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In the UK, if you can meet the evidential burden to raise the issue that your hard disk is in fact full of random data, then it must be proved beyond reasonable

In the UK, if you can meet the evidential burden to raise the issue that your hard disk is in fact full of random data, then it must be proved beyond reasonable doubt that that is not the case. In other words, unless you aren't even permitted to use that as a defence, the prosecution does actually have to prove that you have a key. Now that we have some experience of successful RIPA prosecutions, the smart advice appears to be 1) don't claim to have created a key that you refuse on principle to turn over, or 2) to have created a key that you've since forgotten: you will be asked how long it is – if short, it won't be reasonable to have forgotten it, if long, unreasonable not to have recorded it elsewhere. Basically don't admit to use of encryption unless you're capable of producing a key.

AnthonyMouse 12y ago
> you will be asked how long it is – if short, it won't be reasonable to have forgotten it, if long, unreasonable not to have recorded it elsewhere. Bullocks. Just yesterday they replaced the keypad on a door I've used a hundred times before and I completely blanked on the combination. It was the same 4-digit number it was before but the keypad was different and that was all it took. On the other hand, the passwords for the computers are 14 random characters, and nobody ever wrote them down because a) they were explicitly forbidden to and b) everyone used them so often they didn't need to. Except that half the time anyone would go on vacation for more than a week they would forget and have to beg the backup admins to restore their home directory because the local data was encrypted but the backups weren't. The idea that it isn't "reasonable" for people to do these things is belied by the fact that they regularly do. And having the police break into your house and turn your life upside down by carting off with half your stuff is exactly the sort of shock that will interfere with your ability to remember. They aren't calling it unreasonable because it's unreasonable, they're calling it unreasonable because they'd rather put innocent people in prison than let guilty people go. The prosecutor is willing to lie about what is reasonable and the judge is willing to believe the lie. But at that point it doesn't matter what you actually do because facts and logic are no longer in play. They're just making things up. If they don't get you for not providing your encryption key then they'll just make up something else for you to be guilty of.

AnthonyMouse 12y ago

> you will be asked how long it is – if short, it won't be reasonable to have forgotten it, if long, unreasonable not to have recorded it elsewhere. Bullocks. Just yesterday they replaced the keypad on a door I've used a hundred times before and I completely blanked on the combination. It was the same 4-digit number it was before but the keypad was different and that was all it took. On the other hand, the passwords for the computers are 14 random characters, and nobody ever wrote them down because a) they were explicitly forbidden to and b) everyone used them so often they didn't need to. Except that half the time anyone would go on vacation for more than a week they would forget and have to beg the backup admins to restore their home directory because the local data was encrypted but the backups weren't. The idea that it isn't "reasonable" for people to do these things is belied by the fact that they regularly do. And having the police break into your house and turn your life upside down by carting off with half your stuff is exactly the sort of shock that will interfere with your ability to remember. They aren't calling it unreasonable because it's unreasonable, they're calling it unreasonable because they'd rather put innocent people in prison than let guilty people go. The prosecutor is willing to lie about what is reasonable and the judge is willing to believe the lie. But at that point it doesn't matter what you actually do because facts and logic are no longer in play. They're just making things up. If they don't get you for not providing your encryption key then they'll just make up something else for you to be guilty of.