9 ms·

Slaves endure 'a living hell' on remote South Korean islands

288 points by mcgwiz 12y ago

ChuckMcM 12y ago
From the article: "Several freed disabled slaves told the AP they will return because they think that even the salt farms are better than life on the streets or in crowded shelters. In some cases, relatives refused to take back the disabled or sent salt farmers letters confirming that they didn't need to pay the workers." If you ever need an example that there is no "government" there is only "us" you can use that one. These are horrific circumstances for the people involved. The solution is for the people in this community to take ownership of the horror and to commit to eradicating it. That means that each of them will either pay with some of their earned income or with their time, and they will take care of these disabled people and feed them and house them. Individually it will be a small sacrifice, but collectively it will give the disabled a way to live outside of slavery. Except they don't. In a democracy, it is run at the whim of the people. When it becomes too corrupt or veers too far from the will of the people who are governed, it is the people who must change it. Sometimes that can be done with voting, sometimes it takes protest, sometimes it requires one give up their own lives. The choice to eject the current government is also a commitment that people share.
- derefr 12y ago
  In this case, though, isn't it precisely the "will of the majority" that this continue? If any other minority were being oppressed, they might revolt, and thus create an economic incentive for the majority to take their needs under consideration—but since this minority is specifically "disabled people", they can't really do much, so the game-theoretic driver of "possible revolt" isn't there.
  - JumpCrisscross 12y ago
    > since this minority is specifically "disabled people", they can't really do much, so the game-theoretic driver of "possible revolt" isn't there In The Better Angels of Our Nature [1] Steven Pinker describes the process by which, in the past, humanity has expanded its "circle of empathy". Children, animals and countless other voiceless minorities have gained rights through this process. One specific process he identified for expanding our collective circles of empathy is the expansion of literacy. "Reading is a technology for perspective-taking. When someone else's thoughts are in your head, you are observing the world from that person's vantage point" [2]. [1] http://www.amazon.com/Better-Angels-Our-Nature-Violence/dp/0143122010/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1420269247&sr=8-1&keywords=better+angels+of+our+nature http://www.amazon.com/Better-Angels-Our-Nature-Violence/dp/0... [2] http://www.theguardian.com/books/2011/nov/01/extract-better-angels-nature-steven-pinker http://www.theguardian.com/books/2011/nov/01/extract-better-...
- nazgulnarsil 12y ago
  Horror persists because we just don't care that much. Especially if it isn't in our face. We will forget about this story tomorrow. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_voter_theorem https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_voter_theorem
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
- danmaz74 12y ago
  Except, it was a police officer that saved this and other slaves. The problem here is exactly the "us" in those islands, that self organized to flaunt Korea's laws. > She brought the letter to Seo Je-gong, a police captain for the Seoul Guro district. "A vanished person had suddenly reappeared," Seo, now retired, told AP. ... > Because Kim's letter noted collaboration between local police and salt farm owners, Seo and another Seoul officer ran a clandestine operation without telling local officials.
- tootie 12y ago
  From your very own quotation, the people are explicitly condoning this. The government is doing a pretty good job of reflecting the will (or lack thereof) of the people. Do you remember in the 70s and 80s that there was a raft of adoptions of Korean orphans in the US and elsewhere? That's because S Korea was still economically depressed and adoption was culturally frowned upon. Kids were abandoned left and right. It was the government that actually took initiative to push public opinion in favor of domestic adoption and it worked.
PhantomGremlin 12y ago
When I was in high school in the '70s, we discussed "Man's inhumanity to man".[1] Things have improved in the last few hundred years (and even in the last 40 years), but clearly we have a ways to go. At least the guy in the article was able to get $35,000 in back wages. At the risk of bringing Godwin's law into the discussion at first post, this is a major improvement over WWII when prison guards gassed Gypsies and Jews during the week, then went to church on Sunday. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man%27s_inhumanity_to_man https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man%27s_inhumanity_to_man
- elpachuco 12y ago
  Godwin's law should be taken out the back and shot along with the person uttering it. Is a lazy form of attempting to neutralize any argument a person makes by simply mentioning Godwin's law.
  - meepmorp 12y ago
