11 ms·

The thing that strikes me from this report is that he or she (and most of these programmer types working for NSA groups) are just like many of the HN/tech crowd

The thing that strikes me from this report is that he or she (and most of these programmer types working for NSA groups) are just like many of the HN/tech crowd, except they're working for "the other side". Heck, many of them probably read HN every day. > New Zealand was incredible! I wish I’d had more time there, but I did pretty well. I saw a handful of LOTR sights, Mount Cook, a number of gorgeous lakes, snow-capped mountains everywhere ... I absolutely loved my time in Australia, both in terms of work and travel, but I’m also looking forward to returning to the land of Chick-fil-A, college athletics, BBQ pork, and real bacon. Oh, and good beer. It's great that they love their work, but it's too bad so many smart people are going to work on projects that violate so many people's rights.

pyre 12y ago
> violate so many people's rights Don't worry. It's ok because the Good Guys(tm) would never do anything bad. They would make them Bad Guys(tm)!
- click170 12y ago
  I'm going to go ahead and assume you're being farcical. :) The sad thing is that a lot of them probably believe they are the good guys, and that they'll be able to clearly tell when they start crossing a line towards The Dark Side. We all live in our own bubbles, after all. If you've never seen The Boxtrolls, it's a moderately funny newish kids movie, but some of the parts that I enjoyed the most about that movie were the scenes with the two evil henchmen. I enjoyed it because they'd convinced themselves that they were the good guys, fighting the good fight and all that. But as the movie goes on their perspective slowly changes as they become more aware of the impact they're having on the protagonists. I firmly believe there are very few healthy people out there who honestly want to watch the world burn, we should all be aware of the impact we're having on those around us. It's easy to write off an opposing side as evil do-er, but in all likelihood they see themselves as fighting the good fight just as much as you do.
  - pyre 12y ago
    I was poking fun at the black-white views of the world that some people have, the "Us vs. Them" attitudes that crop up, and ideas like "it could never happen in America."
CHY872 12y ago
But how is this particular guy in the wrong? This exploit is something that needs to be specifically installed by someone - it's not something you'd use to exploit the masses, it's something you'd use to monitor a target further once you already had (perhaps temporary) root access. In that sense, it's basically just bread-and-butter spy work. It's hard to accept that the government has any reason to monitor the population to the extent that the NSA does - but it would be conversely completely foolish to say that they have no business developing attacks for computers - it would be like saying they have no business developing lock pick tools or electronic bugs. History has shown that a strong nation has at least some need for intelligence and counter-intelligence, and the US has historically had incredibly poor capabilities for both, which has lead to the deaths of thousands (thinking about Vietnam intelligence specifically). It thus seems at least foolish to criticise what's clearly an impressive targeted exploit - which to some extent demonstrates the US' dominance in the field. This isn't something that the public has any business knowing - this is just plain espionage.
- clamprecht 12y ago
  You're right, I shouldn't single this one person out. I'm thinking of the many who knowingly work on technologies or exploits that are being used to spy on their own citizens.

pyre 12y ago

> violate so many people's rights Don't worry. It's ok because the Good Guys(tm) would never do anything bad. They would make them Bad Guys(tm)!

click170 12y ago
I'm going to go ahead and assume you're being farcical. :) The sad thing is that a lot of them probably believe they are the good guys, and that they'll be able to clearly tell when they start crossing a line towards The Dark Side. We all live in our own bubbles, after all. If you've never seen The Boxtrolls, it's a moderately funny newish kids movie, but some of the parts that I enjoyed the most about that movie were the scenes with the two evil henchmen. I enjoyed it because they'd convinced themselves that they were the good guys, fighting the good fight and all that. But as the movie goes on their perspective slowly changes as they become more aware of the impact they're having on the protagonists. I firmly believe there are very few healthy people out there who honestly want to watch the world burn, we should all be aware of the impact we're having on those around us. It's easy to write off an opposing side as evil do-er, but in all likelihood they see themselves as fighting the good fight just as much as you do.
- pyre 12y ago
  I was poking fun at the black-white views of the world that some people have, the "Us vs. Them" attitudes that crop up, and ideas like "it could never happen in America."

CHY872 12y ago

But how is this particular guy in the wrong? This exploit is something that needs to be specifically installed by someone - it's not something you'd use to exploit the masses, it's something you'd use to monitor a target further once you already had (perhaps temporary) root access. In that sense, it's basically just bread-and-butter spy work. It's hard to accept that the government has any reason to monitor the population to the extent that the NSA does - but it would be conversely completely foolish to say that they have no business developing attacks for computers - it would be like saying they have no business developing lock pick tools or electronic bugs. History has shown that a strong nation has at least some need for intelligence and counter-intelligence, and the US has historically had incredibly poor capabilities for both, which has lead to the deaths of thousands (thinking about Vietnam intelligence specifically). It thus seems at least foolish to criticise what's clearly an impressive targeted exploit - which to some extent demonstrates the US' dominance in the field. This isn't something that the public has any business knowing - this is just plain espionage.

clamprecht 12y ago
You're right, I shouldn't single this one person out. I'm thinking of the many who knowingly work on technologies or exploits that are being used to spy on their own citizens.