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I used to wear a Pebble watch every day and found it useful but not overly so. That needed charging every 5-7 days, and this claims to last a week on a single c

by nolk100 12y ago

I used to wear a Pebble watch every day and found it useful but not overly so. That needed charging every 5-7 days, and this claims to last a week on a single charge. I don't wear the pebble watch any more because as lazy as it sounds, I kept forgetting to charge it when it ran out of battery, and there were days where I was walking around with a dead watch, which was at that point essentially an expensive wristband. With my phone, I know I need to charge it every day and it is a habit to plug it in just before I go to sleep every day. With the pebble, and I think this too, sometimes the battery would last 5 days, sometimes 8, and that irregular charging cycles means it's hard to form habits around charging. It became annoying to remember to charge the Pebble and take it off and put it on again. The benefits from having it became less appealing. I fear the same might happen with this if I were to own it, and it would become a bulky iPhone case. At $129 it might be worth a punt but I'm skeptical.

madeofpalk 12y ago
> That needed charging every 5-7 days, and this claims to last a week on a single charge. I don't wear the pebble watch any more because as lazy as it sounds, I kept forgetting to charge it when it ran out of battery. Personally, I think this is why Apple will aim for a one day battery life for the Apple Watch. It's much easier to remember to put you watch on to charge every night, than to remember every 3 or 4 days.
- philippnagel 12y ago
  You are implying they could have built a watch that lasts longer but didn't?
  - madeofpalk 12y ago
    Definitely not - I'm saying that an Apple Watch with a one day battery life would not be a failure and would (IMO) be preferable over a 2 or 3 day battery life (regardless of whether they could make it now or in the future). As many have pointed out Apple (and others) seem to 'solve for X' in regards to battery life. One day seems like an ideal 'X' for a smart watch.
    - moe 12y ago
      one day battery life [...] would (IMO) be preferable over a 2 or 3 day battery life That makes absolutely no sense. Nobody forces you to use the "extra" battery time. Nothing stops you from pretending it doesn't exist and charging your gizmo every night.
      - benplumley 12y ago
        While I don't think it's a big enough reason to actively decide to put a smaller battery in, I'm sure I'm not the only one who hates putting things on charge for longer than they need. The battery losing its capacity is probably the single biggest reason for me having to replace my devices, and whether it's an outdated notion or not, it's in my head that leaving something on charge when it's full kills the battery.
        sp332 12y ago
        Pushing a lithium-ion cell up to max charge and leaving it there probably shortens its life a bit, but what's much worse is running it down.
      - fps 12y ago
        except years of training around battery charging that says not to charge a half (or 3/4) full battery. I could put my kindle on the charger every night, even though it lasts 2 weeks on a charge, but I'm pretty certain that would kill the battery dead in a few months.
        rpdillon 12y ago
        Kindle (and many other devices) use lithium polymer batteries, which don't have memory and don't require deep discharge. In fact, their life is increased when charged often, since depth of discharge determines overall cycle count, and deep discharge on LiPo is harmful. In short, charging your Kindle frequently is just fine.
wastedhours 12y ago
I know what you mean about habit forming - I have a G Watch and the battery lasts 36 hours, at first it was a case of charging it at home, seeing it not moaning about low battery at night, then having it die at work the next day. I've had it nigh on 6 months, but have only just adapted to putting it on to charge every night with my phone.
moe 12y ago
Why don't you just put both on the charger every night then?
- nolk100 12y ago
  In the case of a watch, it's hassle. You have to take it off and put it on every night. I know some people do this with watches anyway but I don't In terms of this product, it would be easier to charge it, but there is still the mental block around charging something which still has 90% battery. That seems wasteful to me
  - organsnyder 12y ago
    I got a Pebble a few weeks ago. I use it for sleep tracking as well as daily wear, so charging at night isn't an option. I've gotten into the habit of charging it every morning while I shower and shave. Even when I'm extra-quick with my morning routine, I still find that the 15-20 minutes is enough to bring it back to 100%. From everything I've read, lithium batteries actually do better when they're not discharged all the way—the only downside being that the device's battery gauge can lose calibration over time (hence the recommendation to do a deep discharge every 30-50 cycles or so). This habit also will extend the useful life of the watch for me: Since I'm already in the habit of topping off daily, when the battery begins to lose capacity (down to 3 days from the initial 7, for instance), I won't even notice.
JohnTHaller 12y ago
This display is actually electronic paper, so the display doesn't use power once it's set. Power is just used by the bluetooth and rest of the bits to monitor for changes in the display. If they could let you switch it on only when you want to change it, it could likely last a lot longer. The Pebble has a fake "e-paper" screen that's actually not electronic paper, it's a black and white LCD which constantly draws paper.
- mcb3k 12y ago
  e-paper, or electronic paper, is a generic term for any kind of display that doesn't work by emitting light, which the pebble, the popSLATE, and ereaders like the nook or kindle do. What you are describing is e-Ink, which is a specific implementation of a non-light-emitting screen generally used in ereaders. That being said, it does seem that popSLATE is using a screen like what is used in an ereader, and not like what is used in the pebble.
  - JohnTHaller 12y ago
    The thing is, pre Pebble, everyone understood that both terms meant something that didn't use power once an image was displayed. The Pebble is the first product I was aware of that abused the term. Everyone I spoke to thought it was the same clear display used in an ereader when it's actually just similar tech to my retired Palm III.
    - mcb3k 12y ago
      I don't really think it abuses the term, since it doesn't require a backlight to display things, it is technically correct to call it e-paper. I also remember the people at Pebble discussing the differences between e-Ink and e-paper when it first came out. It's not like they hid how the Pebble's display worked. Besides, an e-Ink screen would be a horrible experience given how the display gets used in the Pebble watch.
      - JohnTHaller 12y ago
spike021 12y ago
I understand where you're coming from, but I don't know that it's a common problem. I've had my Pebble for about 4.5 months now and remembering to charge it can be interesting. I usually forget when I last charged it, but even then there are low battery alerts. I know that it'll last about a day once I see the "20% remaining" message, so I just charge it within 6-12 hours of that message. It's not really too much of a hassle to remove the watch for a couple hours while sitting at my desk, and I've heard of people who charge it while sitting at a desk wearing it.