    Eh. References or comparisons to Hitler are nearly always a lazy appeal to emotion made because the speaker is unable or unwilling to provide any better way of stating their position. And that kind of argument often gets made as a discussion over a contentious drags on and one side or the other is eager to just "win" the debate. And, of course, you know who else thought people and things should be taken out back and shot...
    - baddox 12y ago
      I'm sure Godwin's law was introduced because of a genuine problem with lazy comparisons to Hitler. That said, any time I want to make a genuine comparison to something Hitler or Nazi Germany did, I have to go out of my why to find some other historical figure who did the same thing, just to avoid wasting time arguing about whether a comparison Hitler invalidates my argument.
  - lotsofmangos 12y ago
    Are you saying Godwin's Law is now recursive?
kiba 12y ago
Weird to be reading something like this in a modern liberal society in this day and age.
- dkarapetyan 12y ago
  How is Korean culture liberal? Maybe you mean consumerist?
  - fixedd 12y ago
    kiba said "in a liberal society" not "about a liberal society".
    - vacri 12y ago
      The intention was 'about', because we read about stuff like this all the time in places like North Korea; it's hardly weird at all.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
  - anigbrowl 12y ago
    It's South Korea, not North Korea.
    - renekooi 12y ago
      South Korea doesn't quite fit the "liberal" label either. It's a technologically advanced country, but a socially conservative one.
      - hackerboos 12y ago
        Hierarchy similar to Japan although as you say, more socially and economically conservative. Korea is a young democracy though - it's only had free and fair elections since 1987. Pretty much under military rule and dictatorships since 1945.
curiously 12y ago
man this region of Korea as a whole always have these stories popping up. Unlike the rest of the Korea South western part of Korea is economically undeveloped as a result of the political elite being from South Eastern region which benefit tremendously (namely Hyundai and other big companies creating large amount of jobs). Allegedly there exists a couple millenia old feud between Koreans from these two regions of West and East. People from West and East don't marry each other or do business together. Much of Korea's online communities show extreme hatred for people from South West region of Korea.
- w1ntermute 12y ago
  > Much of Korea's online communities show extreme hatred for people from South West region of Korea. One major reason for this is the Gwangju Uprising[0]. 0: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gwangju_Uprising http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gwangju_Uprising
  - curiously 12y ago
    Yes in particular it's viewed as a pro-communist armed revolt from a region that has not received any of benefit from Korea's rising economy. It's a controversial topic in Korea and views are divided. It's interesting to note that the special force soldiers specifically from South East region were handpicked to carry out merciless beatings and killings.
    - yongjik 12y ago
      Oh for fuck's sake, shut the fuck up. The only people who say the uprising of Gwangju is a pro-communist revolt are super-extreme-right-wing (even by Korea's standard) shitheads who can't tell their ass from their mouth. Sometimes they make pretty noises when the court fines them for slandering those who died in Gwangju. (Even our largely conservative court decided these idiots are not worth the rice they eat.) "It's a controversial topic in Korea and views are divided"? Jesus Christ. (Well, just in case anyone's wondering if I'm parroting one side's argument, the "leftists" like me aren't immune to idiotic arguments from time to time. Decades ago it used to be popular to suggest that the US might have provoked the North Korea into starting the Korean War. Of course, the fall of Soviet Union and the release of tons of documents put an end to that line of thought. We're dealing with that level of reality distortion field here.)
rory096 12y ago
Reminds me of the Iowa/South Carolina turkey plant scandal the NY Times broke last year. http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/03/09/us/the-boys-in-the-bunkhouse.html http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/03/09/us/the-boys-in... http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/07/us/separated-from-brother-left-to-toil-far-from-home.html http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/07/us/separated-from-brother-...
- harryjo 12y ago
  I'd love another source for this story, with the information presented clearly and not in the unreadable gonzo NYT style.
  - mbrubeck 12y ago
    Another source on the original investigation: http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090208/NEWS/902080343/1001 http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090208/NEWS/90208... http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090208/NEWS/902080344/1001 http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090208/NEWS/90208... http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090209/NEWS10/902090323 http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090209/NEWS10/902... http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090209/NEWS10/902090324 http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090209/NEWS10/902...
- chaostheory 12y ago
