7 ms·

As someone who went from 430 ng/dl to 1024 ng/dl naturally in about two years time (from age 23 to 25) the only thing I can say is don't jump to too many conclu

As someone who went from 430 ng/dl to 1024 ng/dl naturally in about two years time (from age 23 to 25) the only thing I can say is don't jump to too many conclusions here. - Your testosterone should be naturally high if you're below 30 (and male) - If not, something is wrong and you need to fix it (start with blood work, check your diet, move) - If you testosterone is in the normal ranges (blood work recommends between 600 and 1200, which is ridiculous), you'll feel good 80-90% of the time - the 10-20% are probably psychological worries that you might have, start meditating - I didn't get huge muscles or less body fat with more testosterone (huge myth that I thought would change for me) - TRT is used heavily in pro-sports (look for UFC fighters and bodybuilders, they have the most experience, since a lot of them are doing it) - TRT is a problem if you keep going for too long, because your body just doesn't produce testosterone as it used to, because it expects it from the outside, so below 35 or rather below 40 year olds: don't sign up for this too quickly. - Cold showers/baths do work, but probably not for increasing your testosterone, still, do it from time to time :) - Intermittent Fasting helps immensely with boosting your testosterone naturally. I can provide more info or details/specifics if wanted/needed.

return0 12y ago
You 're quite young. i wonder if it is possible to change so fast when you're older.
- freshfey 12y ago
  take a look at the book "4 Hour Body" by Tim Ferriss, there in the chapter Improving Sex, sub-chapter: "Sex Machine I: Adventures in Tripling Testosterone" I think in there the author, Tim Ferriss aged 34(?), mentions how he went from 2xx to 6xx in a very short amount of time, mainly by changing his nutrition.
  - jkscm 12y ago
    Or it could be a coincidence since the number of test subjects was 1. I like how the examine.com article sums it up: > Although 'natural' (non-supplemental) methods of increasing testosterone are pretty weak and unlikely to build muscle mass, they tend to be related to pro-sexual effects (particularly libido) and exerting dominance http://examine.com/faq/how-can-i-increase-testosterone-naturally.html http://examine.com/faq/how-can-i-increase-testosterone-natur...
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
Simp 12y ago
"start meditating" Research has not shown that meditation beats a placebo Studies about meditation are usually of poor quality. Source: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/2013/03/08/research-has-not-shown-that-meditation-beats-a-placebo/ http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/2013/03/08/r...
- stinos 12y ago
  Research has not shown that meditation beats a placebo Isn't that sort of irrelevant here? I think the OP's point is that it helps, not that it helps better than something else (wahtever that may be, even a placebo)?
  - return0 12y ago
    If it doesn't help more than a placebo, then it doesn't help at all.
    - stinos 12y ago
      Wordplay? If it helps just as much (which technically is also 'not more'), it could still help since a placebo might help. Hell, even if it would help 'less' than a placebo it might still be helping since I didn't quantify exactly how much :P
      - return0 12y ago
        By that logic meditation also harms T levels. Not more than a placebo, but still harms them. Zero can be a positive or negative number.
    - vidarh 12y ago
      A placebo often helps substantially. That is why we tend to test with a placebo rather than nothing at all, in order to measure the effect of what we want to test rather than the ability of our mind to influence our body. And the effect is not merely psychological. Often placebo produces measurable responses.
henryaj 12y ago
What are the details of your intermittent fasting?
- freshfey 12y ago
  in terms of timing you mean? I fasted for 14 hours and simply delayed/skipped breakfast, still eating 3 meals at around 2400 calories.
  - mej10 12y ago
    Can you link to any studies showing IF increased T levels substantially? I am genuinely curious. I have been considering doing IF (since I am half way there already) just for the longevity boosts and general body composition benefits.
    - freshfey 12y ago
      http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/07/27/increase-testosterone-levels.aspx http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/07/27/... (has also studies at the bottom) and this is also an interesting experiment, where it actually drops with fasting: http://www.precisionnutrition.com/intermittent-fasting/chapter-7 http://www.precisionnutrition.com/intermittent-fasting/chapt... But the hypothesis is that the body uses the testosterone more efficiently
toolz 12y ago
>- I didn't get huge muscles or less body fat with more testosterone (huge myth that I thought would change for me) The many studies done on this subject show that testosterone makes a huge impact on muscle growth. Take this 10 week study for instance, http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101 http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101. The placebo group working out didn't experience nearly as much muscle gain as those taking testosterone did when they were not working out.
- gadders 12y ago
  I guess it also depends on what exercises you're doing. Body Pump and Nautilus machines wouldn't cut it. //edit// Or rather would help the OP a lot.
- paganel 12y ago
  > The many studies done on this subject show that testosterone makes a huge impact on muscle growth Genuine question: Why this emphasis on increasing "muscle growth"? What benefits does it bring us (men)?
  - Jimmed 12y ago
    Genuine answer: Feeling better about our self-image / placating the fear that we're "not manly enough".
    - gadders 12y ago
      I also find that being strong(er) is more useful in my daily life than increased aerobic capability i.e. picking my nine year old daughter up and carrying her on my shoulders, moving heavy stuff in the garden etc.
    - GFK_of_xmaspast 12y ago
      Another reason to dismantle the patriarchy and gender binary.
      - 12y ago
pervycreeper 12y ago
>I can provide more info or details/specifics if wanted/needed. Please do. Some references to further reading would also be appreciated.
- freshfey 12y ago
  Sure, what are you looking for specifically?
johnward 12y ago
" I didn't get huge muscles or less body fat with more testosterone (huge myth that I thought would change for me)". For me I almost always drop 20lbs on T and am much leaner than I am off or on clomid. On clomid I generally gain weight. "- TRT is a problem if you keep going for too long, because your body just doesn't produce testosterone as it used to, because it expects it from the outside, so below 35 or rather below 40 year olds: don't sign up for this too quickly." You can counteract this by taking ancillaries while on T. There are drugs that can restore the LH and FSH that get suppressed by testosterone but this is a valid concern. 100mg of T per week made me basically infertile but clomid brought me back to normal after a few weeks. Diet and nutrition is very important if you want to keep optimum T levels. This forum post, not written by anyone in the medical field, has a pretty list of possible causes outside of supplementing with T. http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_trt/lab_work_and_blood_testing http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_trainin...
- droopyEyelids 12y ago
  How did you test your fertility
  - voidlogic 12y ago
    I'm guessing its a sperm count / motility test.
  - gadders 12y ago
    You can get tests over the counter now: http://www.boots.com/en/Spermcheck-Male-Fertility-Test_1369922/ http://www.boots.com/en/Spermcheck-Male-Fertility-Test_13699...
  - johnward 12y ago
    I am working with a fertility clinic but it's a standard lab test. You do your thing in a cup and they run it through some tests for count, motility, shape, etc. They want more than 15m sperm per ml. I had initial tests on 0, 2m, 5m. After treatment with 25mg of clomid for a few months I had 65m. My wife is also on letrozole and we tried IUI and still haven't got pregnant. It's more difficult than I thought it would be.
LukeB_UK 12y ago
TRT has now been banned in the UFC.
sliverstorm 12y ago
Naturally? What did you do?
JohnBooty 12y ago
TRT is a problem if you keep going for too long, because your body just doesn't produce testosterone as it used to, because it expects it from the outside, so below 35 or rather below 40 year olds: don't sign up for this too quickly. This is the reason why my doctor wouldn't prescribe it for me (38 year-old male, hoping to have a kid with my wife in the next year or two). When on testosterone supplements, the body can start to rely on the outside testosterone and gradually stops producing its own. He said it can result in a situation where you're essentially locked into taking testosterone forever. Strangely, I didn't see that risk mentioned in the linked article. Did I simply miss it?

