it much earlier than 2022. ;) To answer your question: no, I was not overruled -- it's been clear to me for quite some time that node.js would be best served by a foundation. That said, getting the mechanics of that foundation established has taking (is taking) a long time (and, it must be said, involves a lot of hard, thankless work from a lot of people). Foundations might feel "easy", but they aren't: 501(c)(3) organizations are highly regulated entities that require not just a lot of groundwork and forethought but extensive maintenance. Fortunately, we have made great progress (and we have built a terrific collection of founding members), and we are getting the node.js community what it needs: a foundation that can assure the consensus-driven advancement of the technology, in perpetuity. [1] http://www.slideshare.net/bcantrill/corporate-open-source-antipatterns http://www.slideshare.net/bcantrill/corporate-open-source-an... [2] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhgXQFk9noI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhgXQFk9noI [3] https://www.joyent.com/blog/sdc-and-manta-are-now-open-source https://www.joyent.com/blog/sdc-and-manta-are-now-open-sourc...

mr1996 12y ago
Have you ever kissed a girl?
sunchildren 12y ago
The schizophrenic open source ideals of Sun continue to live on at Joyent. It's funny that Oracle is called out many times (which they deserve), and yet, there is a failure to acknowledge that other open source projects under Sun's stewardship did a lot of mistakes that ended up killing them (OpenSolaris and OpenOffice, to name a few). In any case, as much as corporate America wants to be seen as a faceless entity, Sun was made of its employees and so is Joyent.
yoshuaw 12y ago
Meh, I'm not buying this "yeah, we were going to make node belong to the community all along" when there are lawsuits threats over trademarks and what not.
vacri 12y ago
I'm waiting for this new foundation to have their moment where they call a core developer an asshole in public, throw him under a bus, and say that if he was an employee, he'd be fired rather than retrained... all while talking about the importance of empathy. Regardless of the event itself, that was an exceptionally poor handling (soapboxing?) of the situation, and didn't speak much of ability to mediate a heated situation. A foundation born from this management style? Doesn't sound encouraging. [1]https://www.joyent.com/blog/the-power-of-a-pronoun https://www.joyent.com/blog/the-power-of-a-pronoun
- Lazare 12y ago
  I was wondering if anyone would bring that one up. For me, that was the moment I stopped having vague concerns about Joyent and Node, and realised "wow, these people can't be trusted to run a project".
- trakkur 12y ago
  Not the first time Bryan Cantrill has done that: http://www.zdnet.com/article/how-suns-need-to-control-the-code-cost-them-the-company/ or: http://www.cryptnet.net/mirrors/texts/kissedagirl.html
- darkmarmot 12y ago
  wow, hadn't read the post. that alone puts me firmly rooting for the io.js camp.
  - 4ad 12y ago
    Yeah, because you should chose your software based on your dislike for some community members, not because of real technical facts.
    - bronson 12y ago
      When a project has questionable or poisonous leadership, it's technically wise to steer clear.
bronson 12y ago
Bryan, your long-winded reply basically says you always wanted a foundation? Really? Well, where were you in November?? This announcement feels like hurried back-room politics, and your reply is reinforcing that impression.

mr1996 12y ago

Have you ever kissed a girl?

sunchildren 12y ago

The schizophrenic open source ideals of Sun continue to live on at Joyent. It's funny that Oracle is called out many times (which they deserve), and yet, there is a failure to acknowledge that other open source projects under Sun's stewardship did a lot of mistakes that ended up killing them (OpenSolaris and OpenOffice, to name a few). In any case, as much as corporate America wants to be seen as a faceless entity, Sun was made of its employees and so is Joyent.

yoshuaw 12y ago

Meh, I'm not buying this "yeah, we were going to make node belong to the community all along" when there are lawsuits threats over trademarks and what not.

vacri 12y ago

I'm waiting for this new foundation to have their moment where they call a core developer an asshole in public, throw him under a bus, and say that if he was an employee, he'd be fired rather than retrained... all while talking about the importance of empathy. Regardless of the event itself, that was an exceptionally poor handling (soapboxing?) of the situation, and didn't speak much of ability to mediate a heated situation. A foundation born from this management style? Doesn't sound encouraging. [1]https://www.joyent.com/blog/the-power-of-a-pronoun https://www.joyent.com/blog/the-power-of-a-pronoun

Lazare 12y ago
I was wondering if anyone would bring that one up. For me, that was the moment I stopped having vague concerns about Joyent and Node, and realised "wow, these people can't be trusted to run a project".
trakkur 12y ago
Not the first time Bryan Cantrill has done that: http://www.zdnet.com/article/how-suns-need-to-control-the-code-cost-them-the-company/ or: http://www.cryptnet.net/mirrors/texts/kissedagirl.html
darkmarmot 12y ago
wow, hadn't read the post. that alone puts me firmly rooting for the io.js camp.
- 4ad 12y ago
  Yeah, because you should chose your software based on your dislike for some community members, not because of real technical facts.
  - bronson 12y ago
    When a project has questionable or poisonous leadership, it's technically wise to steer clear.

bronson 12y ago

Bryan, your long-winded reply basically says you always wanted a foundation? Really? Well, where were you in November?? This announcement feels like hurried back-room politics, and your reply is reinforcing that impression.