  There's this one as well: http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14142/bulls_hit_farm_labor_scandal_targets_florida_homeless http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14142/bulls_hit_farm_l... And this one: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/06/05/119393/-Slavery-in-Florida-on-Jeb-s-Watch-Ignoring-Published-Reports-He-Permits-it-to-Continue http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/06/05/119393/-Slavery-in-... I'm pretty sure there are even older reports done in the 90s and 80s It's sad that even though we're in the 21st century, slavery still exists... in our own country. I'm not even counting forced prostitution. http://www.globalslaveryindex.org/ http://www.globalslaveryindex.org/
- nihaody 12y ago
  Yeah except when the US government found out, they pressed criminal charges against the people running the plant, and there was public outrage, outcry, and domestic media coverage. But other than that, yeah it's the same thing.
UXDork 12y ago
This is awful :(
briantakita 12y ago
> Sinan County has more than 850 salt farms that produce two-thirds of South Korea's sea salt. To make money, however, farmers need labor, lots of it and cheap. Around half of Sinui Island's 2,200 people work in salt farming, according to a county website and officials. Sadly, this is the underbelly of consumerist abstraction. Unpaid Slaves, wage slaves, salary slaves living unhealthy lives; where those without voice are scorned. Mere abstractions. This makes me think of the article "5 Studies that Show How Wealth Warps Your Soul". http://www.alternet.org/economy/5-studies-show-how-wealth-warps-your-soul http://www.alternet.org/economy/5-studies-show-how-wealth-wa... --- I'm willing to take the downvotes, if it leads to someone connecting the dots; looking beyond ideology. It's easy to blame the perpetrators. However, we all live in the same system & our choices influence many. It's time to stop passing the buck. This story is too common.
- yummyfajitas 12y ago
  I'll explain why I downvoted you. You are deliberately conflating slavery like what is described in this article (e.g. where attempts to quit result in being beaten with a rake), and voluntary work situations which fall short of some hypothetical ideal (i.e., "wage slavery", where slaves are free to quit if they wish). As a result of such hyperbole, it's often difficult for news consumers to tell whether a problem is real, or whether it's just activists making stuff up.
  - icegreentea 12y ago
    Except that the term wage slavery is typically used in situations where the worker is either already in debt, or on the edge of debt. Obviously situations change depending on time, place, and the particular social conditions, but typically, when you use the term 'wage slavery', the implication is a situation where yes, technically the worker has the ability to quit their job whenever they want, but practically, they don't. There surely is a distinction between even those forms of wage slavery and out right chattel slavery (or whatever), but the distinction isn't nearly as great, nor really, from a human stand point, really all that different. This is especially true the more 'brutal' the wage slavery gets. Put it another way. Imagine you simply magically eliminated all forms of chattel slavery, but then immediately put all those magically freed ex-slaves in deep debt to their ex-owners (with heavy interest), and left them just as socially isolated as they are right now, and then gave them a chance to either take their chances and try to find a job somewhere else, or let them work off their debts to their ex-owners. Are they in a better position than they were before? Yes. Are they in anything remotely close to a good position? No.
Johnny_Brahms 12y ago
For those of you who read German there was an article about what I even to this day would call wage slavery in German slaughterhouses in die Zeit. A quite interesting view of the backside of the industry's (in this case meat industry) search for cheap labour: http://www.zeit.de/2014/51/schlachthof-niedersachsen-fleischwirtschaft-ausbeutung-arbeiter/seite-3 http://www.zeit.de/2014/51/schlachthof-niedersachsen-fleisch...
- asymmetric 12y ago
  And you can also take a nice look at how Amazon operates: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/amazon-used-neonazi-guards-to-keep-immigrant-workforce-under-control-in-germany-8495843.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/amazon-used-n... Here's the short documentary: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdrkY_NpgrY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdrkY_NpgrY
  - asymmetric 12y ago
    Why the downvote?
chaostheory 12y ago
We need to treat the mentally disabled better. S Korea is bad, but just looking at places like SF (I feel that most of the homeless have mental issues here); it feels that we're not doing a great job either. The obvious solution is that mental hospitals need more funding. However where will they get that money from? Is there another more optimal solution that doesn't require as much money? EDIT: I guess we're not that different http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14142/bulls_hit_farm_labor_scandal_targets_florida_homeless http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14142/bulls_hit_farm_l... http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/06/05/119393/-Slavery-in-Florida-on-Jeb-s-Watch-Ignoring-Published-Reports-He-Permits-it-to-Continue http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/06/05/119393/-Slavery-in-... http://www.globalslaveryindex.org/ http://www.globalslaveryindex.org/