return0 12y ago

You 're quite young. i wonder if it is possible to change so fast when you're older.

freshfey 12y ago
take a look at the book "4 Hour Body" by Tim Ferriss, there in the chapter Improving Sex, sub-chapter: "Sex Machine I: Adventures in Tripling Testosterone" I think in there the author, Tim Ferriss aged 34(?), mentions how he went from 2xx to 6xx in a very short amount of time, mainly by changing his nutrition.
- jkscm 12y ago
  Or it could be a coincidence since the number of test subjects was 1. I like how the examine.com article sums it up: > Although 'natural' (non-supplemental) methods of increasing testosterone are pretty weak and unlikely to build muscle mass, they tend to be related to pro-sexual effects (particularly libido) and exerting dominance http://examine.com/faq/how-can-i-increase-testosterone-naturally.html http://examine.com/faq/how-can-i-increase-testosterone-natur...

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

Simp 12y ago

"start meditating" Research has not shown that meditation beats a placebo Studies about meditation are usually of poor quality. Source: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/2013/03/08/research-has-not-shown-that-meditation-beats-a-placebo/ http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/2013/03/08/r...

stinos 12y ago
Research has not shown that meditation beats a placebo Isn't that sort of irrelevant here? I think the OP's point is that it helps, not that it helps better than something else (wahtever that may be, even a placebo)?
- return0 12y ago
  If it doesn't help more than a placebo, then it doesn't help at all.
  - stinos 12y ago
    Wordplay? If it helps just as much (which technically is also 'not more'), it could still help since a placebo might help. Hell, even if it would help 'less' than a placebo it might still be helping since I didn't quantify exactly how much :P
    - return0 12y ago
      By that logic meditation also harms T levels. Not more than a placebo, but still harms them. Zero can be a positive or negative number.
  - vidarh 12y ago
    A placebo often helps substantially. That is why we tend to test with a placebo rather than nothing at all, in order to measure the effect of what we want to test rather than the ability of our mind to influence our body. And the effect is not merely psychological. Often placebo produces measurable responses.

