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Litvinenko post-mortem 'probably most dangerous ever'
- diyorgasms 12y agoSo, Litvinenko was allegedly working with MI6 after leaving the KGB (and Russia). This seems more like spycraft than a politically motivated assassination. That being said, this case makes me wonder if political assassinations also occur in Western politics, or if the killing of dissidents is mostly an Eastern Bloc thing.
- pastProlog 12y ago> this case makes me wonder if political assassinations also occur in Western politics https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JghQ0ZcRfQs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JghQ0ZcRfQs
- ceejayoz 12y agoCalling that a political assassination is a bit of a stretch, given that he helped kidnap and kill two people.
- pastProlog 12y ago> he helped kidnap and kill two people I think you mean: * he helped capture and execute two soldiers I'm not sure why one person working in military/intelligence being killed is a "political assassination" while the other one being killed is not. Well if that's not good enough, here's another Mossad piece of work, a Moroccan waiter with no political involvement at all gunned down by the Mossad in Norway - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair
- ceejayoz 12y ago> he helped capture and execute two soldiers Capture is fine. Summary execution of POWs is a war crime. > I'm not sure why one person working in military/intelligence being killed is a "political assassination" while the other one being killed is not. My point is: neither one was a political assassination. > Well if that's not good enough, here's another Mossad piece of work, a Moroccan waiter with no political involvement at all gunned down by the Mossad in Norway - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillehammer_affair Again, not a political assassination (as you said, he had no political involvement). That's an outright fuckup.
- spacefight 12y agoRemember Arafat? http://www.cbsnews.com/news/yasser-arafat-probably-poisoned-with-polonium-swiss-scientists-say/ http://www.cbsnews.com/news/yasser-arafat-probably-poisoned-... That was most probably a "western" nation state at work too.
- ceejayoz 12y agohttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cause_of_Yasser_Arafat%27s_death#Suspicion_of_poisoning_with_polonium http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cause_of_Yasser_Arafat%27s_deat... has a half a dozen sources indicating that his symptoms didn't match polonium poisoning.
- bvm 12y agoHow about the Nazi hunters? Herbert Cukurs was assainated by Mossad in the 60s.
- ajuc 12y ago> This seems more like spycraft than a politically motivated assassination. Why would you poison somebody with polonium of all things, if not to send a message "don't defect or else"? If "they" wanted him gone quietly almost all other solutions are cheaper, easier and less risky than polonium. Starting with organising a car accident. BTW why wrtie "eastern block" if you only have example from 1 country (namely Russia)? It's not like eastern block countries are similar to each other (except for 50 years of history ending 25 years ago). Compare Belarus, Estonia, Moldova and Czech Republic - completely different cultures, political systems.
- justincormack 12y agoWell there was the Bulgarian ricin-in-umbrella tip case too https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgi_Markov https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgi_Markov - also in London.
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- dragonwriter 12y ago> I mean in the U.S. pretty much every prominent liberal ends up dead... Everyone ends up dead; mortality is universal. But plenty of prominent liberals in the US don't do so through misadventure: Paul Wellstone and Edward Kennedy, for example. And, of course, lots of prominent liberal contemporaries of those you point to are still alive and active (Al Sharpton, Jane Fonda, etc.)_ While, certainly, some prominent liberals have been killed, "nearly every prominent liberal"is an exaggeration. (Also, Malcolm X was a prominent anti-establishment activist, but was very much not a liberal, though I suppose one might interpret the way he was moving at the very end of his life to be in a direction less at odds with liberalism.)
- drzaiusapelord 12y agoNot to mention liberalism, in the US, is generally unarmed while conservatism is heavily armed. Quack-pot conservatives tends to shoot people and quack-pot liberals tend to bomb or deface things. The most prominent liberals I can think of are alive and well, or died of natural causes. Ted Kennedy for one. Bernie Sanders. Nancy Pelosie. All of these people actually passed liberal laws and were powerful characters. If there was some liberal conspiracy then I imagine they would have be the forefront for assassination.
