5 ms·

I feel like the software really hasn't changed enough for me to feel differently about Apple at all. However the the fact that the hardware is GLUED together a

I feel like the software really hasn't changed enough for me to feel differently about Apple at all. However the the fact that the hardware is GLUED together and non-upgradeable in all models is the thing that has me looking elsewhere. Is anyone else frustrated that their retina machines are completely obsoleted on purpose and that even the minis have memory chips soldered into them for no reason but wasteful planned obsolescence? I think that Apple is going to hit a major backlash when people realize that their memory and hard drives are trapped and limited for no real technical reason.

empthought 12y ago
Unfortunately for tinkerers, these processes allow Apple to produce very small and lightweight hardware. These qualities are more valuable to consumers than tinkerability.
- vinceguidry 12y ago
  Except that they're not needed to get to small and lightweight. Those qualities are driven by the size of components decreasing due to die improvements. So they can stick smaller, better components onto boards every year. Look at enough device tear downs, and you realize that lack of repairability is more about laziness than it is about legitimate tradeoffs.
  - empthought 12y ago
    There are physical limitations on socket sizes and construction that can allow owners to reasonably upgrade the equipment without damaging it. There are design limitations on arranging components in such a way that they can be accessed. Also the majority of users never open their machine; why should they have to pay more so the privileged few can pay a little less for storage and RAM? As someone who has recently assembled a commodity PC (Mini-ITX) and someone who has fiddled with RPi hardware, I can see the disadvantages facing a consumer hardware manufacturer attempting to satisfy a tinkerer's urges. Notebooks, all-in-ones, and Mac Mini-sized desktops are just at the edge of serviceability, and clearly the mobile and tablet product lines are well beyond it.
    - vinceguidry 12y ago
      It's not just tinkerers. If you crack your screen, the glass is generally glued onto the screen, necessitating replacement of the entire display assembly, which isn't all that much cheaper than just buying a new one. They do this on purpose to force people to buy more devices. The only reason they get away with it because we don't force them to take repairability seriously. As someone noted, most customers prefer new devices.
      - empthought 12y ago
        You only need to purchase more devices if you make it a habit to break the ones you have. No one's being forced to do anything in the repairability case.
gress 12y ago
They've been like this for years. Nobody upgrades CPUs in laptops or all in one machines. If a backlash was coming it would have hit by now.
jeremyjh 12y ago
I really doubt most consumers care about glue. They buy a new phone every two years, they won't bat an eyelash about buying a new computer every four years. I think the glue is less about planned obsolescence and more about selling more upgrades up-front, although I doubt even that makes a difference with most of their users. I bought a mini when they first came out and I upgraded the ram myself because it saved like $100; but I suspect this was happening to a single-digit percentage of their minis.

empthought 12y ago

Unfortunately for tinkerers, these processes allow Apple to produce very small and lightweight hardware. These qualities are more valuable to consumers than tinkerability.

vinceguidry 12y ago
Except that they're not needed to get to small and lightweight. Those qualities are driven by the size of components decreasing due to die improvements. So they can stick smaller, better components onto boards every year. Look at enough device tear downs, and you realize that lack of repairability is more about laziness than it is about legitimate tradeoffs.
- empthought 12y ago
  There are physical limitations on socket sizes and construction that can allow owners to reasonably upgrade the equipment without damaging it. There are design limitations on arranging components in such a way that they can be accessed. Also the majority of users never open their machine; why should they have to pay more so the privileged few can pay a little less for storage and RAM? As someone who has recently assembled a commodity PC (Mini-ITX) and someone who has fiddled with RPi hardware, I can see the disadvantages facing a consumer hardware manufacturer attempting to satisfy a tinkerer's urges. Notebooks, all-in-ones, and Mac Mini-sized desktops are just at the edge of serviceability, and clearly the mobile and tablet product lines are well beyond it.
  - vinceguidry 12y ago
    It's not just tinkerers. If you crack your screen, the glass is generally glued onto the screen, necessitating replacement of the entire display assembly, which isn't all that much cheaper than just buying a new one. They do this on purpose to force people to buy more devices. The only reason they get away with it because we don't force them to take repairability seriously. As someone noted, most customers prefer new devices.
    - empthought 12y ago
      You only need to purchase more devices if you make it a habit to break the ones you have. No one's being forced to do anything in the repairability case.

gress 12y ago

They've been like this for years. Nobody upgrades CPUs in laptops or all in one machines. If a backlash was coming it would have hit by now.

jeremyjh 12y ago

I really doubt most consumers care about glue. They buy a new phone every two years, they won't bat an eyelash about buying a new computer every four years. I think the glue is less about planned obsolescence and more about selling more upgrades up-front, although I doubt even that makes a difference with most of their users. I bought a mini when they first came out and I upgraded the ram myself because it saved like $100; but I suspect this was happening to a single-digit percentage of their minis.