- tim333 12y ago
  I'm not sure you have to go as far a mental hospitals. If you just build half decent government funded accommodation it deals with a lot of the problem. Plus maybe the odd visitor to help them fill forms etc if they are not capable of doing that. It surprises me that the US doesn't do more of that.
  - dba7dba 12y ago
    A certain past US administration got rid of mental institutions by denying funding, which in turn dramatically increased # of homeless in US.
    - ninguem2 12y ago
      A lot of shit is still trickling down from that.
      - TheCondor 12y ago
        A lot of bad shit was stopped by shutting those places down too.
        12y ago
beloch 12y ago
Some will forget what the government of South Korea chooses to ignore. Some will not. In my books, tolerance of chattel slavery by a democratically elected government earns the voters of that country a boycott. It's not easy to avoid everything that contains parts by the likes of Hyundai and Samsung (Yes, that still includes Apple), but an honest effort by enough people might just make a difference.
- dba7dba 12y ago
  Are you not reading other comments in this thread that talk about similar slavery in some places in US and Germany?
  - madaxe_again 12y ago
    No. Only Korea has slaves. Korea bad.
    - dba7dba 12y ago
      No, I think you r bad. Not knowing how to participate in this forum.
zo1 12y ago
I see lots of people are mentioning other instances of slavery that this reminds them of. Well, here's one that's rampant, well-known, and persists right now: http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/08/16/robert-fulford-slaverys-modern-face-in-the-middle-east/ http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/08/16/robert-fulfor... I picked the newest "story" link I could find for it. There are countless articles and news stories about it, with whatever level of bias you wish or don't; you can google for it.
annand_virk 12y ago
Not sure what makes me feel worse, the fact that this shit still happens or the fact that I didn't know it did... EDIT: *that this shit still happens so close to "civilization"
madaxe_again 12y ago
This is no revelation - Asia is rife with slavery and indentured servitude. That friendly Bhutanese waiter? Slave. That Philippino maid? Slave? That stripper in Macau? Dead slave by now. More curious is why Stars and Stripes is running this now - did they confuse which Korea they were meant to be teaching their troops to hate?
- madaxe_again 12y ago
  Downvotes for pointing out obvious agitprop, and that this is a far broader issue? Ok then. America #1. Go USA. I can only think you're wilfully blinkering yourselves, or someone deemed this comment not helpful to America's political cause? Go read about the fine art of squid fishing, and the makeup of the crews who man those brigs. It's not just Korea. Fuck, there are slaves (honest to god slaves) in the UK.
ada1981 12y ago
How can hackers help? How might we create new technology to eradicate this? How might we create tech to empower the slaves? I'd love for us to begin using our brainpower and super powers to dismantle these power structures instead of the next "uber for x" app.
- oldmanjay 12y ago
  hubris isn't a super power
  - ada1981 12y ago
    Not exactly sure what you mean here.. By super power I was referring to creativity, coding skills, ability to solve problems,etc.
- danielharan 12y ago
  One way might just be to find a more cost-effective way to make that same salt, and put those farmers out of business. A hack might be to use drones to run surveillance on those places. The longer-term and stable solution is to have governments or community to care for those people so they are not homeless and vulnerable.
  - ada1981 12y ago
    Yes. Perhaps inventing a technology that would eliminate the need for slaves and selling it to the farmers at a price point below the cost of slaves. Also, perhaps a salt farm that was operated by the homeless, set up as a social enterprise and branded as such. Since this seems to be a luxury item, the increased price and status could be desirable.
    - toomuchtodo 12y ago
      Create automation to produce the salt, organize a B Corp [+], use any profits from the production to support the homeless and mentally ill. [+] http://www.bcorporation.net/ http://www.bcorporation.net/
digi_owl 12y ago
A reminder that the Korean peninsula is pretty much the cold war in caricature, and still ongoing...
tomwhipple 12y ago
It seems to me that we should be talking about sanctions & boycotts of Korean products. An obvious first place to start is the products produced by slave labor. But I think it's reasonable to extend a boycott to the rest of an economy that is turning a blind eye to such atrocities. So think about the plight of these slaves considering a purchase of Samsung, Mitsubishi, Kia, or other items built in Korea or owned by Korean companies. Then buy something else.
known 12y ago
Types of slavery prevalent https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery#Types https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery#Types

