3 ms·

Having highly-skilled women is a status symbol for companies in some cities, particularly in NYC. They're simply harder and more expensive to attract - e.g. wom

by solve 12y ago

Having highly-skilled women is a status symbol for companies in some cities, particularly in NYC. They're simply harder and more expensive to attract - e.g. women without children get paid 30% more than men with the same education in NYC. In other words: More success -> able to attract and afford more of the expensive status symbols like high-skilled women. Not too sure about a cause and effect in the other direction though.

nl 12y ago
women without children get paid 30% more than men with the same education in NYC. I've never heard that before, and some quick research doesn't seem to back it up. US wide, recent female graduates with the same education as men earn 82% of their salary.[1] [1] http://www.aauw.org/files/2013/02/graduating-to-a-pay-gap-the-earnings-of-women-and-men-one-year-after-college-graduation.pdf http://www.aauw.org/files/2013/02/graduating-to-a-pay-gap-th...
- toolz 12y ago
  That study doesn't take into account children, which are a huge factor, I would imagine. In households with children it is common for the woman to assume the role as the primary caregiver while the man assumes the role of the provider. As such, I imagine the woman likely feels less pressure and has less time to pursue a higher pay, while inversely the man feels pressure to increase his pay to fulfill his assumed role in the family.
- pc86 12y ago
  The point was about NYC in particular, so US-wide statistics are not particularly relevant. And the original point was also about highly skilled workers without children. Your article is a study about 1 year after graduation (from undergrad).
  - nl 12y ago
    Yes I understand that. Hence my request for evidence.
    - pc86 12y ago
      The person you originally responded to provided one in another comment (which seems to suggest 20%, not 30%): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8912097 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8912097
- dogweather 12y ago
  > female graduates ... earn 82% of their salary That's wrong. By the AAUW's own numbers, the women in their study earned 93% of the men's salaries. Get the PDF. Scroll nearly to the end, look for the infographic and text with the 93% number. Personally, then, I split it in the middle, and I'd guess that an unbiased researcher might discover that women earn 96.5% of what men do. The 82% number which the report pushes much more strongly is the difference _before_ womens' choices are taken into account. The sad and disturbing part is that the AAUW (and most of modern feminism?) is pushing bad data for political gains and unfair preferences.
  - nl 12y ago
    Actually the OP's own reference uses the 80% figure too[1]. Wikipedia says between 93% and 96% after controlling, though this isn't for graduates.[2] It is worth noting that it shows a reverse pay gap in a very limited circumstance (some cities, under 30 with no kids). [1] http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274... [2] http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_pay_gap#United_States http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_pay_gap#United_States
forgotAgain 12y ago
women without children get paid 30% more than men with the same education in NYC. Can you provide your source for this?
- solve 12y ago
  Sorry, I stand corrected. It's only 20% higher for young women than men in NYC. http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274... To my original point -- lots of status symbol trends are conflating the cause and effect analysis of why teams with women are more successful. Decent analysis won't be simple, and the analysis is a total failure if they simply ignore this strong factors.
  - forgotAgain 12y ago
    Your source does not suggest that the cause of the salary differential has anything to do with smart women as business status symbols. The article states that the most likely source of the difference is education, that the women are better educated and therefore have higher salaries. Further it holds true more so in cities that have a knowledge based economy.
lostcolony 12y ago
I, too, would like a citation on this (not that I disbelieve you, but I am curious what data and methodology were used to come up with it).
im3w1l 12y ago
Are you comparing women without children against men in general, or women without children against men without children?

by solve 12y ago

nl 12y ago

women without children get paid 30% more than men with the same education in NYC. I've never heard that before, and some quick research doesn't seem to back it up. US wide, recent female graduates with the same education as men earn 82% of their salary.[1] [1] http://www.aauw.org/files/2013/02/graduating-to-a-pay-gap-the-earnings-of-women-and-men-one-year-after-college-graduation.pdf http://www.aauw.org/files/2013/02/graduating-to-a-pay-gap-th...

toolz 12y ago
That study doesn't take into account children, which are a huge factor, I would imagine. In households with children it is common for the woman to assume the role as the primary caregiver while the man assumes the role of the provider. As such, I imagine the woman likely feels less pressure and has less time to pursue a higher pay, while inversely the man feels pressure to increase his pay to fulfill his assumed role in the family.
pc86 12y ago
The point was about NYC in particular, so US-wide statistics are not particularly relevant. And the original point was also about highly skilled workers without children. Your article is a study about 1 year after graduation (from undergrad).
- nl 12y ago
  Yes I understand that. Hence my request for evidence.
  - pc86 12y ago
    The person you originally responded to provided one in another comment (which seems to suggest 20%, not 30%): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8912097 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8912097
dogweather 12y ago
> female graduates ... earn 82% of their salary That's wrong. By the AAUW's own numbers, the women in their study earned 93% of the men's salaries. Get the PDF. Scroll nearly to the end, look for the infographic and text with the 93% number. Personally, then, I split it in the middle, and I'd guess that an unbiased researcher might discover that women earn 96.5% of what men do. The 82% number which the report pushes much more strongly is the difference _before_ womens' choices are taken into account. The sad and disturbing part is that the AAUW (and most of modern feminism?) is pushing bad data for political gains and unfair preferences.
- nl 12y ago
  Actually the OP's own reference uses the 80% figure too[1]. Wikipedia says between 93% and 96% after controlling, though this isn't for graduates.[2] It is worth noting that it shows a reverse pay gap in a very limited circumstance (some cities, under 30 with no kids). [1] http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274... [2] http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_pay_gap#United_States http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_pay_gap#United_States

forgotAgain 12y ago

women without children get paid 30% more than men with the same education in NYC. Can you provide your source for this?

solve 12y ago
Sorry, I stand corrected. It's only 20% higher for young women than men in NYC. http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274... To my original point -- lots of status symbol trends are conflating the cause and effect analysis of why teams with women are more successful. Decent analysis won't be simple, and the analysis is a total failure if they simply ignore this strong factors.
- forgotAgain 12y ago
  Your source does not suggest that the cause of the salary differential has anything to do with smart women as business status symbols. The article states that the most likely source of the difference is education, that the women are better educated and therefore have higher salaries. Further it holds true more so in cities that have a knowledge based economy.

lostcolony 12y ago

I, too, would like a citation on this (not that I disbelieve you, but I am curious what data and methodology were used to come up with it).

im3w1l 12y ago

Are you comparing women without children against men in general, or women without children against men without children?