7 ms·

Goats fighting America's plant invasion

66 points by fidotron 12y ago

veidr 12y ago
I love this hack. My mom had a small herd of pygmie goats for her Montessori preschool. Some guy she knew convinced her to rent them out for this kind of job. It wasn't the money that convinced her (don't think those little guys were the best earners) but the idea that "we could send in dudes with poison sprayers and loud gas power mowers, or we could just send Billy and his friends in to quietly munch on it for a few hours/days". So many more eco points for doing it with the goats. Plus goats are intelligent and an interesting population to have suddenly show up and take over a spot. If there were any kids at the cleanup spot, interacting with the goats was good for the kids. While being chauffeured to various feasts kept the goats in high spirits. Even the obvious down side isn't that bad -- goat shit comes out in these clean little dry pellets; much better than dog shit or cow shit or bird shit or a San Francisco sidewalk.
- rprospero 12y ago
  > If there were any kids at the cleanup spot, interacting with the goats was good for the kids. I read this sentence three times before finally deciding that you were using "kid" to refer to human children and not young goats. It's true either way.
stinos 12y ago
Another advantage which isn't mentioned: the goats (or similar grazing species) are also walking manure factories (really, compared to a compost heap they are machines), so pretty effective at spreading fertilizer all over the place. Automatically and for free :P They perfectly fit in the self-sufficiency style - especially compared to the alternative worst-case senario: you don't need to get your polluting vehicle and drive to a store to pay money for some chemicals, then drive back and use some other polluting machine to get the checmical crap where it has to do whatever it does. Oh yeah, and repeat every year and be left with unhealthy soil. Which can probably be countered with more chemicals, yay!
soneca 12y ago
relevant map: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/01/12/map-literally-every-goat-in-the-united-states/ http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/01/12/m...
dalke 12y ago
It takes 8 years for goat news to cross the Atlantic. ;) The NYT had an article titled "In Tennessee, Goats Eat the ‘Vine That Ate the South’" in 2007, at http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/05/us/05goats.html?_r=0 http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/05/us/05goats.html?_r=0 . Tallahassee started using sheep in 1999 for kudzu. Unfortunately, people stole 10 of the sheep in 2001 (http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/072701/met_6795173.html http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/072701/met_6795173... ) and another 21 in 2003 (http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20031004/NEWS/310040550 http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20031004/NEWS/310040550 ). I can't find mention of Tallahassee still using animals for kudzu control.
ndespres 12y ago
When my coworkers see news like this they start telling me that I ought to bring my fleet of Nubian goats out on jobs like this. They do great work, easily digesting poison ivy (and destroying its seeds so it can't regrow from their droppings). Goats are a big component of a project I'm working on now, where they will graze on fallow land, eating weeds and grasses, depositing fertilizer and tilling the land with their hooves in the process. In a small farming operation where the negatives to using many chemicals (to fertilize crops, and to kill weeds) isn't even always safety or environmental, but simply cost-related: the work that grazing animals like goats can provide is a game-changer. Plus, they are super fun animals to be around. I used to think that having a few backyard chickens for eggs would always be a no-brainer decision, but now I am sure that I'll always keep a couple goats around too.
- stinos 12y ago
  they will graze on fallow land, eating weeds and grasses, depositing fertilizer and tilling the land with their hooves in the process Almost literally as it's described by John Seymour! Ok he talks about pigs, but there's not that much difference - quote: To say nothing of the fact that pigs are the finest free cultivators that were ever invented! They will clear your land, and plough it, and dung it, and harrow it, and leave it nearly ready for you to put your seed in, with no more labour to you than the occasional shifting of an electric fence
  - ndespres 12y ago
    I've got my hands full with my current flock, but I would love to have pigs for this reason (among others). Would be great to have them root around in some scrub land as Seymour describes, then use its new fertility to grow grains to feed myself and the goats, continuing the cycle! Just not enough time in the day :)
    - stinos 12y ago
      Yeah I know the feeling, never enough time. Maintaining land+flock really seems to be a full time job. But pigs are awesome, very intelligent as well. We have some kunekune pigs and while they don't prepare the land as described above, they do happily eat grass and various kinds of plants the entire day and usually drop their dung in a couple of confined places so it's relatively easy to collect and use elsewhere. But I admit the main reason we have them is they are super adorable, cute, friendly, funny, play well together with goats, loved by children, don't require much looking after, you name it. Highly recommened :P
MrBuddyCasino 12y ago
When Amazon Japan used goats as lawnmowers [1], proper procedure had to be maintained: "The company has officially hired the goats following a procedure similar to the one used when hiring humans: it made identity cards for goats, just as it did for its human employees." [1] http://www.tokyotimes.com/amazon-japan-hires-goats-to-mow-grass/ http://www.tokyotimes.com/amazon-japan-hires-goats-to-mow-gr...
Eye_of_Mordor 12y ago
Aren't these goats also an invasive species?
- coldcode 12y ago
  A very tasty one at that. You can't eat kudzu like you can a tasty goat.
  - Amezarak 12y ago
    Actually, kudzu is edible. But it certainly isn't as delicious as goat!
    - coldcode 12y ago
      I wonder if you could stuff a goat with kudzu and bake it? Seems recursive in a way.
- zwieback 12y ago
  I was wondering about that too, hopefully nothing like the wild pigs that plague Texas will happen with the goats. We might just have to bring in tigers or something like that to control the goats later on...
  - pixl97 12y ago
    In general hogs breed 3 to 4 times faster based on litter size.
  - Eye_of_Mordor 12y ago
    The Europeans or the Mexicans?
manishsharan 12y ago
I have always wondered why western nations do not consume goat meat. One of my christian friends mentioned is that ii is because of hooves and devil symbolism; is there any merit to this argument ? I understand Hindus don't eat beef because of religious reasons and muslims don't eat pork also because of religious reasons. This is a comparison of nutritional value of goat vs. beef vs pork. http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=goat+meat+vs.+beef+vs.+pork http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=goat+meat+vs.+beef+vs.+... . Bon Apetit!
- brational 12y ago
  That religious thing is a rarity. People don't eat goat because its not really available. I, american, find it delicious but have only ever had it in indian restaurants.
- hkarthik 12y ago
  At this point in time, the cultural issues around eating goat meat in the west are probably less of a factor and it has more to do with logistics and regulation. The supply chains around industrial factory farming for poultry, beef, and pork are very mature. They've also engaged in regulatory capture for nearly half a century. Many laws and regulations exist which would lock out new sources of meat to the average American consumer. Goat milk and cheese, are becoming more popular, however. So there is a ready supply of livestock. So things could easily change.
- digi_owl 12y ago
  I suspect it is a matter of taste. As for the pork thing, it is not just muslims. Strictly speaking christians should not touch it either as it is part of the old testament. My personal take on this is that back then someone observed that people that ate pork often ended up sick and died. While we now know that is is because of an illness passed from pig to human, back then it may well have been interpreted as divine punishment. But then those days religion and law was one and the same, and so the declaration of pork as unclean may well be seen as a health and safety regulation. Supposedly you can find passages from nearby cultures that line up very well with the old testament, with one crucial difference. While other cultures makes violations an offense against society, the bible makes them an offense against god. Meaning that what others deemed a social or secular matter, suddenly became religious.
logn 12y ago
Shark Tank season 5, episode 5: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHqBFqh-SIY&t=1340 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHqBFqh-SIY&t=1340
debacle 12y ago
TIL phragmites is an invasive species. An incredibly fun and useful plant, right up there with day lily (also invasive and hardy). Kudzu is beautiful but incredibly destructive.

