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"In such an instance I would likely kill one or more of them" You may want to consider how to react differently in such a situation. That's definitely a fight

"In such an instance I would likely kill one or more of them" You may want to consider how to react differently in such a situation. That's definitely a fight you can't win, and indeed would probably lead to causing your loved ones more pain than it's worth. It's probably best to comply with order in the heat of the moment and later fight it in court. The outcome will be much, much better, I promise.

lhc- 12y ago
I think the fear is less "f*ck the police" here, and more "an unknown entity is breaking into my house", which is a pretty justifiable response. If he knew it was the police, I don't think the first reaction would be to shoot them.
mynameisvlad 12y ago
He's clearly thought about it, he's just saying that due to (I assume) his military background and PTSD, the most likely outcome would be that he kills one of them. It's very hard to not react in a particular way when it's what was ingrained as your method of survival in the field.
- ryanmarsh 12y ago
  Training is forgotten with time. Life experiences seared into your lizard brain never go away. On that note The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg is a great book on the science of how this works.
  - fencepost 12y ago
    I'll second Scott's question about whether you've considered keeping your gun outside the house. Since you know that you react like that and are hopefully doing what you can to change that even if the VA is a mess, it seems to me that the responsible thing to do is also to preemptively mitigate the impact of those reactions, since you already know that your decision-making in the heat of the moment is going to be somewhat hard-wired in a bad direction by past experience. Hell, even just keeping the guns in a gun safe well away from the bedroom would make a big difference. You with a gun become a target, do anything you can to avoid being that target because dead men can't use the video evidence in court.
    - ryanmarsh 12y ago
      I keep the guns really far out of reach so as to require enough time to come to my senses. I've also been through a lot of therapy since then and I'm not nearly as bad off. Thank you for caring.
shaftoe 12y ago
http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/blog/2011/07/third_home_invasion_by_fake_po.html http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/blog/2011/07/thir...
- ryanmarsh 12y ago
  A woman and her children were locked in their house yesterday morning a few miles from me. Thugs kicked in her door early in the morning and robbed the house. Usually they kill/rape/beat the inhabitants. This is a real thing. Also, it's not like I live in a bad area. These are nice suburbs.
  - jason_slack 12y ago
    Where is this they they kill/rape/beat the inhabitants? usually forced entry that is not their intent. Scare, grab and go...am I wrong?
    - sukilot 12y ago
      Parent poster has PTSD-related hyperbole. Home invasion rape and murder are hugely less common than burglary
      - ryanmarsh 12y ago
        We have a problem in the area with home invasion robberies. Last week a woman was raped. A few months ago a family was executed. I'm not exaggerating. This is a thing out here. There is a task force focused on this type of crime but having met the group it's understaffed IMHO.
ryanmarsh 12y ago
Brother, my alarm went off in my house one night when I was in bed because of high winds outside. A door moved slightly in its jamb causing the sensor to trip. I was out the door with my gun and had circled and cleared the perimeter of the house before I knew what happened. My wife says I was screaming at the "intruders" to get out of my house the entire time. I do not remember this. I mean no insult by saying this but you really just cannot understand what this is like unless you've lived it.
- a3n 12y ago
  Sorry we made you go through that man. Even if you did volunteer.
  - PhantomGremlin 12y ago
    I don't know the details about the GP poster. But a lot of people didn't "volunteer" for as much service in Iraq or Afghanistan as they wound up doing. Yes they initially volunteered but then "stop-loss" happened and they had to stay in the active military for far longer than they were originally told they would. Also many people were serving in reserve units or the National Guard (aka "weekend warriors") and entire units wound up being sent to Iraq because we didn't have enough active duty soldiers. There's a hard to use .mil website that has details.[1] E.g deaths just in "Operation Iraqi Freedom" (there are additional ME deaths not included): active duty 3502 reserve 413 National Guard 497 [1] https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/casualties.xhtml https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/casualties.xhtml
    - ryanmarsh 12y ago
      I want no sympathy personally, and I really don't like the "hero" talk. Nobody I ever met in the infantry was oblivious to what they were getting themselves into. Especially not in the airborne. I mean really, they throw you out of airplanes with parachutes made by the lowest bidder. Everyone laughs about dying to cover the fear. When you sign up they are very clear that the term of your enlistment is 8 years whether or not you serve 4 or 5 active. They can call you up anytime in that 8 years. It sucks but again it's not a violation of trust. Still being stop lossed to go back is hugely terrifying for guys ready to transition back to civilian life. Some guys out there really need help. Fallujah and the Korengal were meat grinders. I haven't met a single guy who was boots on the ground there that isn't seriously messed up from it. We owe it to them to get the care they need but the VA is an absolute crime.

