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The women didn't "allow" anything. They began to speak and their ideas were finished by men, with the rest of the meeting nodding along with them. When there's
by jmagoon 12y ago
The women didn't "allow" anything. They began to speak and their ideas were finished by men, with the rest of the meeting nodding along with them. When there's a female minority and an implicit cultural approval for this type of behavior, it's more than just 'pull yourself up by your ideological bootstraps'. It's easy to say "just do it" when you've never been in an environment that subtly discounts your contributions, no matter how good they are.
It's so irritating that not being gregarious is called mousey, because it's definitely being stated as a knock. As if people can't make excellent contributions without yelling the loudest.
I'm not a woman, and I'm not a minority, but being around my wife (an extremely intelligent, introverted engineer), it's easy to watch the implicit privilege that men use when relating to her. It's easy for them to steal her ideas. She is constantly, constantly challenged by every young man with something to prove, no matter how right she is, no matter how much experience she has in the matter ("Are you sure? Why don't we do it this way?"). It's downright exhausting. If she calls someone out on it, men think of her as "a bitch". If I point it out to them, they often say things like, "Oh wow, I didn't realize I was doing that". Or, they say something defensive like, "Why can't she stand up for herself?"
Sorry for the rant, but this logic is so defeating for actually creating a positive workplace that encourages contributions from everyone, not just 24 year old Messiah-in-training.
- brador 12y agoIn a meeting time is limited. Are you suggesting everyone wait around while she finishes her thought when another person could say it quicker? What your wife needs is not someone white knighting for her (you or this article). She needs to take lessons in assertiveness to build her confidence so she can get her views across and not be ignored from basics like a weak voice or poor posture. It's not rocket science and it's not a huge male conspiracy against women. What is true is women are less likely to be assertive, in life and in the workplace. And that can be fixed. It just won't be easy.
- notacoward 12y ago"Could say it quicker" is an assumption that's part of the problem.
- rgbrenner 12y agoAre you suggesting everyone wait around while she finishes her thought when another person could say it quicker? ... She needs to take lessons in assertiveness to build her confidence so she can get her views across and not be ignored from basics like a weak voice or poor posture How could you possibly know that from what he posted? You're introducing your own conception of her, and attributing things to her that were no where in his post. Her lack of assertiveness, confidence, weak voice, poor posture, etc were created purely in your mind.
- brador 12y agoShe's not speaking up for herself. That's pretty much the definition of lack of assertiveness. Lack of confidence, weak voice, poor posture are highly likely based on my experiences with people who lack assertiveness. I'm not saying I'm right, but it's highly unlikely I'm wrong.
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