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I wonder what about that community caused it to evolve like that

by qnaal 12y ago

nostrademons 12y ago
Hypothesis: When people are powerless for a long period of time, all they learn is the "language" of power, and every issue is cast as a life-or-death struggle where you are either with them or against them. When such people are close to attaining power, actually achieving it is the only thing that matters to them. They often become just as dogmatic oppressors as the people they fought against. It takes time to learn higher-level "languages" like empathy, or justice, or reasoned argument, and typically these skills can only be learned in a situation where you have a certain baseline of personal power. And so you get see-saw effects where the groups on top change but nothing is ever more just about the society. I can see this dynamic with certain Hacker News personalities who've been in powerless positions in the past and hence frame every comment as an us vs. them struggle, and it also explains the political history of numerous countries (eg. Russia, Rwanda, Israel/Palestine) in the modern era. It's a very common theme in arts & literature as well, eg. 1984, The Hunger Games, The Who ("Won't get fooled again"), South Park.
- deciplex 12y ago
  I think I get what you mean, but bear in mind that the examples in the article are all people who come from privileged backgrounds. It is definitely not about personal powerlessness, at least. It's something else.
  - classicsnoot 12y ago
    It is, I believe,poor reasoning to equate privilege with power in the way you seem to. From a different perspective: a privileged white male [me] who is very sensitive to history and narrative, who knows that there is so much institutionalized bigotry in my sub group, who must actively work to be the man I wish to see around me, can feel completely powerless in the face of fate to live outside the external expectation of what my skin and penis are supposed to mean regardless of the prodigious opportunities I have enjoyed due to the biological lottery.
mercer 12y ago
I suspect a big part of it is being in an echo-chamber of people who have almost the exact same set of beliefs, which are then contrasted with the more extreme opposite beliefs. This creates a rather simplistic (and therefore desirable) us vs. them dynamic. I've experienced this as conservative christian, and I only realized how black and white my world-view had become once I 'got out'. I could be wrong though. I generally avoid these 'communities' for the reason the author describes.

I wonder what about that community caused it to evolve like that

by qnaal 12y ago

I wonder what about that community caused it to evolve like that

Hypothesis: When people are powerless for a long period of time, all they learn is the "language" of power, and every issue is cast as a life-or-death struggle where you are either with them or against them. When such people are close to attaining power, actually achieving it is the only thing that matters to them. They often become just as dogmatic oppressors as the people they fought against. It takes time to learn higher-level "languages" like empathy, or justice, or reasoned argument, and typically these skills can only be learned in a situation where you have a certain baseline of personal power. And so you get see-saw effects where the groups on top change but nothing is ever more just about the society. I can see this dynamic with certain Hacker News personalities who've been in powerless positions in the past and hence frame every comment as an us vs. them struggle, and it also explains the political history of numerous countries (eg. Russia, Rwanda, Israel/Palestine) in the modern era. It's a very common theme in arts & literature as well, eg. 1984, The Hunger Games, The Who ("Won't get fooled again"), South Park.

deciplex 12y ago
I think I get what you mean, but bear in mind that the examples in the article are all people who come from privileged backgrounds. It is definitely not about personal powerlessness, at least. It's something else.
- classicsnoot 12y ago
  It is, I believe,poor reasoning to equate privilege with power in the way you seem to. From a different perspective: a privileged white male [me] who is very sensitive to history and narrative, who knows that there is so much institutionalized bigotry in my sub group, who must actively work to be the man I wish to see around me, can feel completely powerless in the face of fate to live outside the external expectation of what my skin and penis are supposed to mean regardless of the prodigious opportunities I have enjoyed due to the biological lottery.

mercer 12y ago

I suspect a big part of it is being in an echo-chamber of people who have almost the exact same set of beliefs, which are then contrasted with the more extreme opposite beliefs. This creates a rather simplistic (and therefore desirable) us vs. them dynamic. I've experienced this as conservative christian, and I only realized how black and white my world-view had become once I 'got out'. I could be wrong though. I generally avoid these 'communities' for the reason the author describes.