4 ms·

Yeah, Norway is shinning beacon of humanity. Except barnevernet which has even lamer excuses and is for life, not 5 hours.

by jkot 12y ago

pgrote 12y ago
I was ignorant of the term, but am unsure how it is different than other country's child services. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_Welfare_Services_(Norway) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_Welfare_Services_(Norway...
- jkot 12y ago
  Norway has way too many similar cases, for such small country of only 5 million people. Barnevernet also puts artificial obstructions for adoption by biological relatives, such as grandparents. As someone said, accused parents in such cases have less rights than Breivik.
  - ambrood 12y ago
    I recall a diplomatic incident with India when they tried to take away custody of Indian citizen children from their parents and put them in foster care or something.
  - thanksgiving 12y ago
    > As someone said, accused parents in such cases have less rights than Breivik. Hang on a minute. Here in the US, my tax dollars support your children. WIC and Food Stamps and school lunch programs which come from my tax dollars ensure your infants and children do not starve in case something happens to you or your income. As a parent, you get to claim tax deductions which means more money out of my pocket to cover for the loss of tax revenue. As I see it, your children are not your property. The children belong to the community at large. They are my investment. If you are damaging our collective investment, I very much expect you to be relieved of your duties to take care of my investment.
    - javert 12y ago
      Wow, this is incredibly disgusting. To claim that children belong to the community is full-blown communalism, and the end of individual rights. This is one fine distinction away from claiming that we are all property of the State. Parents have an obligation to protect their children, and you are attacking that. Taxation is not an "investment" and does not confer rights. It is non-contractual; it is merely force; it is not entered into voluntarily. You cannot start any valid argument with "Taxation, therefore..." If you don't like paying for WIC and Food Stamps, advocate against those taxes.
      - thanksgiving 12y ago
        I absolutely don't mind safety nets. I don't want people to starve and die. What I detest are tax breaks for having kids or deductions. It is disgusting.
    - jkot 12y ago
      ??? I dont follow. Parents have right for due process, right to raise their own children and so on. Children also have some rights, those might colide wiuth rights of parents in some cases. Problem is that in Norway parents have ZERO rights. Norway have not signed relevant EU treaties for Child Protection. Once children is taken by social servies, there is were little chance for return. SS than bullies parents, forces them to divorce, not even allowed to seek help. To put it in US context: Imagine Alabama would start abducting children of people who just moved in, because their parenting is not religous enough. All perfectly legal with zero chance to get children back (or sometimes even see them ever again).
      - saraid216 12y ago
        > Parents have right for due process, I can agree with that. > right to raise their own children and so on. Says who? Why, precisely? Where is this right enumerated and what is its basis? > Imagine Alabama would start abducting children of people who just moved in, because their parenting is not religous enough. But the issue with this is religious discrimination and a lack of separation between church and state. The wrongness of this has nothing to do with parental rights.

Yeah, Norway is shinning beacon of humanity. Except barnevernet which has even lamer excuses and is for life, not 5 hours.

by jkot 12y ago

Yeah, Norway is shinning beacon of humanity. Except barnevernet which has even lamer excuses and is for life, not 5 hours.

pgrote 12y ago

I was ignorant of the term, but am unsure how it is different than other country's child services. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_Welfare_Services_(Norway) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_Welfare_Services_(Norway...

jkot 12y ago
Norway has way too many similar cases, for such small country of only 5 million people. Barnevernet also puts artificial obstructions for adoption by biological relatives, such as grandparents. As someone said, accused parents in such cases have less rights than Breivik.
- ambrood 12y ago
  I recall a diplomatic incident with India when they tried to take away custody of Indian citizen children from their parents and put them in foster care or something.
- thanksgiving 12y ago
  > As someone said, accused parents in such cases have less rights than Breivik. Hang on a minute. Here in the US, my tax dollars support your children. WIC and Food Stamps and school lunch programs which come from my tax dollars ensure your infants and children do not starve in case something happens to you or your income. As a parent, you get to claim tax deductions which means more money out of my pocket to cover for the loss of tax revenue. As I see it, your children are not your property. The children belong to the community at large. They are my investment. If you are damaging our collective investment, I very much expect you to be relieved of your duties to take care of my investment.
  - javert 12y ago
    Wow, this is incredibly disgusting. To claim that children belong to the community is full-blown communalism, and the end of individual rights. This is one fine distinction away from claiming that we are all property of the State. Parents have an obligation to protect their children, and you are attacking that. Taxation is not an "investment" and does not confer rights. It is non-contractual; it is merely force; it is not entered into voluntarily. You cannot start any valid argument with "Taxation, therefore..." If you don't like paying for WIC and Food Stamps, advocate against those taxes.
    - thanksgiving 12y ago
      I absolutely don't mind safety nets. I don't want people to starve and die. What I detest are tax breaks for having kids or deductions. It is disgusting.
  - jkot 12y ago
    ??? I dont follow. Parents have right for due process, right to raise their own children and so on. Children also have some rights, those might colide wiuth rights of parents in some cases. Problem is that in Norway parents have ZERO rights. Norway have not signed relevant EU treaties for Child Protection. Once children is taken by social servies, there is were little chance for return. SS than bullies parents, forces them to divorce, not even allowed to seek help. To put it in US context: Imagine Alabama would start abducting children of people who just moved in, because their parenting is not religous enough. All perfectly legal with zero chance to get children back (or sometimes even see them ever again).
    - saraid216 12y ago
      > Parents have right for due process, I can agree with that. > right to raise their own children and so on. Says who? Why, precisely? Where is this right enumerated and what is its basis? > Imagine Alabama would start abducting children of people who just moved in, because their parenting is not religous enough. But the issue with this is religious discrimination and a lack of separation between church and state. The wrongness of this has nothing to do with parental rights.