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I disagree. Public opinion polls clearly show that the younger generation is more intolerant of the NSA mass surveillance[0][1], for example. Sometimes the dif

by desdiv 12y ago

I disagree. Public opinion polls clearly show that the younger generation is more intolerant of the NSA mass surveillance[0][1], for example. Sometimes the difference can be startling: Once again, there was a significant relationship between age group and support for monitoring everyone’s online activity. Only 15% of Canadians aged 18 to 29 believed that the Canadian government should monitor online activities if officials say it might prevent future terrorist attacks compared with 34% of those aged 30 to 44 and 43% for those aged 45 to 59.[2] That's almost a three fold difference between the 18 to 29 group and the 45 to 59 group. [0] http://www.people-press.org/2013/06/10/majority-views-nsa-phone-tracking-as-acceptable-anti-terror-tactic/ http://www.people-press.org/2013/06/10/majority-views-nsa-ph... [1] http://www.people-press.org/2013/06/17/public-split-over-impact-of-nsa-leak-but-most-want-snowden-prosecuted/ http://www.people-press.org/2013/06/17/public-split-over-imp... [2] http://abacusinsider.com/politics-public-affairs/nsa-snowden-canadians-terrorism-online-privacy/ http://abacusinsider.com/politics-public-affairs/nsa-snowden...

thaumaturgy 12y ago
Thanks for the studies. That's good news. I'd nitpick though that there's a substantial difference between "government surveillance to stop terrorism" and "volunteer my personal information everywhere because I get cool things for it". For instance, most Snapchat users are between the ages of 13 and 25 (according to http://www.businessinsider.com/a-primer-on-snapchat-and-its-demographics-2014-7 http://www.businessinsider.com/a-primer-on-snapchat-and-its-...).
- desdiv 12y ago
  most Snapchat users are between the ages of 13 and 25 Isn't that an argument for the younger generation being more privacy-conscious? I.e. that they're willing to forgo the convenience of a message history in exchange for more privacy in their communications?
  - thaumaturgy 12y ago
    No. Snapchat has been under fire from several directions for a while for promising more privacy than was actually provided. They had a major account leak, there have been applications for a while that can save received photos, they got a pretty poor privacy review from the EFF... Being privacy-conscious would have to include caring at least a little bit about privacy-related news (and not just Snowden-related). sigh Maybe we're struggling a bit here because privacy can mean so many different things in different contexts. There's privacy from parents. That's something that I think young people have cared about for a long time, and that's not likely to change soon. So, Snapchat is popular. There's privacy from the government. This situation is harder to read because there are a lot of nuances. You can be politically opposed to a government spying on its own citizens without necessarily caring about personal privacy; if you distrust your government, then politically you're resistant to giving it more powers, even if you don't see how those powers might be abused. And then there's personal privacy: control over who owns information about you and what they can do with it, and that doesn't seem to be getting very much traction in younger markets. There certainly hasn't been a revolt against online services (http://www.forbes.com/sites/gyro/2014/01/09/forbes-where-are-teens-hanging-out-in-2014-hint-its-not-facebook/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/gyro/2014/01/09/forbes-where-are...), even post-Snowden, even after it's generally accepted that the business model for each of those services is to gather as much personal information about their users as possible.
    - Intermernet 12y ago
      I think the problem here, that will catch other online providers, is that snapchat's success is still based on the flawed presumption that it's actually private (by any of your definitions). Hopefully the realization that these services aren't as private as advertized will have a ripple effect in the "younger markets", but I doubt it.
deleted 12y ago
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by desdiv 12y ago

thaumaturgy 12y ago

Thanks for the studies. That's good news. I'd nitpick though that there's a substantial difference between "government surveillance to stop terrorism" and "volunteer my personal information everywhere because I get cool things for it". For instance, most Snapchat users are between the ages of 13 and 25 (according to http://www.businessinsider.com/a-primer-on-snapchat-and-its-demographics-2014-7 http://www.businessinsider.com/a-primer-on-snapchat-and-its-...).

desdiv 12y ago
most Snapchat users are between the ages of 13 and 25 Isn't that an argument for the younger generation being more privacy-conscious? I.e. that they're willing to forgo the convenience of a message history in exchange for more privacy in their communications?
- thaumaturgy 12y ago
  No. Snapchat has been under fire from several directions for a while for promising more privacy than was actually provided. They had a major account leak, there have been applications for a while that can save received photos, they got a pretty poor privacy review from the EFF... Being privacy-conscious would have to include caring at least a little bit about privacy-related news (and not just Snowden-related). sigh Maybe we're struggling a bit here because privacy can mean so many different things in different contexts. There's privacy from parents. That's something that I think young people have cared about for a long time, and that's not likely to change soon. So, Snapchat is popular. There's privacy from the government. This situation is harder to read because there are a lot of nuances. You can be politically opposed to a government spying on its own citizens without necessarily caring about personal privacy; if you distrust your government, then politically you're resistant to giving it more powers, even if you don't see how those powers might be abused. And then there's personal privacy: control over who owns information about you and what they can do with it, and that doesn't seem to be getting very much traction in younger markets. There certainly hasn't been a revolt against online services (http://www.forbes.com/sites/gyro/2014/01/09/forbes-where-are-teens-hanging-out-in-2014-hint-its-not-facebook/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/gyro/2014/01/09/forbes-where-are...), even post-Snowden, even after it's generally accepted that the business model for each of those services is to gather as much personal information about their users as possible.
  - Intermernet 12y ago
    I think the problem here, that will catch other online providers, is that snapchat's success is still based on the flawed presumption that it's actually private (by any of your definitions). Hopefully the realization that these services aren't as private as advertized will have a ripple effect in the "younger markets", but I doubt it.

deleted 12y ago

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