288 points by mcgwiz 12y ago

From the article: "Several freed disabled slaves told the AP they will return because they think that even the salt farms are better than life on the streets or in crowded shelters. In some cases, relatives refused to take back the disabled or sent salt farmers letters confirming that they didn't need to pay the workers." If you ever need an example that there is no "government" there is only "us" you can use that one. These are horrific circumstances for the people involved. The solution is for the people in this community to take ownership of the horror and to commit to eradicating it. That means that each of them will either pay with some of their earned income or with their time, and they will take care of these disabled people and feed them and house them. Individually it will be a small sacrifice, but collectively it will give the disabled a way to live outside of slavery. Except they don't. In a democracy, it is run at the whim of the people. When it becomes too corrupt or veers too far from the will of the people who are governed, it is the people who must change it. Sometimes that can be done with voting, sometimes it takes protest, sometimes it requires one give up their own lives. The choice to eject the current government is also a commitment that people share.

derefr 12y ago
In this case, though, isn't it precisely the "will of the majority" that this continue? If any other minority were being oppressed, they might revolt, and thus create an economic incentive for the majority to take their needs under consideration—but since this minority is specifically "disabled people", they can't really do much, so the game-theoretic driver of "possible revolt" isn't there.
- JumpCrisscross 12y ago
  > since this minority is specifically "disabled people", they can't really do much, so the game-theoretic driver of "possible revolt" isn't there In The Better Angels of Our Nature [1] Steven Pinker describes the process by which, in the past, humanity has expanded its "circle of empathy". Children, animals and countless other voiceless minorities have gained rights through this process. One specific process he identified for expanding our collective circles of empathy is the expansion of literacy. "Reading is a technology for perspective-taking. When someone else's thoughts are in your head, you are observing the world from that person's vantage point" [2]. [1] http://www.amazon.com/Better-Angels-Our-Nature-Violence/dp/0143122010/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1420269247&sr=8-1&keywords=better+angels+of+our+nature http://www.amazon.com/Better-Angels-Our-Nature-Violence/dp/0... [2] http://www.theguardian.com/books/2011/nov/01/extract-better-angels-nature-steven-pinker http://www.theguardian.com/books/2011/nov/01/extract-better-...
nazgulnarsil 12y ago
Horror persists because we just don't care that much. Especially if it isn't in our face. We will forget about this story tomorrow. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_voter_theorem https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_voter_theorem
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
danmaz74 12y ago
Except, it was a police officer that saved this and other slaves. The problem here is exactly the "us" in those islands, that self organized to flaunt Korea's laws. > She brought the letter to Seo Je-gong, a police captain for the Seoul Guro district. "A vanished person had suddenly reappeared," Seo, now retired, told AP. ... > Because Kim's letter noted collaboration between local police and salt farm owners, Seo and another Seoul officer ran a clandestine operation without telling local officials.
tootie 12y ago
From your very own quotation, the people are explicitly condoning this. The government is doing a pretty good job of reflecting the will (or lack thereof) of the people. Do you remember in the 70s and 80s that there was a raft of adoptions of Korean orphans in the US and elsewhere? That's because S Korea was still economically depressed and adoption was culturally frowned upon. Kids were abandoned left and right. It was the government that actually took initiative to push public opinion in favor of domestic adoption and it worked.

PhantomGremlin 12y ago

When I was in high school in the '70s, we discussed "Man's inhumanity to man".[1] Things have improved in the last few hundred years (and even in the last 40 years), but clearly we have a ways to go. At least the guy in the article was able to get $35,000 in back wages. At the risk of bringing Godwin's law into the discussion at first post, this is a major improvement over WWII when prison guards gassed Gypsies and Jews during the week, then went to church on Sunday. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man%27s_inhumanity_to_man https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man%27s_inhumanity_to_man

elpachuco 12y ago
Godwin's law should be taken out the back and shot along with the person uttering it. Is a lazy form of attempting to neutralize any argument a person makes by simply mentioning Godwin's law.
- meepmorp 12y ago
  Eh. References or comparisons to Hitler are nearly always a lazy appeal to emotion made because the speaker is unable or unwilling to provide any better way of stating their position. And that kind of argument often gets made as a discussion over a contentious drags on and one side or the other is eager to just "win" the debate. And, of course, you know who else thought people and things should be taken out back and shot...
  - baddox 12y ago
    I'm sure Godwin's law was introduced because of a genuine problem with lazy comparisons to Hitler. That said, any time I want to make a genuine comparison to something Hitler or Nazi Germany did, I have to go out of my why to find some other historical figure who did the same thing, just to avoid wasting time arguing about whether a comparison Hitler invalidates my argument.
- lotsofmangos 12y ago
  Are you saying Godwin's Law is now recursive?

