7 ms·

Does anyone know how the support for C++11 is looking in this version? It would be pretty great if Microsoft could finally close [the gap](http://blogs.msdn.com

Does anyone know how the support for C++11 is looking in this version? It would be pretty great if Microsoft could finally close [the gap](http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/06/11/c-11-14-feature-tables-for-visual-studio-14-ctp1.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/06/11/c-11-14-fe...) on C++11 support a mere four years after GCC and Clang completed their support for the standard. That would also give some hope that Visual Studio might have full support for C++14 in a year or two (which GCC and Clang have today). Is there an updated support chart somewhere?

jbandela1 12y ago
They are making progress. The latest chart I saw (for the 2015 Preview ) is at http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/17/c-11-14-17-features-in-vs-2015-preview.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/17/c-11-14-17...
Someone 12y ago
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/17/c-11-14-17-features-in-vs-2015-preview.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/17/c-11-14-17... (via http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/12/visual-studio-2015-preview-now-available.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/12/visual-stu...)
- eco 12y ago
  Good to see the two things I've tried to use and wouldn't work in VC++ 2013 (generic lambdas and noexcept) have been implemented.
pjmlp 12y ago
Microsoft is doing a mix of C++11 and C++14 support. http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Visual-Studio/Connect-event-2014/311 http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Visual-Studio/Connect-event-... Still, outside the open source world, from all vendors selling compilers, Microsoft is the most up to date. Before anyone mentions ICC, no not even version 15 is fully compliant. https://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/c0x-features-supported-by-intel-c-compiler https://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/c0x-features-suppo... IBM just realeased XLC with partial C++11 support. Others are even worse.
- TillE 12y ago
  And odd bits of proposed C++17. Picking the low-hanging fruit, I imagine, based on their discussion of the difficulty in supporting other features. I'm waiting impatiently for expression SFINAE. I like the features of C++ that let you write dynamic-esque code that's evaluated at compile time. It enables little bits of cleverness that save you from large complicated solutions. > outside the open source world Which is quite large, considering that Clang and GCC are the standard compilers for just about every major non-Microsoft platform, including the mobile ones.
  - pjmlp 12y ago
    > Which is quite large, considering that Clang and GCC are the standard compilers for just about every major non-Microsoft platform, including the mobile ones. I have worked with a few enterprise customers (Fortune 500) that only allowed the compilers from the respective OS vendors. And new versions required an approval process to be followed. There is more out there than just GNU/Linux, Mac OS X, *BSD and Android. Granted, this was around 10 years ago, but I doubt the situation changed at all in such environments.
  - plorkyeran 12y ago
    The C++17 bits are things proposed by people on the VC++ team, since verifying that something is actually implementable is an important part of writing a good proposal.
    - StephanTLavavej 12y ago
      By my count, none of VC 2015 RTM's C++17 features will have been proposed by MS. N3922 auto and N4086 trigraphs were proposed by Googlers. Same for another Core feature that might be checked in. In the Library, I just checked in void_t, invoke(), and trivially copyable reference_wrapper, none of which I proposed (or anyone else at MS). I did propose auto_ptr/etc.'s removal which was voted into C++17, but it's too late for me to remove that stuff from 2015 RTM.
- binarycrusader 12y ago
ksk 12y ago
Historically Visual C++ has never been the goto compiler for anyone interested in the latest feature set. They have always had an amazing optimizer since they've had to build NT with it. I doubt they're ever going to catch up to GCC/Clang. msvc has to remain ABI compatible with other MS C++ libs like MFC/ATL/etc, and so ABI breaking changes have to wait for the next major version of VC. I think some stuff like COM has work across multiple VC versions without ever breaking.
- buildops 12y ago
  True. In addition, builds can sometimes be slow on MSBuild. Of course, if you're interested in cross platform development Visual Studio 2015 provides some great new features. Additionally, coupled with IncrediBuild (https://www.incredibuild.com/cross-platform.html https://www.incredibuild.com/cross-platform.html) you can get some blazing fast builds
codingthebeach 12y ago
It would be nice if you wouldn't derail the conversation with another tired old "but it's not as good as gcc when it comes to X". This is a CTP. You split hairs over minor points of standards compliance that many devs won't even use on gcc yet because the features are so new, and completely avoid mentioning that the productivity of Visual Studio (for both .NET as well as native C++, including cross-platform C++) arguably dwarfs any other IDE on the market. Have you used, I mean really used, a recent version of Visual Studio for C++ work? Or are you making this comment because you haven't and you find it threatening? Tell you what. You build your C++ app with Xcode 6 or command-line gcc for all it matters. I'll build mine with Visual Studio 2013 or later. We'll see who wins. By the way, I love gcc. Love, love, love. That doesn't mean I have to take pot shots at Visual Studio, which is tooled to the Nth, completely stable, and not at all the old restrictive MS dev environment of yore. The times have changed.
- flohofwoe 12y ago
  It is a fair question given the fact that Visual Studio 2013 doesn't even support basic C++11 features like constexpr. When doing multi-platform C++11 work the code usually must be dumbed down a lot if it needs to compile also in VStudio, e.g.: - can't use many of the new initializer mechanisms in the class declaration (initializer lists, etc...) - no constexpr - std::chrono high resolution click isn't actually high resolution but only has millisecond accuracy Complete list of missing C++11 features up to VS2013 is here: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/hh567368.aspx http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/hh567368.aspx Microsoft should first complete their C++11 support before moving on to C++14, otherwise it will probably never get fixed. Visual Studio is a fine IDE, but the C++ compiler lags behind quite a bit.
  - kyberias 12y ago
    Microsoft obviously should NOT first "complete" their C++11 support since there may very well be more important features in C++14 than some arcane features no-one would use in C++11. Same applies to all the other compiler vendors and all versions of the standard.

jbandela1 12y ago

They are making progress. The latest chart I saw (for the 2015 Preview ) is at http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/17/c-11-14-17-features-in-vs-2015-preview.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/17/c-11-14-17...

