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Is that really true?! If so it seems that a winning strategy is to actively try to dodge the system but be prepared to pay it back when you know you'll get foun

by aidos 12y ago

Is that really true?! If so it seems that a winning strategy is to actively try to dodge the system but be prepared to pay it back when you know you'll get found out. That makes no sense. Why would that same rule not apply to other crime?

tormeh 12y ago
Because, you see, the rich are the pillars of decent society.
Hermel 12y ago
No, it is not a winning strategy as dogers have to pay a lot more due to punitive interest rates than those who correctly declared their taxes from the beginning. Furthermore, the same rule also applies to other crimes. The rule is called "innocent until proven guilty".
- aidos 12y ago
  It's not really "innocent until proven guilty" though. You're guilty the whole time, it's just that you get off the hook if you never formally lie to HMRC. From what I understood of the original comment it's more like, innocent until you're formally challenged on it, decide to lie and are subsequently found out. That's literally a get out of jail free card. Murder someone, don't admit it, found out -> charged Murder someone, admit it -> charged Dodge tax, lie about it, found out -> charged Dodge tax, don't lie about it, found out -> not charged! Do you know what the punitive interest rates are in these cases? HMRC say that [0]: "Those who try to get an unfair advantage will have to pay: - any tax that is due - any interest that is due - any penalties that are due" I can't find any information about the the penalties that have been handed out in real terms. There's potentially more to be gained by holding on to the cash and using to your advantage until you get found out (if you ever do). Maybe it's a reasonable way for HMRC to do things but it's a bit weird that you can knowingly be in the wrong without having the risk of jail time hanging over you. [0] http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/about/new-penalties/faqs.htm#2 http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/http://www.hmrc....
- HillRat 12y ago
  Arguably, the penalties aren't really punitive enough, otherwise we wouldn't still have an industry of bleeding-edge tax dodges. I know -- professionally and not closely -- one guy who specializes in complex tax mitigation for the ultra-rich. His more outre schemes may get shut down by the IRS but, if you're a client of his, you're essentially gambling tens of millions of dollars that you can avoid paying hundreds of millions in top-level taxes. At the wealth level they're at, it's a perfectly reasonable roll of the dice.

by aidos 12y ago

tormeh 12y ago

Because, you see, the rich are the pillars of decent society.

Hermel 12y ago

No, it is not a winning strategy as dogers have to pay a lot more due to punitive interest rates than those who correctly declared their taxes from the beginning. Furthermore, the same rule also applies to other crimes. The rule is called "innocent until proven guilty".

aidos 12y ago
It's not really "innocent until proven guilty" though. You're guilty the whole time, it's just that you get off the hook if you never formally lie to HMRC. From what I understood of the original comment it's more like, innocent until you're formally challenged on it, decide to lie and are subsequently found out. That's literally a get out of jail free card. Murder someone, don't admit it, found out -> charged Murder someone, admit it -> charged Dodge tax, lie about it, found out -> charged Dodge tax, don't lie about it, found out -> not charged! Do you know what the punitive interest rates are in these cases? HMRC say that [0]: "Those who try to get an unfair advantage will have to pay: - any tax that is due - any interest that is due - any penalties that are due" I can't find any information about the the penalties that have been handed out in real terms. There's potentially more to be gained by holding on to the cash and using to your advantage until you get found out (if you ever do). Maybe it's a reasonable way for HMRC to do things but it's a bit weird that you can knowingly be in the wrong without having the risk of jail time hanging over you. [0] http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/about/new-penalties/faqs.htm#2 http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/http://www.hmrc....
HillRat 12y ago
Arguably, the penalties aren't really punitive enough, otherwise we wouldn't still have an industry of bleeding-edge tax dodges. I know -- professionally and not closely -- one guy who specializes in complex tax mitigation for the ultra-rich. His more outre schemes may get shut down by the IRS but, if you're a client of his, you're essentially gambling tens of millions of dollars that you can avoid paying hundreds of millions in top-level taxes. At the wealth level they're at, it's a perfectly reasonable roll of the dice.