kiba 12y ago

Weird to be reading something like this in a modern liberal society in this day and age.

dkarapetyan 12y ago
How is Korean culture liberal? Maybe you mean consumerist?
- fixedd 12y ago
  kiba said "in a liberal society" not "about a liberal society".
  - vacri 12y ago
    The intention was 'about', because we read about stuff like this all the time in places like North Korea; it's hardly weird at all.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- anigbrowl 12y ago
  It's South Korea, not North Korea.
  - renekooi 12y ago
    South Korea doesn't quite fit the "liberal" label either. It's a technologically advanced country, but a socially conservative one.
    - hackerboos 12y ago
      Hierarchy similar to Japan although as you say, more socially and economically conservative. Korea is a young democracy though - it's only had free and fair elections since 1987. Pretty much under military rule and dictatorships since 1945.

curiously 12y ago

man this region of Korea as a whole always have these stories popping up. Unlike the rest of the Korea South western part of Korea is economically undeveloped as a result of the political elite being from South Eastern region which benefit tremendously (namely Hyundai and other big companies creating large amount of jobs). Allegedly there exists a couple millenia old feud between Koreans from these two regions of West and East. People from West and East don't marry each other or do business together. Much of Korea's online communities show extreme hatred for people from South West region of Korea.

w1ntermute 12y ago
> Much of Korea's online communities show extreme hatred for people from South West region of Korea. One major reason for this is the Gwangju Uprising[0]. 0: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gwangju_Uprising http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gwangju_Uprising
- curiously 12y ago
  Yes in particular it's viewed as a pro-communist armed revolt from a region that has not received any of benefit from Korea's rising economy. It's a controversial topic in Korea and views are divided. It's interesting to note that the special force soldiers specifically from South East region were handpicked to carry out merciless beatings and killings.
  - yongjik 12y ago
    Oh for fuck's sake, shut the fuck up. The only people who say the uprising of Gwangju is a pro-communist revolt are super-extreme-right-wing (even by Korea's standard) shitheads who can't tell their ass from their mouth. Sometimes they make pretty noises when the court fines them for slandering those who died in Gwangju. (Even our largely conservative court decided these idiots are not worth the rice they eat.) "It's a controversial topic in Korea and views are divided"? Jesus Christ. (Well, just in case anyone's wondering if I'm parroting one side's argument, the "leftists" like me aren't immune to idiotic arguments from time to time. Decades ago it used to be popular to suggest that the US might have provoked the North Korea into starting the Korean War. Of course, the fall of Soviet Union and the release of tons of documents put an end to that line of thought. We're dealing with that level of reality distortion field here.)

rory096 12y ago

Reminds me of the Iowa/South Carolina turkey plant scandal the NY Times broke last year. http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/03/09/us/the-boys-in-the-bunkhouse.html http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/03/09/us/the-boys-in... http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/07/us/separated-from-brother-left-to-toil-far-from-home.html http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/07/us/separated-from-brother-...

harryjo 12y ago
I'd love another source for this story, with the information presented clearly and not in the unreadable gonzo NYT style.
- mbrubeck 12y ago
  Another source on the original investigation: http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090208/NEWS/902080343/1001 http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090208/NEWS/90208... http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090208/NEWS/902080344/1001 http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090208/NEWS/90208... http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090209/NEWS10/902090323 http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090209/NEWS10/902... http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090209/NEWS10/902090324 http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20090209/NEWS10/902...
chaostheory 12y ago
There's this one as well: http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14142/bulls_hit_farm_labor_scandal_targets_florida_homeless http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14142/bulls_hit_farm_l... And this one: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/06/05/119393/-Slavery-in-Florida-on-Jeb-s-Watch-Ignoring-Published-Reports-He-Permits-it-to-Continue http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/06/05/119393/-Slavery-in-... I'm pretty sure there are even older reports done in the 90s and 80s It's sad that even though we're in the 21st century, slavery still exists... in our own country. I'm not even counting forced prostitution. http://www.globalslaveryindex.org/ http://www.globalslaveryindex.org/
nihaody 12y ago
Yeah except when the US government found out, they pressed criminal charges against the people running the plant, and there was public outrage, outcry, and domestic media coverage. But other than that, yeah it's the same thing.

