6 ms·

"all the moral righteousness is pretty funny/sad at the same time. they're charging for access to their call center basically. I don't really see anything wrong

"all the moral righteousness is pretty funny/sad at the same time. they're charging for access to their call center basically. I don't really see anything wrong with that." Really? Despite the fact that what the site in question is doing is blatantly predatory in nature? I would be willing to wager that it heavily depends on the naivety of new (read: probably elderly) computer users in order to make money. If you're fine with this, I don't know how you could justify such a position. "the beauty of capitalism is that no one (even you smart geeks) gets to decide what the price of things are. you live and die by consumer demand." Except of course, in situations of monopolies, combines, and cartels (and their respective subsidiaries and holdings), which is how the capitalism you speak of works in the 21st century.

coderdude 17y ago
My step dad bought a subscription to AVG Free for his WinXP Home machine. I would consider it blatantly predatorial to let people do that, even if they activate the one useless plugin that wasn't enabled before. People are going to spend the money.
Periodic 17y ago
I think you two need to separate out what you are talking about. I absolutely agree that "they're charging for access to their call center basically. I don't really see anything wrong with that.". However, I also agree that "what the site in question is doing is blatantly predatory in nature". I would say that there is no transgression in selling these services. However, they should be held liable for deceptive and predatory marketing practices. These things are wonderfully taken care of by the market and consumers. You see, consumers got together and formed an organization to look for people who are trying to take advantage of them and then kick their asses if they don't stop. I believe in most countries it's called a government.
omouse 17y ago
I'm pretty sure the Firefox license allows it to be sold. The only legal problem here is that the people are using the name Firefox which is trademarked by Mozilla Corp.
- jrockway 17y ago
  It is Firefox, though. I can sell a used Ford car and advertise it as such, even though Ford is not my trademark.
nazgulnarsil 17y ago
monopolies only happen because of government enforcement. no price fixing has ever been maintained in history that was not supported by the government. If you have a counter example I would love to hear it because I have done considerable searching on the subject. you're talking about corporatism, plain and simple. as far as being blatantly predatory, unless the site actually lies there isn't a problem. if telling half truths is morally wrong then you have some bigger demons to grapple with than someone selling firefox (car industry, fashion industry, healthcare industry, it never ends).
- turkishrevenge 17y ago
  "monopolies only happen because of government enforcement." Yes, except when the government breaks 'em up. Trust-busting, anyone? See Standard Oil, or for that matter, the Sherman Antitrust Act. I'm really sick of this hearing this. It's like the unabated capitalism of the 19th and 20th centuries never occurred. You talk as though the government arbitrarily picks which corporate entities will become powerful monopolies and which will fail. Last time I checked, the market--that mystical thing people like you so dutifully worship--renders such judgment. What you perceive should is some kind of government patronage, usually at the level of individual politicians, that allows a monopoly situation to arise in the first place, is actually corporate interests intervening in political life for the purposes of fostering a monopolistic agenda and practice. Look at any political campaign. Where does much of the funding come from? Why do corporate interests fund both parties? Simple, to gain a political foot-in-the-door, so to speak. Hell, look at many government advisorial position. Most are occupied by former (although still share holding) CEOs. And corporate directorial boards? They contain former politicians, many with considerable ties to political figures holding office. "as far as being blatantly predatory, unless the site actually lies there isn't a problem. if telling half truths is morally wrong then you have some bigger demons to grapple with" Your cavalier attitude toward this kind of behavior is sickening, at best. If you feel exploitation in any form is justified, then you will have to deal with whatever comes your way, chief.
  - nazgulnarsil 17y ago
    please educate yourself before spouting off http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Oil http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Oil as for exploitation: I am an aware consumer, and everyone else should be too. relying on mommy regulation agency to protect people leads to corruption, or are you unaware of how many deaths are caused by the FDA?

coderdude 17y ago

My step dad bought a subscription to AVG Free for his WinXP Home machine. I would consider it blatantly predatorial to let people do that, even if they activate the one useless plugin that wasn't enabled before. People are going to spend the money.

Periodic 17y ago

I think you two need to separate out what you are talking about. I absolutely agree that "they're charging for access to their call center basically. I don't really see anything wrong with that.". However, I also agree that "what the site in question is doing is blatantly predatory in nature". I would say that there is no transgression in selling these services. However, they should be held liable for deceptive and predatory marketing practices. These things are wonderfully taken care of by the market and consumers. You see, consumers got together and formed an organization to look for people who are trying to take advantage of them and then kick their asses if they don't stop. I believe in most countries it's called a government.

omouse 17y ago

I'm pretty sure the Firefox license allows it to be sold. The only legal problem here is that the people are using the name Firefox which is trademarked by Mozilla Corp.

jrockway 17y ago
It is Firefox, though. I can sell a used Ford car and advertise it as such, even though Ford is not my trademark.

nazgulnarsil 17y ago

monopolies only happen because of government enforcement. no price fixing has ever been maintained in history that was not supported by the government. If you have a counter example I would love to hear it because I have done considerable searching on the subject. you're talking about corporatism, plain and simple. as far as being blatantly predatory, unless the site actually lies there isn't a problem. if telling half truths is morally wrong then you have some bigger demons to grapple with than someone selling firefox (car industry, fashion industry, healthcare industry, it never ends).

turkishrevenge 17y ago
"monopolies only happen because of government enforcement." Yes, except when the government breaks 'em up. Trust-busting, anyone? See Standard Oil, or for that matter, the Sherman Antitrust Act. I'm really sick of this hearing this. It's like the unabated capitalism of the 19th and 20th centuries never occurred. You talk as though the government arbitrarily picks which corporate entities will become powerful monopolies and which will fail. Last time I checked, the market--that mystical thing people like you so dutifully worship--renders such judgment. What you perceive should is some kind of government patronage, usually at the level of individual politicians, that allows a monopoly situation to arise in the first place, is actually corporate interests intervening in political life for the purposes of fostering a monopolistic agenda and practice. Look at any political campaign. Where does much of the funding come from? Why do corporate interests fund both parties? Simple, to gain a political foot-in-the-door, so to speak. Hell, look at many government advisorial position. Most are occupied by former (although still share holding) CEOs. And corporate directorial boards? They contain former politicians, many with considerable ties to political figures holding office. "as far as being blatantly predatory, unless the site actually lies there isn't a problem. if telling half truths is morally wrong then you have some bigger demons to grapple with" Your cavalier attitude toward this kind of behavior is sickening, at best. If you feel exploitation in any form is justified, then you will have to deal with whatever comes your way, chief.
- nazgulnarsil 17y ago
  please educate yourself before spouting off http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Oil http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Oil as for exploitation: I am an aware consumer, and everyone else should be too. relying on mommy regulation agency to protect people leads to corruption, or are you unaware of how many deaths are caused by the FDA?