Someone 12y ago

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/17/c-11-14-17-features-in-vs-2015-preview.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/17/c-11-14-17... (via http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/12/visual-studio-2015-preview-now-available.aspx http://blogs.msdn.com/b/vcblog/archive/2014/11/12/visual-stu...)

eco 12y ago
Good to see the two things I've tried to use and wouldn't work in VC++ 2013 (generic lambdas and noexcept) have been implemented.

pjmlp 12y ago

Microsoft is doing a mix of C++11 and C++14 support. http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Visual-Studio/Connect-event-2014/311 http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Visual-Studio/Connect-event-... Still, outside the open source world, from all vendors selling compilers, Microsoft is the most up to date. Before anyone mentions ICC, no not even version 15 is fully compliant. https://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/c0x-features-supported-by-intel-c-compiler https://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/c0x-features-suppo... IBM just realeased XLC with partial C++11 support. Others are even worse.

TillE 12y ago
And odd bits of proposed C++17. Picking the low-hanging fruit, I imagine, based on their discussion of the difficulty in supporting other features. I'm waiting impatiently for expression SFINAE. I like the features of C++ that let you write dynamic-esque code that's evaluated at compile time. It enables little bits of cleverness that save you from large complicated solutions. > outside the open source world Which is quite large, considering that Clang and GCC are the standard compilers for just about every major non-Microsoft platform, including the mobile ones.
- pjmlp 12y ago
  > Which is quite large, considering that Clang and GCC are the standard compilers for just about every major non-Microsoft platform, including the mobile ones. I have worked with a few enterprise customers (Fortune 500) that only allowed the compilers from the respective OS vendors. And new versions required an approval process to be followed. There is more out there than just GNU/Linux, Mac OS X, *BSD and Android. Granted, this was around 10 years ago, but I doubt the situation changed at all in such environments.
- plorkyeran 12y ago
  The C++17 bits are things proposed by people on the VC++ team, since verifying that something is actually implementable is an important part of writing a good proposal.
  - StephanTLavavej 12y ago
    By my count, none of VC 2015 RTM's C++17 features will have been proposed by MS. N3922 auto and N4086 trigraphs were proposed by Googlers. Same for another Core feature that might be checked in. In the Library, I just checked in void_t, invoke(), and trivially copyable reference_wrapper, none of which I proposed (or anyone else at MS). I did propose auto_ptr/etc.'s removal which was voted into C++17, but it's too late for me to remove that stuff from 2015 RTM.
binarycrusader 12y ago

ksk 12y ago

Historically Visual C++ has never been the goto compiler for anyone interested in the latest feature set. They have always had an amazing optimizer since they've had to build NT with it. I doubt they're ever going to catch up to GCC/Clang. msvc has to remain ABI compatible with other MS C++ libs like MFC/ATL/etc, and so ABI breaking changes have to wait for the next major version of VC. I think some stuff like COM has work across multiple VC versions without ever breaking.

buildops 12y ago
True. In addition, builds can sometimes be slow on MSBuild. Of course, if you're interested in cross platform development Visual Studio 2015 provides some great new features. Additionally, coupled with IncrediBuild (https://www.incredibuild.com/cross-platform.html https://www.incredibuild.com/cross-platform.html) you can get some blazing fast builds

codingthebeach 12y ago

It would be nice if you wouldn't derail the conversation with another tired old "but it's not as good as gcc when it comes to X". This is a CTP. You split hairs over minor points of standards compliance that many devs won't even use on gcc yet because the features are so new, and completely avoid mentioning that the productivity of Visual Studio (for both .NET as well as native C++, including cross-platform C++) arguably dwarfs any other IDE on the market. Have you used, I mean really used, a recent version of Visual Studio for C++ work? Or are you making this comment because you haven't and you find it threatening? Tell you what. You build your C++ app with Xcode 6 or command-line gcc for all it matters. I'll build mine with Visual Studio 2013 or later. We'll see who wins. By the way, I love gcc. Love, love, love. That doesn't mean I have to take pot shots at Visual Studio, which is tooled to the Nth, completely stable, and not at all the old restrictive MS dev environment of yore. The times have changed.

flohofwoe 12y ago
It is a fair question given the fact that Visual Studio 2013 doesn't even support basic C++11 features like constexpr. When doing multi-platform C++11 work the code usually must be dumbed down a lot if it needs to compile also in VStudio, e.g.: - can't use many of the new initializer mechanisms in the class declaration (initializer lists, etc...) - no constexpr - std::chrono high resolution click isn't actually high resolution but only has millisecond accuracy Complete list of missing C++11 features up to VS2013 is here: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/hh567368.aspx http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/hh567368.aspx Microsoft should first complete their C++11 support before moving on to C++14, otherwise it will probably never get fixed. Visual Studio is a fine IDE, but the C++ compiler lags behind quite a bit.
- kyberias 12y ago
  Microsoft obviously should NOT first "complete" their C++11 support since there may very well be more important features in C++14 than some arcane features no-one would use in C++11. Same applies to all the other compiler vendors and all versions of the standard.