66 points by fidotron 12y ago

veidr 12y ago

I love this hack. My mom had a small herd of pygmie goats for her Montessori preschool. Some guy she knew convinced her to rent them out for this kind of job. It wasn't the money that convinced her (don't think those little guys were the best earners) but the idea that "we could send in dudes with poison sprayers and loud gas power mowers, or we could just send Billy and his friends in to quietly munch on it for a few hours/days". So many more eco points for doing it with the goats. Plus goats are intelligent and an interesting population to have suddenly show up and take over a spot. If there were any kids at the cleanup spot, interacting with the goats was good for the kids. While being chauffeured to various feasts kept the goats in high spirits. Even the obvious down side isn't that bad -- goat shit comes out in these clean little dry pellets; much better than dog shit or cow shit or bird shit or a San Francisco sidewalk.

rprospero 12y ago
> If there were any kids at the cleanup spot, interacting with the goats was good for the kids. I read this sentence three times before finally deciding that you were using "kid" to refer to human children and not young goats. It's true either way.

stinos 12y ago

Another advantage which isn't mentioned: the goats (or similar grazing species) are also walking manure factories (really, compared to a compost heap they are machines), so pretty effective at spreading fertilizer all over the place. Automatically and for free :P They perfectly fit in the self-sufficiency style - especially compared to the alternative worst-case senario: you don't need to get your polluting vehicle and drive to a store to pay money for some chemicals, then drive back and use some other polluting machine to get the checmical crap where it has to do whatever it does. Oh yeah, and repeat every year and be left with unhealthy soil. Which can probably be countered with more chemicals, yay!

soneca 12y ago

relevant map: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/01/12/map-literally-every-goat-in-the-united-states/ http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/01/12/m...

dalke 12y ago

It takes 8 years for goat news to cross the Atlantic. ;) The NYT had an article titled "In Tennessee, Goats Eat the ‘Vine That Ate the South’" in 2007, at http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/05/us/05goats.html?_r=0 http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/05/us/05goats.html?_r=0 . Tallahassee started using sheep in 1999 for kudzu. Unfortunately, people stole 10 of the sheep in 2001 (http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/072701/met_6795173.html http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/072701/met_6795173... ) and another 21 in 2003 (http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20031004/NEWS/310040550 http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20031004/NEWS/310040550 ). I can't find mention of Tallahassee still using animals for kudzu control.