by nolk100 12y ago

madeofpalk 12y ago

> That needed charging every 5-7 days, and this claims to last a week on a single charge. I don't wear the pebble watch any more because as lazy as it sounds, I kept forgetting to charge it when it ran out of battery. Personally, I think this is why Apple will aim for a one day battery life for the Apple Watch. It's much easier to remember to put you watch on to charge every night, than to remember every 3 or 4 days.

philippnagel 12y ago
You are implying they could have built a watch that lasts longer but didn't?
- madeofpalk 12y ago
  Definitely not - I'm saying that an Apple Watch with a one day battery life would not be a failure and would (IMO) be preferable over a 2 or 3 day battery life (regardless of whether they could make it now or in the future). As many have pointed out Apple (and others) seem to 'solve for X' in regards to battery life. One day seems like an ideal 'X' for a smart watch.
  - moe 12y ago
    one day battery life [...] would (IMO) be preferable over a 2 or 3 day battery life That makes absolutely no sense. Nobody forces you to use the "extra" battery time. Nothing stops you from pretending it doesn't exist and charging your gizmo every night.
    - benplumley 12y ago
      While I don't think it's a big enough reason to actively decide to put a smaller battery in, I'm sure I'm not the only one who hates putting things on charge for longer than they need. The battery losing its capacity is probably the single biggest reason for me having to replace my devices, and whether it's an outdated notion or not, it's in my head that leaving something on charge when it's full kills the battery.
      - sp332 12y ago
        Pushing a lithium-ion cell up to max charge and leaving it there probably shortens its life a bit, but what's much worse is running it down.
    - fps 12y ago
      except years of training around battery charging that says not to charge a half (or 3/4) full battery. I could put my kindle on the charger every night, even though it lasts 2 weeks on a charge, but I'm pretty certain that would kill the battery dead in a few months.
      - rpdillon 12y ago
        Kindle (and many other devices) use lithium polymer batteries, which don't have memory and don't require deep discharge. In fact, their life is increased when charged often, since depth of discharge determines overall cycle count, and deep discharge on LiPo is harmful. In short, charging your Kindle frequently is just fine.