lhc- 12y ago

I think the fear is less "f*ck the police" here, and more "an unknown entity is breaking into my house", which is a pretty justifiable response. If he knew it was the police, I don't think the first reaction would be to shoot them.

mynameisvlad 12y ago

He's clearly thought about it, he's just saying that due to (I assume) his military background and PTSD, the most likely outcome would be that he kills one of them. It's very hard to not react in a particular way when it's what was ingrained as your method of survival in the field.

ryanmarsh 12y ago
Training is forgotten with time. Life experiences seared into your lizard brain never go away. On that note The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg is a great book on the science of how this works.
- fencepost 12y ago
  I'll second Scott's question about whether you've considered keeping your gun outside the house. Since you know that you react like that and are hopefully doing what you can to change that even if the VA is a mess, it seems to me that the responsible thing to do is also to preemptively mitigate the impact of those reactions, since you already know that your decision-making in the heat of the moment is going to be somewhat hard-wired in a bad direction by past experience. Hell, even just keeping the guns in a gun safe well away from the bedroom would make a big difference. You with a gun become a target, do anything you can to avoid being that target because dead men can't use the video evidence in court.
  - ryanmarsh 12y ago
    I keep the guns really far out of reach so as to require enough time to come to my senses. I've also been through a lot of therapy since then and I'm not nearly as bad off. Thank you for caring.

shaftoe 12y ago

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/blog/2011/07/third_home_invasion_by_fake_po.html http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/blog/2011/07/thir...

ryanmarsh 12y ago
A woman and her children were locked in their house yesterday morning a few miles from me. Thugs kicked in her door early in the morning and robbed the house. Usually they kill/rape/beat the inhabitants. This is a real thing. Also, it's not like I live in a bad area. These are nice suburbs.
- jason_slack 12y ago
  Where is this they they kill/rape/beat the inhabitants? usually forced entry that is not their intent. Scare, grab and go...am I wrong?
  - sukilot 12y ago
    Parent poster has PTSD-related hyperbole. Home invasion rape and murder are hugely less common than burglary
    - ryanmarsh 12y ago
      We have a problem in the area with home invasion robberies. Last week a woman was raped. A few months ago a family was executed. I'm not exaggerating. This is a thing out here. There is a task force focused on this type of crime but having met the group it's understaffed IMHO.

ryanmarsh 12y ago

Brother, my alarm went off in my house one night when I was in bed because of high winds outside. A door moved slightly in its jamb causing the sensor to trip. I was out the door with my gun and had circled and cleared the perimeter of the house before I knew what happened. My wife says I was screaming at the "intruders" to get out of my house the entire time. I do not remember this. I mean no insult by saying this but you really just cannot understand what this is like unless you've lived it.

a3n 12y ago
Sorry we made you go through that man. Even if you did volunteer.
- PhantomGremlin 12y ago
  I don't know the details about the GP poster. But a lot of people didn't "volunteer" for as much service in Iraq or Afghanistan as they wound up doing. Yes they initially volunteered but then "stop-loss" happened and they had to stay in the active military for far longer than they were originally told they would. Also many people were serving in reserve units or the National Guard (aka "weekend warriors") and entire units wound up being sent to Iraq because we didn't have enough active duty soldiers. There's a hard to use .mil website that has details.[1] E.g deaths just in "Operation Iraqi Freedom" (there are additional ME deaths not included): active duty 3502 reserve 413 National Guard 497 [1] https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/casualties.xhtml https://www.dmdc.osd.mil/dcas/pages/casualties.xhtml
  - ryanmarsh 12y ago
    I want no sympathy personally, and I really don't like the "hero" talk. Nobody I ever met in the infantry was oblivious to what they were getting themselves into. Especially not in the airborne. I mean really, they throw you out of airplanes with parachutes made by the lowest bidder. Everyone laughs about dying to cover the fear. When you sign up they are very clear that the term of your enlistment is 8 years whether or not you serve 4 or 5 active. They can call you up anytime in that 8 years. It sucks but again it's not a violation of trust. Still being stop lossed to go back is hugely terrifying for guys ready to transition back to civilian life. Some guys out there really need help. Fallujah and the Korengal were meat grinders. I haven't met a single guy who was boots on the ground there that isn't seriously messed up from it. We owe it to them to get the care they need but the VA is an absolute crime.