- drzaiusapelord 12y ago"Eastern block" uh we're talking specifically about Russia here. >This seems more like spycraft than a politically motivated assassination. Spies are rarely killed. They're traded for spies. Life isn't a Jame Bond movie. This, on the other hand, is clearly a politically motivated killing from a dictator known for it as well as annexing land and arbitrarily invading countries with unmarked troops. >That being said, this case makes me wonder if political assassinations also occur in Western politics More whataboutism when Russia comes up in the news? Color me unsurprised.
- diyorgasms 12y agoI was specifically trying to avoid the whataboutisms that so frequently come up in these discussions. I find what Putin is doing to be deplorable, and the pro-Russia astroturfing is often blatantly obvious. I had a genuine curiosity, but obviously I did a poor job of expressing it.
- tr352 12y agoI'm not a specialist but I don't see how this is so dangerous. Polonium-210, the poison used in this case, has a half life of 138 days and decays into stable Pb-206. So whatever was there has been halved about 20 times. Furthermore, alpha decay is relatively harmless (unless ingested).
- mikecsh 12y agoThis is an inquiry examining events before and after his death in 2006. The post mortem (autopsy) would have been done shortly after his death.
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- drzaiusapelord 12y agoI imagine the autopsy was done immediately after his death. Waiting months probably wasn't a practical option.
- akavel 12y agoFrom related linked story at http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30929940 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30929940 - "Timeline: Alexander Litvinenko death case": "22 July [2014] A public inquiry into Mr Litvinenko's death is announced by UK Home Secretary Theresa May. It is due to conclude by the end of 2015." So, it seems that the investigation is still ongoing!
- osipov 12y agoWho cares! Everyone knows that Putin did it! #BlamePutin
- spacefight 12y agoIt's sickening to see what people are able to do to other people.
- antocv 12y agoWhy is this resurgence of Litvinenko posts in the western media?
- mikecsh 12y agoAn inquiry is being heard to review the case.
- Ma8ee 12y agoAnd they have decided to review the case because they don't have any good relationship with the Russians to preserve any more.
- huhtenberg 12y ago... to publicly review the case.
- osipov 12y agoThere is a need to launch a new round of sanctions against Putin's Russia.
- rdtsc 12y agoHis biggest mistake was not ending up in US. Russia has never (at least that we publicly know) assassinated anyone in US, or US in Russia for that matter. From an evil dictator point view killing defectors in horrible ways does make sense. It is also imperative that everyone knows who did it but hopefully without there being a clear way of factually proving it. This wasn't just simple revenge this was a message to other agents who might have thoughts about defecting.
- osipov 12y ago#BlamePutin is a knee jerk reaction that will get you upvotes amongst the fans of Western media. Of course for you Putin is an evil dictator despite the fact that no proof exists that he ordered an assassination of anyone, while Obama, the Nobel Peace Prize winning leader of the "Free World" police states, legally kills people with drone strikes. Warped values in my opinion.
- vinceguidry 12y agoYou think Lugovoy just up and decided to kill him on his own volition?
- osipov 12y agoDo you seriously want to know or are you just trolling?
- vinceguidry 12y agoI was looking for a short paragraph laying out a sane rationale for why Lugovoy might have killed Litvenenko. He either did it himself or was directed to do so. If it was the former, why? If the latter, who, and again, why? That you failed to even come up with that and instead are wondering whether I'm trolling or not indicates that either you are trolling yourself or that the situation is so complicated that you need way more space to articulate a rationale and you're just testing to see if I'm worthy of that kind of effort. Which, when you think about it, is silly, because your audience isn't just me, it's everyone seeing this thread. Putin is the obvious choice because shortly before Litvenenko died, he'd written several anti-Putin screeds for the British press. Putin might not have green-lit the murder himself, it could well have been someone in his intimate circle. Doesn't matter which, Putin's still the one to blame. Litvenenko was also anti-organized crime, it's possible one of his many enemies in that sphere could have influenced Lugovoy to do this. I don't rate that as particularly likely though. Lugovoy himself has taken the outlandish position that British intelligence did it, hah.
- peterbraden 12y agoWhy would this be more dangerous than say a virus post-mortem with, ie, Ebola?
- celticninja 12y agoradiation can penetrate PPE that would stop ebola.
- vinkelhake 12y agoPolonium is an alpha emitter and such radiation is readily blocked by PPE (or a piece of paper, or skin). It is dangerous if you get it into your body where the alpha radiation will mess things up.