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I started reading that Baumeister article to complain about the current political climate. Even though it turns out I'm sympathetic to his views there were a f

by stolio 12y ago

I started reading that Baumeister article to complain about the current political climate. Even though it turns out I'm sympathetic to his views there were a few interesting angles, as you put it. One that had never occurred to me: > The first big, basic difference has to do with what I consider to be the most underappreciated fact about gender. Consider this question: What percent of our ancestors were women? It’s not a trick question, and it’s not 50%....Recent research using DNA analysis answered this question about two years ago. Today’s human population is descended from twice as many women as men.

tormeh 12y ago
That may be because most men never get any offspring. It's evolutionarily convenient to only have the genetically best men get women pregnant. A common theory is that the reason we have marriage/monogamy is that the men who get left out of sex don't much like this arrangement and would prefer equal allocation of women.
- meric 12y ago
  Ironic this kind of equality is destroyed as modern society in dismantles traditional marriages in the name of equality.
- stolio 12y ago
  I might as well argue that women started polygamy so more of them could be with the top males. If you lack all of the things it might take to attract female partners (health, money, power, social status, charisma, intelligence, humor, etc.) to the extent that you're getting left out of sex, you don't have the clout to design and implement new institutions.
  - tormeh 12y ago
    There's kinda this thing about numbers, though. 50% of all men is a lot of guys dissatisfied with the status quo. And you don't have to implement new institutions within the existing power structure, you just have to get a group of fellow guys together, run off with some kidnapped girls few will miss and start your own society. Then you invent a religion to justify it, and voila, soon your tribe has reason to go and pillage, burn, rape and convert.
    - stolio 12y ago
      Sounds like the plot from Revenge Of The Nerds. Very unlikely because of the same problem as before: the ability to attract females correlates with the skills needed to start a successful new tribe that can compete with the old. The only way I see to save the argument is to say that the "losers" who left, or were more likely pushed out, stumbled upon some favorable ecology, maybe they stumbled into modern day Europe. But then you're back to geographical determinism and so many things changed in society as agriculture developed that singling out male envy as the cause of monogamy requires more evidence than I think you have.

by stolio 12y ago

tormeh 12y ago

That may be because most men never get any offspring. It's evolutionarily convenient to only have the genetically best men get women pregnant. A common theory is that the reason we have marriage/monogamy is that the men who get left out of sex don't much like this arrangement and would prefer equal allocation of women.

meric 12y ago
Ironic this kind of equality is destroyed as modern society in dismantles traditional marriages in the name of equality.
stolio 12y ago
I might as well argue that women started polygamy so more of them could be with the top males. If you lack all of the things it might take to attract female partners (health, money, power, social status, charisma, intelligence, humor, etc.) to the extent that you're getting left out of sex, you don't have the clout to design and implement new institutions.
- tormeh 12y ago
  There's kinda this thing about numbers, though. 50% of all men is a lot of guys dissatisfied with the status quo. And you don't have to implement new institutions within the existing power structure, you just have to get a group of fellow guys together, run off with some kidnapped girls few will miss and start your own society. Then you invent a religion to justify it, and voila, soon your tribe has reason to go and pillage, burn, rape and convert.
  - stolio 12y ago
    Sounds like the plot from Revenge Of The Nerds. Very unlikely because of the same problem as before: the ability to attract females correlates with the skills needed to start a successful new tribe that can compete with the old. The only way I see to save the argument is to say that the "losers" who left, or were more likely pushed out, stumbled upon some favorable ecology, maybe they stumbled into modern day Europe. But then you're back to geographical determinism and so many things changed in society as agriculture developed that singling out male envy as the cause of monogamy requires more evidence than I think you have.