ndespres 12y ago

When my coworkers see news like this they start telling me that I ought to bring my fleet of Nubian goats out on jobs like this. They do great work, easily digesting poison ivy (and destroying its seeds so it can't regrow from their droppings). Goats are a big component of a project I'm working on now, where they will graze on fallow land, eating weeds and grasses, depositing fertilizer and tilling the land with their hooves in the process. In a small farming operation where the negatives to using many chemicals (to fertilize crops, and to kill weeds) isn't even always safety or environmental, but simply cost-related: the work that grazing animals like goats can provide is a game-changer. Plus, they are super fun animals to be around. I used to think that having a few backyard chickens for eggs would always be a no-brainer decision, but now I am sure that I'll always keep a couple goats around too.

stinos 12y ago
they will graze on fallow land, eating weeds and grasses, depositing fertilizer and tilling the land with their hooves in the process Almost literally as it's described by John Seymour! Ok he talks about pigs, but there's not that much difference - quote: To say nothing of the fact that pigs are the finest free cultivators that were ever invented! They will clear your land, and plough it, and dung it, and harrow it, and leave it nearly ready for you to put your seed in, with no more labour to you than the occasional shifting of an electric fence
- ndespres 12y ago
  I've got my hands full with my current flock, but I would love to have pigs for this reason (among others). Would be great to have them root around in some scrub land as Seymour describes, then use its new fertility to grow grains to feed myself and the goats, continuing the cycle! Just not enough time in the day :)
  - stinos 12y ago
    Yeah I know the feeling, never enough time. Maintaining land+flock really seems to be a full time job. But pigs are awesome, very intelligent as well. We have some kunekune pigs and while they don't prepare the land as described above, they do happily eat grass and various kinds of plants the entire day and usually drop their dung in a couple of confined places so it's relatively easy to collect and use elsewhere. But I admit the main reason we have them is they are super adorable, cute, friendly, funny, play well together with goats, loved by children, don't require much looking after, you name it. Highly recommened :P

MrBuddyCasino 12y ago

When Amazon Japan used goats as lawnmowers [1], proper procedure had to be maintained: "The company has officially hired the goats following a procedure similar to the one used when hiring humans: it made identity cards for goats, just as it did for its human employees." [1] http://www.tokyotimes.com/amazon-japan-hires-goats-to-mow-grass/ http://www.tokyotimes.com/amazon-japan-hires-goats-to-mow-gr...

Eye_of_Mordor 12y ago

Aren't these goats also an invasive species?

coldcode 12y ago
A very tasty one at that. You can't eat kudzu like you can a tasty goat.
- Amezarak 12y ago
  Actually, kudzu is edible. But it certainly isn't as delicious as goat!
  - coldcode 12y ago
    I wonder if you could stuff a goat with kudzu and bake it? Seems recursive in a way.
zwieback 12y ago
I was wondering about that too, hopefully nothing like the wild pigs that plague Texas will happen with the goats. We might just have to bring in tigers or something like that to control the goats later on...
- pixl97 12y ago
  In general hogs breed 3 to 4 times faster based on litter size.
- Eye_of_Mordor 12y ago
  The Europeans or the Mexicans?

manishsharan 12y ago

I have always wondered why western nations do not consume goat meat. One of my christian friends mentioned is that ii is because of hooves and devil symbolism; is there any merit to this argument ? I understand Hindus don't eat beef because of religious reasons and muslims don't eat pork also because of religious reasons. This is a comparison of nutritional value of goat vs. beef vs pork. http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=goat+meat+vs.+beef+vs.+pork http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=goat+meat+vs.+beef+vs.+... . Bon Apetit!

brational 12y ago
That religious thing is a rarity. People don't eat goat because its not really available. I, american, find it delicious but have only ever had it in indian restaurants.
hkarthik 12y ago
At this point in time, the cultural issues around eating goat meat in the west are probably less of a factor and it has more to do with logistics and regulation. The supply chains around industrial factory farming for poultry, beef, and pork are very mature. They've also engaged in regulatory capture for nearly half a century. Many laws and regulations exist which would lock out new sources of meat to the average American consumer. Goat milk and cheese, are becoming more popular, however. So there is a ready supply of livestock. So things could easily change.
digi_owl 12y ago
I suspect it is a matter of taste. As for the pork thing, it is not just muslims. Strictly speaking christians should not touch it either as it is part of the old testament. My personal take on this is that back then someone observed that people that ate pork often ended up sick and died. While we now know that is is because of an illness passed from pig to human, back then it may well have been interpreted as divine punishment. But then those days religion and law was one and the same, and so the declaration of pork as unclean may well be seen as a health and safety regulation. Supposedly you can find passages from nearby cultures that line up very well with the old testament, with one crucial difference. While other cultures makes violations an offense against society, the bible makes them an offense against god. Meaning that what others deemed a social or secular matter, suddenly became religious.

logn 12y ago

Shark Tank season 5, episode 5: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHqBFqh-SIY&t=1340 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHqBFqh-SIY&t=1340

debacle 12y ago

TIL phragmites is an invasive species. An incredibly fun and useful plant, right up there with day lily (also invasive and hardy). Kudzu is beautiful but incredibly destructive.