UXDork 12y ago

This is awful :(

briantakita 12y ago

> Sinan County has more than 850 salt farms that produce two-thirds of South Korea's sea salt. To make money, however, farmers need labor, lots of it and cheap. Around half of Sinui Island's 2,200 people work in salt farming, according to a county website and officials. Sadly, this is the underbelly of consumerist abstraction. Unpaid Slaves, wage slaves, salary slaves living unhealthy lives; where those without voice are scorned. Mere abstractions. This makes me think of the article "5 Studies that Show How Wealth Warps Your Soul". http://www.alternet.org/economy/5-studies-show-how-wealth-warps-your-soul http://www.alternet.org/economy/5-studies-show-how-wealth-wa... --- I'm willing to take the downvotes, if it leads to someone connecting the dots; looking beyond ideology. It's easy to blame the perpetrators. However, we all live in the same system & our choices influence many. It's time to stop passing the buck. This story is too common.

yummyfajitas 12y ago
I'll explain why I downvoted you. You are deliberately conflating slavery like what is described in this article (e.g. where attempts to quit result in being beaten with a rake), and voluntary work situations which fall short of some hypothetical ideal (i.e., "wage slavery", where slaves are free to quit if they wish). As a result of such hyperbole, it's often difficult for news consumers to tell whether a problem is real, or whether it's just activists making stuff up.
- icegreentea 12y ago
  Except that the term wage slavery is typically used in situations where the worker is either already in debt, or on the edge of debt. Obviously situations change depending on time, place, and the particular social conditions, but typically, when you use the term 'wage slavery', the implication is a situation where yes, technically the worker has the ability to quit their job whenever they want, but practically, they don't. There surely is a distinction between even those forms of wage slavery and out right chattel slavery (or whatever), but the distinction isn't nearly as great, nor really, from a human stand point, really all that different. This is especially true the more 'brutal' the wage slavery gets. Put it another way. Imagine you simply magically eliminated all forms of chattel slavery, but then immediately put all those magically freed ex-slaves in deep debt to their ex-owners (with heavy interest), and left them just as socially isolated as they are right now, and then gave them a chance to either take their chances and try to find a job somewhere else, or let them work off their debts to their ex-owners. Are they in a better position than they were before? Yes. Are they in anything remotely close to a good position? No.

Johnny_Brahms 12y ago

For those of you who read German there was an article about what I even to this day would call wage slavery in German slaughterhouses in die Zeit. A quite interesting view of the backside of the industry's (in this case meat industry) search for cheap labour: http://www.zeit.de/2014/51/schlachthof-niedersachsen-fleischwirtschaft-ausbeutung-arbeiter/seite-3 http://www.zeit.de/2014/51/schlachthof-niedersachsen-fleisch...

asymmetric 12y ago
And you can also take a nice look at how Amazon operates: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/amazon-used-neonazi-guards-to-keep-immigrant-workforce-under-control-in-germany-8495843.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/amazon-used-n... Here's the short documentary: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdrkY_NpgrY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdrkY_NpgrY
- asymmetric 12y ago
  Why the downvote?

chaostheory 12y ago

We need to treat the mentally disabled better. S Korea is bad, but just looking at places like SF (I feel that most of the homeless have mental issues here); it feels that we're not doing a great job either. The obvious solution is that mental hospitals need more funding. However where will they get that money from? Is there another more optimal solution that doesn't require as much money? EDIT: I guess we're not that different http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14142/bulls_hit_farm_labor_scandal_targets_florida_homeless http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14142/bulls_hit_farm_l... http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/06/05/119393/-Slavery-in-Florida-on-Jeb-s-Watch-Ignoring-Published-Reports-He-Permits-it-to-Continue http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/06/05/119393/-Slavery-in-... http://www.globalslaveryindex.org/ http://www.globalslaveryindex.org/