henryaj 12y ago

What are the details of your intermittent fasting?

freshfey 12y ago
in terms of timing you mean? I fasted for 14 hours and simply delayed/skipped breakfast, still eating 3 meals at around 2400 calories.
- mej10 12y ago
  Can you link to any studies showing IF increased T levels substantially? I am genuinely curious. I have been considering doing IF (since I am half way there already) just for the longevity boosts and general body composition benefits.
  - freshfey 12y ago
    http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/07/27/increase-testosterone-levels.aspx http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/07/27/... (has also studies at the bottom) and this is also an interesting experiment, where it actually drops with fasting: http://www.precisionnutrition.com/intermittent-fasting/chapter-7 http://www.precisionnutrition.com/intermittent-fasting/chapt... But the hypothesis is that the body uses the testosterone more efficiently

toolz 12y ago

>- I didn't get huge muscles or less body fat with more testosterone (huge myth that I thought would change for me) The many studies done on this subject show that testosterone makes a huge impact on muscle growth. Take this 10 week study for instance, http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101 http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101. The placebo group working out didn't experience nearly as much muscle gain as those taking testosterone did when they were not working out.

gadders 12y ago
I guess it also depends on what exercises you're doing. Body Pump and Nautilus machines wouldn't cut it. //edit// Or rather would help the OP a lot.
paganel 12y ago
> The many studies done on this subject show that testosterone makes a huge impact on muscle growth Genuine question: Why this emphasis on increasing "muscle growth"? What benefits does it bring us (men)?
- Jimmed 12y ago
  Genuine answer: Feeling better about our self-image / placating the fear that we're "not manly enough".
  - gadders 12y ago
    I also find that being strong(er) is more useful in my daily life than increased aerobic capability i.e. picking my nine year old daughter up and carrying her on my shoulders, moving heavy stuff in the garden etc.
  - GFK_of_xmaspast 12y ago
    Another reason to dismantle the patriarchy and gender binary.
    - 12y ago

pervycreeper 12y ago

>I can provide more info or details/specifics if wanted/needed. Please do. Some references to further reading would also be appreciated.

freshfey 12y ago
Sure, what are you looking for specifically?

johnward 12y ago

" I didn't get huge muscles or less body fat with more testosterone (huge myth that I thought would change for me)". For me I almost always drop 20lbs on T and am much leaner than I am off or on clomid. On clomid I generally gain weight. "- TRT is a problem if you keep going for too long, because your body just doesn't produce testosterone as it used to, because it expects it from the outside, so below 35 or rather below 40 year olds: don't sign up for this too quickly." You can counteract this by taking ancillaries while on T. There are drugs that can restore the LH and FSH that get suppressed by testosterone but this is a valid concern. 100mg of T per week made me basically infertile but clomid brought me back to normal after a few weeks. Diet and nutrition is very important if you want to keep optimum T levels. This forum post, not written by anyone in the medical field, has a pretty list of possible causes outside of supplementing with T. http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_trt/lab_work_and_blood_testing http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_trainin...

droopyEyelids 12y ago
How did you test your fertility
- voidlogic 12y ago
  I'm guessing its a sperm count / motility test.
- gadders 12y ago
  You can get tests over the counter now: http://www.boots.com/en/Spermcheck-Male-Fertility-Test_1369922/ http://www.boots.com/en/Spermcheck-Male-Fertility-Test_13699...
- johnward 12y ago
  I am working with a fertility clinic but it's a standard lab test. You do your thing in a cup and they run it through some tests for count, motility, shape, etc. They want more than 15m sperm per ml. I had initial tests on 0, 2m, 5m. After treatment with 25mg of clomid for a few months I had 65m. My wife is also on letrozole and we tried IUI and still haven't got pregnant. It's more difficult than I thought it would be.

LukeB_UK 12y ago

TRT has now been banned in the UFC.

sliverstorm 12y ago

Naturally? What did you do?

JohnBooty 12y ago

TRT is a problem if you keep going for too long, because your body just doesn't produce testosterone as it used to, because it expects it from the outside, so below 35 or rather below 40 year olds: don't sign up for this too quickly. This is the reason why my doctor wouldn't prescribe it for me (38 year-old male, hoping to have a kid with my wife in the next year or two). When on testosterone supplements, the body can start to rely on the outside testosterone and gradually stops producing its own. He said it can result in a situation where you're essentially locked into taking testosterone forever. Strangely, I didn't see that risk mentioned in the linked article. Did I simply miss it?