4 ms·

> I'm disappointed EFF would make such a lame list of complaints, while having locks on their doors. What are you talking about. Seriously nothing in your post

> I'm disappointed EFF would make such a lame list of complaints, while having locks on their doors. What are you talking about. Seriously nothing in your post makes sense.

ceejayoz 12y ago
I was able to make sense of the post. I'd say Apple prioritizes their customers' rights to have a secure, safe, functional device that's reasonably free from concerns over things like malware and other malicious app behaviors. This has some developer downsides, but as both a customer and a developer on Apple products, I'd prefer they prioritize the user experience over development.
- Flimm 12y ago
  Apple is contractually forcing developers to not discuss the contract, in what way is that good for users? Apple can still have a walled garden without contractually requiring developers to forgo their right to jailbreak their own device. DRM does not benefit users at all. It is not necessary to have DRM to have a walled garden.
  - sbuk 12y ago
    "Apple is contractually forcing developers to not discuss the contract, in what way is that good for users?" What way isn't it? To what end does an end user need to know what the content of an agreement between to third parties is? "Apple can still have a walled garden without contractually requiring developers to forgo their right to jailbreak their own device." "It is not necessary to have DRM to have a walled garden." Where is the DRM in the App store? I ask because I genuinely don't know. I would like to know in simple terms as the EFF have a tendency to use emotive language that detracts from the point.
  - ctdonath 12y ago
    "Good for users"? it's not the users' business to know details of contracts between developers & Apple. Jailbreak away - but Apple rightfully disavows any predicted or unforeseen consequences, and won't work with anyone who won't work with what Apple considers sensible rules facilitating development & usage. If you're going to bring bags of weed seeds (or anything else which predictably cause problems) into my walled garden, get out of my garden. DRM assures you can use your purchased products on the devices you want ... and that nobody else can, and that nobody is going to repackage apps to include malware.
    - Retra 12y ago
      >"Good for users"? it's not the users' business to know details of contracts between developers & Apple. Who are you to say what a user's business is? If someone is engaging in unethical conduct, it is their customers' right to know about it. How are consumers supposed to make informed decisions if they do not even know what they are funding?
      - sbuk 12y ago
        What is unethical? What are they funding? Why the emotive language? Who are you or the EFF to say that it is anybody's business to know about two other third parties agreements? What difference will it make to consumers to know what the contract stipulates?
        Retra 12y ago
        >What is unethical? What are they funding? That's exactly what the consumer wants to know. They are funding whatever is stipulated in those contracts. >Who are you or the EFF to say that it is anybody's business I am me, and I say what is my business.
        ctdonath 12y ago
        Then work out a contract with the other two. If they don't agree to your terms, then it literally is not your business.
        Retra 12y ago
        Attempting to establishing a legal obligation to share information is pretty much that, I would think. Seems like that's the whole point of a democracy, no? To allow the people to make things their business? I mean, if Apple doesn't want their contracts (which are enforced by democratic American law) to be the business of the American people, then maybe they should leave the country.
        12y ago
ctdonath 12y ago
It's like an apartment complex owner, expected to provide a certain level of "security" in the form of locking doors, fences, lights, live guards, etc ... but then a tenant complains that the self-locking building door is keeping his friends out, that the fence prevents him from entering from the otherwise most convenient path, the lights keep him awake, and the guard patrol is preventing him from growing pot plants on his porch. The tenant then solicits signatures for a petition unlocking all the doors (ALL of them, closets included), removing fences & lights, firing the guards, and otherwise removing hindrances to growing a pot farm ... and then being surprised when most of the other tenants insult the idea.

> I'm disappointed EFF would make such a lame list of complaints, while having locks on their doors. What are you talking about. Seriously nothing in your post makes sense.

ceejayoz 12y ago

I was able to make sense of the post. I'd say Apple prioritizes their customers' rights to have a secure, safe, functional device that's reasonably free from concerns over things like malware and other malicious app behaviors. This has some developer downsides, but as both a customer and a developer on Apple products, I'd prefer they prioritize the user experience over development.

Flimm 12y ago
Apple is contractually forcing developers to not discuss the contract, in what way is that good for users? Apple can still have a walled garden without contractually requiring developers to forgo their right to jailbreak their own device. DRM does not benefit users at all. It is not necessary to have DRM to have a walled garden.
- sbuk 12y ago
  "Apple is contractually forcing developers to not discuss the contract, in what way is that good for users?" What way isn't it? To what end does an end user need to know what the content of an agreement between to third parties is? "Apple can still have a walled garden without contractually requiring developers to forgo their right to jailbreak their own device." "It is not necessary to have DRM to have a walled garden." Where is the DRM in the App store? I ask because I genuinely don't know. I would like to know in simple terms as the EFF have a tendency to use emotive language that detracts from the point.
- ctdonath 12y ago
  "Good for users"? it's not the users' business to know details of contracts between developers & Apple. Jailbreak away - but Apple rightfully disavows any predicted or unforeseen consequences, and won't work with anyone who won't work with what Apple considers sensible rules facilitating development & usage. If you're going to bring bags of weed seeds (or anything else which predictably cause problems) into my walled garden, get out of my garden. DRM assures you can use your purchased products on the devices you want ... and that nobody else can, and that nobody is going to repackage apps to include malware.
  - Retra 12y ago
    >"Good for users"? it's not the users' business to know details of contracts between developers & Apple. Who are you to say what a user's business is? If someone is engaging in unethical conduct, it is their customers' right to know about it. How are consumers supposed to make informed decisions if they do not even know what they are funding?
    - sbuk 12y ago
      What is unethical? What are they funding? Why the emotive language? Who are you or the EFF to say that it is anybody's business to know about two other third parties agreements? What difference will it make to consumers to know what the contract stipulates?
      - Retra 12y ago
        >What is unethical? What are they funding? That's exactly what the consumer wants to know. They are funding whatever is stipulated in those contracts. >Who are you or the EFF to say that it is anybody's business I am me, and I say what is my business.
        ctdonath 12y ago
        Then work out a contract with the other two. If they don't agree to your terms, then it literally is not your business.
        Retra 12y ago
        Attempting to establishing a legal obligation to share information is pretty much that, I would think. Seems like that's the whole point of a democracy, no? To allow the people to make things their business? I mean, if Apple doesn't want their contracts (which are enforced by democratic American law) to be the business of the American people, then maybe they should leave the country.
        12y ago

ctdonath 12y ago

It's like an apartment complex owner, expected to provide a certain level of "security" in the form of locking doors, fences, lights, live guards, etc ... but then a tenant complains that the self-locking building door is keeping his friends out, that the fence prevents him from entering from the otherwise most convenient path, the lights keep him awake, and the guard patrol is preventing him from growing pot plants on his porch. The tenant then solicits signatures for a petition unlocking all the doors (ALL of them, closets included), removing fences & lights, firing the guards, and otherwise removing hindrances to growing a pot farm ... and then being surprised when most of the other tenants insult the idea.