wastedhours 12y ago

I know what you mean about habit forming - I have a G Watch and the battery lasts 36 hours, at first it was a case of charging it at home, seeing it not moaning about low battery at night, then having it die at work the next day. I've had it nigh on 6 months, but have only just adapted to putting it on to charge every night with my phone.

moe 12y ago

Why don't you just put both on the charger every night then?

nolk100 12y ago
In the case of a watch, it's hassle. You have to take it off and put it on every night. I know some people do this with watches anyway but I don't In terms of this product, it would be easier to charge it, but there is still the mental block around charging something which still has 90% battery. That seems wasteful to me
- organsnyder 12y ago
  I got a Pebble a few weeks ago. I use it for sleep tracking as well as daily wear, so charging at night isn't an option. I've gotten into the habit of charging it every morning while I shower and shave. Even when I'm extra-quick with my morning routine, I still find that the 15-20 minutes is enough to bring it back to 100%. From everything I've read, lithium batteries actually do better when they're not discharged all the way—the only downside being that the device's battery gauge can lose calibration over time (hence the recommendation to do a deep discharge every 30-50 cycles or so). This habit also will extend the useful life of the watch for me: Since I'm already in the habit of topping off daily, when the battery begins to lose capacity (down to 3 days from the initial 7, for instance), I won't even notice.

JohnTHaller 12y ago

This display is actually electronic paper, so the display doesn't use power once it's set. Power is just used by the bluetooth and rest of the bits to monitor for changes in the display. If they could let you switch it on only when you want to change it, it could likely last a lot longer. The Pebble has a fake "e-paper" screen that's actually not electronic paper, it's a black and white LCD which constantly draws paper.

mcb3k 12y ago
e-paper, or electronic paper, is a generic term for any kind of display that doesn't work by emitting light, which the pebble, the popSLATE, and ereaders like the nook or kindle do. What you are describing is e-Ink, which is a specific implementation of a non-light-emitting screen generally used in ereaders. That being said, it does seem that popSLATE is using a screen like what is used in an ereader, and not like what is used in the pebble.
- JohnTHaller 12y ago
  The thing is, pre Pebble, everyone understood that both terms meant something that didn't use power once an image was displayed. The Pebble is the first product I was aware of that abused the term. Everyone I spoke to thought it was the same clear display used in an ereader when it's actually just similar tech to my retired Palm III.
  - mcb3k 12y ago
    I don't really think it abuses the term, since it doesn't require a backlight to display things, it is technically correct to call it e-paper. I also remember the people at Pebble discussing the differences between e-Ink and e-paper when it first came out. It's not like they hid how the Pebble's display worked. Besides, an e-Ink screen would be a horrible experience given how the display gets used in the Pebble watch.
    - JohnTHaller 12y ago

spike021 12y ago

I understand where you're coming from, but I don't know that it's a common problem. I've had my Pebble for about 4.5 months now and remembering to charge it can be interesting. I usually forget when I last charged it, but even then there are low battery alerts. I know that it'll last about a day once I see the "20% remaining" message, so I just charge it within 6-12 hours of that message. It's not really too much of a hassle to remove the watch for a couple hours while sitting at my desk, and I've heard of people who charge it while sitting at a desk wearing it.