tim333 12y ago
I'm not sure you have to go as far a mental hospitals. If you just build half decent government funded accommodation it deals with a lot of the problem. Plus maybe the odd visitor to help them fill forms etc if they are not capable of doing that. It surprises me that the US doesn't do more of that.
- dba7dba 12y ago
  A certain past US administration got rid of mental institutions by denying funding, which in turn dramatically increased # of homeless in US.
  - ninguem2 12y ago
    A lot of shit is still trickling down from that.
    - TheCondor 12y ago
      A lot of bad shit was stopped by shutting those places down too.
      - 12y ago

beloch 12y ago

Some will forget what the government of South Korea chooses to ignore. Some will not. In my books, tolerance of chattel slavery by a democratically elected government earns the voters of that country a boycott. It's not easy to avoid everything that contains parts by the likes of Hyundai and Samsung (Yes, that still includes Apple), but an honest effort by enough people might just make a difference.

dba7dba 12y ago
Are you not reading other comments in this thread that talk about similar slavery in some places in US and Germany?
- madaxe_again 12y ago
  No. Only Korea has slaves. Korea bad.
  - dba7dba 12y ago
    No, I think you r bad. Not knowing how to participate in this forum.

zo1 12y ago

I see lots of people are mentioning other instances of slavery that this reminds them of. Well, here's one that's rampant, well-known, and persists right now: http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/08/16/robert-fulford-slaverys-modern-face-in-the-middle-east/ http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/08/16/robert-fulfor... I picked the newest "story" link I could find for it. There are countless articles and news stories about it, with whatever level of bias you wish or don't; you can google for it.

annand_virk 12y ago

Not sure what makes me feel worse, the fact that this shit still happens or the fact that I didn't know it did... EDIT: *that this shit still happens so close to "civilization"

madaxe_again 12y ago

This is no revelation - Asia is rife with slavery and indentured servitude. That friendly Bhutanese waiter? Slave. That Philippino maid? Slave? That stripper in Macau? Dead slave by now. More curious is why Stars and Stripes is running this now - did they confuse which Korea they were meant to be teaching their troops to hate?

madaxe_again 12y ago
Downvotes for pointing out obvious agitprop, and that this is a far broader issue? Ok then. America #1. Go USA. I can only think you're wilfully blinkering yourselves, or someone deemed this comment not helpful to America's political cause? Go read about the fine art of squid fishing, and the makeup of the crews who man those brigs. It's not just Korea. Fuck, there are slaves (honest to god slaves) in the UK.

ada1981 12y ago

How can hackers help? How might we create new technology to eradicate this? How might we create tech to empower the slaves? I'd love for us to begin using our brainpower and super powers to dismantle these power structures instead of the next "uber for x" app.

oldmanjay 12y ago
hubris isn't a super power
- ada1981 12y ago
  Not exactly sure what you mean here.. By super power I was referring to creativity, coding skills, ability to solve problems,etc.
danielharan 12y ago
One way might just be to find a more cost-effective way to make that same salt, and put those farmers out of business. A hack might be to use drones to run surveillance on those places. The longer-term and stable solution is to have governments or community to care for those people so they are not homeless and vulnerable.
- ada1981 12y ago
  Yes. Perhaps inventing a technology that would eliminate the need for slaves and selling it to the farmers at a price point below the cost of slaves. Also, perhaps a salt farm that was operated by the homeless, set up as a social enterprise and branded as such. Since this seems to be a luxury item, the increased price and status could be desirable.
  - toomuchtodo 12y ago
    Create automation to produce the salt, organize a B Corp [+], use any profits from the production to support the homeless and mentally ill. [+] http://www.bcorporation.net/ http://www.bcorporation.net/

digi_owl 12y ago

A reminder that the Korean peninsula is pretty much the cold war in caricature, and still ongoing...

tomwhipple 12y ago

It seems to me that we should be talking about sanctions & boycotts of Korean products. An obvious first place to start is the products produced by slave labor. But I think it's reasonable to extend a boycott to the rest of an economy that is turning a blind eye to such atrocities. So think about the plight of these slaves considering a purchase of Samsung, Mitsubishi, Kia, or other items built in Korea or owned by Korean companies. Then buy something else.

known 12y ago

Types of slavery prevalent https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery#Types https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery#Types