4 ms·

Gosh, glad I posted! Thanks! The reverse charge as described there is for services rather than goods, though. How does it work with goods, and specifically dig

by cannam 12y ago

Gosh, glad I posted! Thanks! The reverse charge as described there is for services rather than goods, though. How does it work with goods, and specifically digital goods like downloads of the sort that VATMOSS applies to? I'm quite sure sellers of such goods from outside the EU to within it are expected to use VATMOSS, does that mean there is no corresponding expectation to reverse charge? I clearly need to do quite a bit more reading!

petercooper 12y ago
VATMOSS has no relevance to B2B transactions (luckily!) but international businesses providing digital services to EU customers above a certain amount have been technically required to register since around 2003 - see http://www.taxamo.com/european-vat-on-e-services/ http://www.taxamo.com/european-vat-on-e-services/ - this is why some US Web hosting providers will charge you VAT, but most (about 1% allegedly!) don't (and, I personally feel, they shouldn't). The other issue is I don't believe there's any such thing as digital goods - they're considered electronically supplied services. Things like Web hosting are included in this. I'm not sure what purchases you're making from the US, but in my case things like Web hosting, Mailchimp, Pluralsight, videos, etc. all of these are e-services that I have to reverse charge.
- cannam 12y ago
  Mmm yes, seems even the VATMOSS docs on gov.uk refer to services where I might think of goods. By goods I had in mind things like software licences, rather than hosting etc, but it seems those are services too. (I am basically a relatively high-functioning example of the sort of idiot HMRC are going to have to deal with now -- clueless and fumbling but determined to do the proper thing thoroughly, and without an accountant because I'm only likely to be filing for a few quid a quarter anyway)
  - petercooper 12y ago
    I know how you feel, I've been there :-) Annoyingly, I enjoy reading laws and laundry lists of arcane rules, so have a "reasonable" understanding of VAT law now and, yes, it's HORRIBLE and frequently contradicts itself (as does HMRC generally). The other annoying thing is many accountants are not familiar with the nuances of Internet based or digital businesses, particularly those that deal with overseas customers, so knowing the basics yourself is essential unless you get lucky (I've realized it's sorta like asking a back-end C developer a front-end JavaScript question - they have the skills to try and look it up, but it's not necessarily going to be the best advice).

by cannam 12y ago

petercooper 12y ago

VATMOSS has no relevance to B2B transactions (luckily!) but international businesses providing digital services to EU customers above a certain amount have been technically required to register since around 2003 - see http://www.taxamo.com/european-vat-on-e-services/ http://www.taxamo.com/european-vat-on-e-services/ - this is why some US Web hosting providers will charge you VAT, but most (about 1% allegedly!) don't (and, I personally feel, they shouldn't). The other issue is I don't believe there's any such thing as digital goods - they're considered electronically supplied services. Things like Web hosting are included in this. I'm not sure what purchases you're making from the US, but in my case things like Web hosting, Mailchimp, Pluralsight, videos, etc. all of these are e-services that I have to reverse charge.

cannam 12y ago
Mmm yes, seems even the VATMOSS docs on gov.uk refer to services where I might think of goods. By goods I had in mind things like software licences, rather than hosting etc, but it seems those are services too. (I am basically a relatively high-functioning example of the sort of idiot HMRC are going to have to deal with now -- clueless and fumbling but determined to do the proper thing thoroughly, and without an accountant because I'm only likely to be filing for a few quid a quarter anyway)
- petercooper 12y ago
  I know how you feel, I've been there :-) Annoyingly, I enjoy reading laws and laundry lists of arcane rules, so have a "reasonable" understanding of VAT law now and, yes, it's HORRIBLE and frequently contradicts itself (as does HMRC generally). The other annoying thing is many accountants are not familiar with the nuances of Internet based or digital businesses, particularly those that deal with overseas customers, so knowing the basics yourself is essential unless you get lucky (I've realized it's sorta like asking a back-end C developer a front-end JavaScript question - they have the skills to try and look it up, but it's not necessarily going to be the best advice).